• NOVEMBER 20, 2009
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Saigon 2009

Afghanistan is today's Vietnam. No question mark needed.

BY THOMAS H. JOHNSON, M. CHRIS MASON | AUGUST 20, 2009

For those who say that comparing the current war in Afghanistan to the Vietnam War is taking things too far, here's a reality check: It's not taking things far enough. From the origins of these North-South conflicts to the role of insurgents and the pointlessness of this week's Afghan presidential elections, it's impossible to ignore the similarities between these wars. The places and faces may have changed but the enemy is old and familiar. The sooner the United States recognizes this, the sooner it can stop making the same mistakes in Afghanistan.

Even at first glance the structural parallels alone are sobering. Both Vietnam and Afghanistan (prior to the U.S. engagement there) had surprisingly defeated a European power in a guerrilla war that lasted a decade, followed by a largely north-south civil war which lasted another decade. Insurgents in both countries enjoyed the advantage of a long, trackless, and uncloseable border and sanctuary beyond it, where they maintained absolute political control. Both were land wars in Asia with logistics lines more than 9,000 miles long and extremely harsh terrain with few roads, which nullified U.S. advantages in ground mobility and artillery. Other key contributing factors bear a striking resemblance: Almost exactly 80 percent of the population of both countries was rural, and literacy hovered around 10 percent.

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In both countries, the United States sought to create an indigenous army modeled in its own image, based on U.S. army organization charts. With the ARVN in South Vietnam and the ANA in today's Afghanistan, assignment of personnel as combat advisors and mentors was the absolute lowest priority. And in both wars, the  U.S. military grossly misled the American people about the size of the indigenous force over a protracted period. In Afghanistan, for example, the U.S. military touts 91,000 ANA soldiers as "trained and equipped," knowing full well that barely 39,000 are still in the ranks and present for duty.

The United States consistently and profoundly misunderstood the nature of the enemy it was fighting in each circumstance. In Vietnam, the United States insisted on fighting a war against communism, while the enemy was fighting a war of national reunification. In Afghanistan, the United States still insists on fighting a secular counterinsurgency, while the enemy is fighting a jihad. The intersection of how insurgencies end and how jihads end is nil. It's hard to defeat an enemy you don't understand, and in Afghanistan, as in Vietnam, this fight is being played out in a different war.

This is but the tip of the iceberg of a long list of remarkable parallels. What's really startling are the deeper strategic connections. The United States lost the war in Vietnam, historical revisionism notwithstanding, because of a fatal nexus of political and military failure, and the exact same thing is happening in Afghanistan. As Andrew Krepinevich noted many years ago, the army failed in Vietnam because it insisted on fighting a war of maneuver to "find, fix, and destroy" the enemy (with what became known as "search and destroy missions") instead of protecting the people in the villages. Today these tactics are called "sweep and clear missions," but they are in essence the same thing -- clearing tiny patches of ground for short periods in a big country in hopes of killing enough enemy to make him quit.  But its manpower pool was not North Vietnam's Achilles heel and neither is it the Taliban's. Almost exactly the same percentage of personnel in Afghanistan has rural reconstruction as its primary mission (the Provincial Reconstruction Teams) as had "pacification" (today's "nation-building") as their primary mission in Vietnam, about 4 percent. The other 96 percent is engaged in chasing illiterate teenage boys with guns around the countryside, exactly what the enemy wants us to do. 

Meanwhile the political failure in Kabul is Saigon déjà vu. A government that is seen as legitimate by 85 or 90 percent of the population is considered the sine qua non of success by counterinsurgency experts. After the Diem coup, this was never possible in Vietnam, as one incompetent and utterly corrupt government succeeded another. None was legitimate in the eyes of the people. Contemporary descriptions of the various Saigon governments read almost exactly like descriptions of the Karzai government today. Notwithstanding all the fanfare over this week's presidential voting in Afghanistan, the Kabul government will never be legitimate either, because democracy is not a source of legitimacy of governance in Afghanistan and it never has been. Legitimacy in Afghanistan over the last thousand years has come exclusively from dynastic and religious sources. The fatal blunder of the United States in eliminating a ceremonial Afghan monarchy was Afghanistan's Diem Coup: afterwards, there was little possibility of establishing a legitimate, secular national government.

It doesn't matter who wins the August elections for president in Afghanistan: he will be illegitimate because he is elected. We have apparently learned nothing from Vietnam.

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MANAN VATSYAYANA/AFP/Getty Images

 

Thomas H. Johnson is a research professor of the Department of National Security Affairs and director of the Program for Culture and Conflict Studies at the Naval Postgraduate School in Monterey, California. M. Chris Mason is a retired Foreign Service officer who served in 2005 as political officer for the PRT in Paktika and presently is a senior fellow at the Program for Culture and Conflict Studies and at the Center for Advanced Defense Studies in Washington, D.C. 

