Get Nasty or Go Home

The go-light strategy in Afghanistan is a joke. If Obama's serious about victory, it's time to start making unpleasant choices.

BY MICHAEL SCHEUER | OCTOBER 12, 2009

One has to admire the ingenuity of the policymakers, journalists, and generals who are desperately seeking to avoid hard decisions on what to do about America's lost war in Afghanistan. Last spring, the Barack Obama administration, Republican leaders, and senior U.S. generals signed on to the fairy-tale prescription spun by David Kilcullen in his book The Accidental Guerrilla. Kilcullen argued that only limited numbers of Afghans were dedicated insurgents and that the great bulk of the United States' enemies in Afghanistan were either hired by the Taliban or intimidated by Takfiri Islamists. Based on this comprehensive surmise -- for which there is scant evidence -- this April's strategy was to "protect" Afghans from bad guys and give jobs to those waging war for wages. Having attained these goals, the strategy held, cleaning up the unpopular Takfiris would be -- like Iraq -- a cakewalk.

Guess what? No cakewalk. Now, Americans are watching a shellshocked Obama administration trying to decide what to do about Gen. Stanley McChrystal's urgent request for 40,000-45,000 additional U.S. troops. The general's request, of course, is an emergency SOS indicating that the U.S.-NATO coalition is close to losing the Afghan war; a four-star U.S. general does not ask for a near doubling of his force to smooth out minor problems.

Thus, not only did the April strategy utterly fail, but the Taliban-led insurgency's trend line is steadily climbing upward, an ascent that began in 2007 and would not be possible without widespread and increasing popular support. Rather than popular support for the Taliban being based on intimidation and money, what we are seeing in Afghanistan is popular opinion catching up with Islamist determination. Until roughly late 2006, the war against the U.S.-NATO coalition was largely fought by the Taliban, other Islamists groups like that led by Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, and al Qaeda. Since then, however, the Islamists have been joined by Afghans who simply do not want Muslim Afghanistan occupied by all sorts of infidels from all sorts of Christian and polytheist countries. In short, an Islamist insurgency has evolved into an Islamist-nationalist freedom struggle not unlike that which beat the Red Army. The best way to see the growth of the Afghan enemy facing the United States and NATO is to track the proliferating number of insurgent attacks in the heretofore quiet and supposedly "friendly" arc of provinces from Herat in the west clockwise to Badakhshan in the far northeast.

Team Obama faces quite a dilemma. McChrystal's plan to stave off defeat by asking for substantial immediate reinforcements -- a request that is still far short of what is needed to "win" in Afghanistan -- is a sure sign that long-term intense fighting and high casualties lie ahead. The United States' latest Nobel Prize winner now has a choice: He must act quickly on the advice of McChrystal and the U.S. intelligence community to save a marooned U.S. Army, or dither behind the harebrained split-al-Qaeda-from-the-Taliban strategizing and let more overmatched U.S. soldiers and Marines die amid the ego-building praise of effete Americans, pacifist NGOs, and the Nobelistas.

For now, dithering seems to be on tap. Last week unnamed administration officials and some commentators began floating a new "strategy" based on the formulation that: (a) the Taliban and al Qaeda are separable; (b) the Taliban does not pose a direct threat to the United States; and, therefore, (c) U.S. forces should fight al Qaeda in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Well, simply put, this strategy makes Kilcullen look like Clausewitz and surely could not have been vetted by the U.S. intelligence community. On point "a," it is no news at all that the Taliban and al Qaeda are separate entities; they always have been and will be. What is important is that they are working in tandem toward the same clear and simple primary goal -- to drive out the United States and NATO, destroy Karzai's corrupt and incompetent regime, and re-establish their Islamist emirate. In working toward this goal, al Qaeda's combat role in Afghanistan has decreased as mujahideen forces -- Afghans, Iraq veterans, and other foreign volunteers -- have grown and become better armed, trained, and funded. This should have been apparent to U.S. officials several years ago when Osama bin Laden named Mustafa Abu al-Yazid as al Qaeda's Afghan commander. Yazid's long-practiced fortes are logistics and finance, and he is now running the main components of al Qaeda's changed but still essential Afghan effort: logistics and training, intelligence collection, and media operations. (Nota bene: This is nowhere near a full commitment of al Qaeda's resources, and its remaining assets are assisting other insurgencies -- such as in Somalia, Algeria, and Yemen -- and preparing coming attacks in the United States and Europe.)

On point "b," one has to wonder what can be meant by arguing that the Taliban does not pose a "direct threat" to the United States. Did the drafters of the new strategy bother to ask the intelligence community whom the United States is fighting in Afghanistan? The Taliban and its allies are unquestionably a direct threat to deployed U.S. military forces -- ask the commander of the U.S. post at Kamdesh, Nuristan, mauled on Oct. 4 -- and they intend to prevent everything Washington cites as a goal in Afghanistan: democracy, secularism, the rule of (Western) law, elections, constitutions, central government institutions, women's rights, coeducational schools, and the annihilation of al Qaeda. By protecting al Qaeda, incidentally, Taliban leader Mullah Omar's outfit is also facilitating a "direct threat" to the continental United States.

DAVID FURST/AFP/Getty Images

 SUBJECTS:
 

Michael F. Scheuer, the former head of the CIA's bin Laden unit, is an adjunct professor of security studies at Georgetown University.

F1FAN

8:37 AM ET

October 13, 2009

Michael Scheuer? Really

The same Michael F. Scheuer that not only failed to cappture or kill Osama Bin Laden but then also stated on national TV that he hoped Bin Laden would attack and kill thousands of Americans so that Republicans could win an election?

Now he suddenly realizes that Afghanistan is serious and is able to deduce that the Taliban and Al Qaeda are separate entities, not only that but he now has advice. The article title is apt, listen to chicken-hawks like Michael Scheuer and we 'get nasty' kill more civilians and get even more US troops killed and injured and damage America worse than Michael Scheuer's hoped for terrorist attack.

I hope that President Obama reads this article, considers it' source and takes the second half of the title's advice: Go Home. If the Afghan 'elections' weren't a wake up call then calls for escalation should be, Afghanistan is not worth American lives and treasure.

 

SOLUTION WONK

9:05 AM ET

October 15, 2009

WE NEED TO ASEAN STRATEGY.

The strategy in afghanistan should be a multi-national south asian force able to hold the peace and build a nation with us for decades.
This force should be able to go across the border between afghanistan and pakistan and fight AQ and taliban. This force should be able to do that because it would compromise of military personnel from pakistan and india and srilanka and bangladesh and china if willing. The force should be at 200,000 strong. The force will be large enough to implement the COIN strategy.

But how do we get both india and pakistan on-board. It is simple. The terrorists inside pakistan not only pose a danger to pakistan (now) but also to india. The as is situation would be a continuation of the cross border terrorism in india and in border terrorism in pakistan.

Carrots/sticks approach needs to be used. If Pakistan doesn't come on-board then we will increase military co-operation with india on a very high level giving the pakistanis no choice to be part of the solution. India has to be waived the carrot of more military arms supplies, visas and business co-operation and nuclear co-operation to the stick of cutting of the co-operation that we have already and putting the indian economy at risk because us/india economies are very co-dependant.
There has to be many other ways we can strong arm these two countries in contributing troops and to the idea of joint counterinsurgency/anti-terrorism force.

The war in afghanistan has a seperatist more than a terrorist agenda. Pashtun populace is not represented and marginailized by both pakistan and afghan governments. Second leg of the strategy requires creating an pashtun government independent of hardcore taliban and allied with both afghan/pak central government. This government should be able to sent representatives to both afghanistan/pakistan central government and be able to enforce law and order across the border regions. Law and order can be based on sharia law/tribal law whatever the pashtun populace votes for. The idea for the long-term being a creation of ASEAN union like the european union with strong democracies supporting and economically uplifting the weak.