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ROBERT HERNURG

2:38 PM ET

August 21, 2009

Vietnamistan

1.Neither was/is a: "WAR". The people of the United States through their elected representatives in Congress declare that a state of "WAR" exists-not a conflict, a surge ,an experience,an engagement , a peace action,etc! The last time America achieved victory was after Congress declared :"WAR" in1941. We, the American people ARE America. Fighting without the participation of the American public is like submerging a submarine with the screen door port holes open.

2.Stop calling the foe:insurgents,etc-they are: "the enemy".

3. If points 1 and 2 are ignored,then start buying some more marble for a wall in Washington DC.

 

EXOTTOYUHR

3:32 PM ET

August 21, 2009

Where is Võ Nguyên Giáp?

If the war in Afghanistan is another Vietnam, where is the other side's mainforce army, its systematic training, its Ho Chi Minh Trail, its industrial ally providing it equipment? Al-Qaida has accomplished a few major attacks, especially September 11th, but they are not and will never be a second Soviet Union (barring enormous changes on the world map).

Vietnam was a proxy war superimposed upon a counterinsurgency (and even then, the insurgents exhausted themselves -- the VC were no longer a functional organization after the Tet Offensive); Afghanistan is just a counterinsurgency, along lines similar to the French in Algeria (for a pessimistic ending) or the US in the Philippines (for an optimistic one).

Ideology isn't all that important when determining whether something is an insurgency or not; Communism was just as messianic as mujahidin-hood, and substantial insurgencies have been fought with rudimentary or no ideological support. Spain against Napoleon is a good example of that; so is Algeria, again against France, or the PLO against Israel (as they were secularist and quasi-Communist in the '50s through I think as late as the '80s).

 

J THOMAS

12:26 AM ET

August 23, 2009

Old propaganda

Vietnam was a proxy war superimposed upon a counterinsurgency (and even then, the insurgents exhausted themselves -- the VC were no longer a functional organization after the Tet Offensive)

We had to tell ourselves that at the time to try to convince ourselves that Tet was not an unmitigated disaster. It wasn't true. Many of us knew it wasn't true.

The war was lost a long time ago, we can tell the truth now. We put a big enough occupation force in vietnam that the locals didn't care to attack us except as part of larger operations. But you want to say they weren't functional? Look at vietnamese income records before you say that.

You think the Phoenix program was made for no reason, that we weren't trying to use US troops to oppose a successful organization?

Far too often people repeat this old disinformation that the VC were mostly killed off by Tet. We should have known better at the time, though it may have seemed unpatriotic to say so. We surely should know better by now.

Anyway, if the US in the philippines is your optimistic outcome, wouldn't it be more optimistic to just leave?

 

ARTSKOE

6:00 PM ET

August 27, 2009

Saigon 2009

Agreed. And there is no draft in America as well. Many if not most Vietnam Vets did not want to be there but U.S. and coalition troops still have hope for a better Afghanistan and to catch Al-Qaida leaders which they have done, knocking off many of the top 50.

Saying this is Saigon all over is only meant to scare American youth, but they do not remember or know the differences or similarities, as these authors.

 

BRETT

6:56 PM ET

August 27, 2009

We had to tell ourselves that

We had to tell ourselves that at the time to try to convince ourselves that Tet was not an unmitigated disaster. It wasn't true. Many of us knew it wasn't true.

Must we review the history again on this? Tet was a major success for the US - we defeated a massive North Korean conventional offensive, and since the Viet Cong leadership thought there would be a popular uprising in South Vietnam (hint: there wasn't), they exposed themselves and were almost entirely wiped out.

The war was lost a long time ago, we can tell the truth now. We put a big enough occupation force in vietnam that the locals didn't care to attack us except as part of larger operations. But you want to say they weren't functional? Look at vietnamese income records before you say that.

I've looked at the history quite a bit.

Far too often people repeat this old disinformation that the VC were mostly killed off by Tet. We should have known better at the time, though it may have seemed unpatriotic to say so. We surely should know better by now.

They were mostly killed off. The North relied heavily on North Vietnamese Army troops from that point onward, and when the US finally pulled out, they dropped the insurgency and went straight for conventional warfare.

 

GRANT

2:26 AM ET

August 26, 2009

A criticism

I won't disagree with most of this article simply because I lack the classified current knowledge needed to agree or disagree on many of the points, but I do have to criticize the point made on the former king. It wasn't the United States that refused to allow him to take back his old role (though I imagine the neo-conservatives wouldn't have) it was the strongest warlords and politicians that weren't thrilled with him.

 
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