The current strategy is bound to fail because it relies on pak military destroying taliban/AQ from the pakistani side. Its doing a half-ass job, because as long its doing a half-ass job we will be contributing money. They do not want to fight their own country-men and know that our appetite to stay in afghanistan is low. Pakistan military is defined by its conflicts with india and will funnel the money that we give to its military interest in fighting india. Once we leave they will go back to fighting proxy war in afghanistan and india via the taliban/AQ/Pak terrorist nexus. The truth is that the pakistan military cannot fight the taliban alone and there are not enough troops to implement the COIN strategy on the afghan and pakistan side.

We have to convince pakistan the only war worth fighting is the one within its border and india that it has to support pakistan's civilian government and better get involved. It should be a part of a greater regional strategy that eradicates terrorism by using the regional powers and our influence

 

JAYLEMEUX

10:40 AM ET

October 15, 2009

But they're a threat to national security!

http://www.mnftiu.cc/2007/07/17/war67-1/

 

JACK DAVIS

9:33 AM ET

October 13, 2009

"Get Nasty or Go Home"

Fred Armisen makes a better president than Barack Obama.

 

A.K.A.

10:51 AM ET

October 13, 2009

So-called solution?

This is a serious options memo? 400,000 troops? Get real.

 

PSGUTE

11:31 AM ET

October 13, 2009

How nasty would we need to get?

I will preface this with the admission that I have neither a postgraduate degree in international politics nor experience as a government policy adviser. I did, however, grow up as the dependent of an American Diplomat who served in the Middle East and East Asia, spending 18 of the first 24 years of my life outside of the United States; I served as a US Marine Infantry Officer, deploying to the Pacific Ocean, Atlantic Ocean, Mediterranean Sea, Red Sea, and Indian Ocean; I saw combat in Desert Storm; I am currently an executive in an international consulting firm. I, like many Marine Officers, study history to gain perspective on the likely behavior of the populace of areas where conflict is likely. I also spend roughly 4 hours daily reading a broad variety of political, economic, and social journals to stay abreast of trends pertinent to our business throughout the world. In sum, I have more experience and exposure to the realities of international relations than most academics.

What I find amazing when reading articles about the "Afghan Problem" is that they invariably miss the salient point that Afghanistan is not a nation. Afghanistan is a geographic boundary for a conglomeration of tribal areas. Western leaders and governments from the time Alexander the Great through the USSR have found this to be the problem in subduing the Afghan people. When you are dealing with a populace that firmly believes each tribal area (think rural county in the US for perspective) is an independent nation, and routinely engages in raids and border wars with their neighbors, the larger geographic boundary is not a nation. It is an arena.

The Afghans don't like each other. They see blood feud as a legitimate social behavior, and literally steal women from neighboring villages for wives. The only people they like less than each other are invaders. The only semblance of inter-tribal cooperation that Afghans have historically engaged in is uniting to expel foreign troops. Alexander, Genghis Khan, and the USSR all found this out to their dismay. Any of these routinely engaged in acts of brutality that the general American public is not even capable of comprehending, much less allowing us to exceed.

All but the most historically illiterate can tell you that neither Alexander, Genghis Khan, the USSR, nor any other invading force, has ever succeeded in subduing or changing the Afghans. As you subdue or befriend one tribal group, you acquire some of their friends as allies and all of their enemies as foes. It is an unwinnable kaleidoscope of intramural hatred that has been ongoing for all of recorded history.

The United States, thank God, is not capable of "Getting Nasty" enough to cow the Afghan people. Unless we are willing to recognize the multi-generational commitment needed to change the social structure of the population, and are willing to commit the resources in blood and treasure to do so while accepting the condemnation of the international academic and political elite for forcing our way of life on another nation, we need to get out now.

Personally I am fine with either solution. I would just like to see reality, not intellectual posturing, used as the basis for our policy decisions. Your rational responses are welcome at PSGute@aol.com.

 

KURITI

8:13 AM ET

October 14, 2009

Classic Blunders

to second your point, i was watching the move "the princess bride" with my kids this weekend and heard again this great line:

'You fell victim to one of the classic blunders - The most famous of which is "never get involved in a land war in Asia" '

Your point about Afghans ability to resist Asia is so ubiquitous as to be worthy of screen written jokes. i guess if we were really nasty we would also invade Russia during the winter. The simple fact is that they live there and we don't.

i re-read "the prince" by Machiavelli several years ago and was astounded by how cogent his advice was on this matter. basically, don't commit a lot of troops and don't try and force them to make major shifts in their culture or language. Kill off the top of the ruling class and support those who were previously held down while trying to make the average citizens life better.

 

STEVE W FROM FORD

11:57 AM ET

October 13, 2009

Michael Scheuer is something else

I am not enough of an "expert" to "know" what will happen in Afghanistan and I suspect that neither is ANYONE else. Human conflict is too complex for any of we mere mortals to untangle it's strands enough to predict the future with any degree of certitude whether we rely on history, social sciences, military science or any other study for our authority. Life is unpredictable and war is it's most unpredictable arena.
What really interests me is how people like Michael Scheuer and so many other "experts" can continue to get up and proclaim that they "know" the answer when they have been repeatedly proven wrong in their previous announcements about what "must" happen. Have they no shame?

For a good laugh try reading the "expert" panel that Rolling Stone put together (includes Mr Scheuer) anout 3 years ago to enlighten us with the future of Iraq and how Bush was an idiot.

You can find it at www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/13710030/leaving_iraq_the_grim_truth

All of these guys are so sure they are right when actually in retrospect we can see they are as clueless as the rest of us. After reading the old predictions about how stupid Bush was and how the surge was a failure before it even started one could still think that Bush may be an idiot, I don't know, but if he is an idiot he was sure one lucky one, and aren't we fortunate he was?

 

INTHISDIMENSION

12:53 PM ET

October 13, 2009

Get really nasty or go home NOW

One is struck by the author's comment that raising conventional forces to Vietnam-era levels is even an option the public would consider.

The last war America won was WW2. ROE were basically to kill the bad guys and if civilians got in the way, too bad. No nonsense about "Holy cities" or sites, no nonsense about taking fire from a building and not IMMEDIATELY leveling the building - ANY building. That's how you win a war, and if you aren't willing to do that you shouldn't be there expending lives to begin with.

Our leaders then also realized that it was the civilians of the belligerents that allowed Germany, Italy and Japan to go to war in the first place, so it wasn't as though they were "innocent."

Wars are won by destroying the enemy forces and totally demoralizing enemy civilians until they understand they've been DEFEATED and decide to quit fighting. There is NO WAY to demoralize a bunch of 7th-Century warriors off the field. KILL THEM. Or GO HOME.

Here's a reality check for everyone re: insurgency: It takes two to play.

For America to lose "war" against insurgents means that America has chosen to expend lives of Americans in an insurgent war. No reason in the world exists to do so, and not one thing in Afghanistan is worth the life of a single American.

Afghan is a desert with a bunch of folks living in the stone age - you can't bomb them back to it because they never left. It is lightly populated, and outside the "cities" basically populated by bad guys and opium farmers. NO reason exists to lose an American lives stopping them. NO reason exists to fight an insurgency action. It isn't as though the Taliban are a civilized society trying to take-over a civilized country.

This is EXACTLY why we have nuclear weapons. Truman (D) used them to avoid huge casualties. It's what is needed now for the same reason. Inside or outside a cave, a couple of properly-administered nukes would solve the immediate problem. And if they are near the SWAT border, fine.

The other advantage, and a not-insignificant one, is that it would put the world on notice that Americans are no longer going to sit around and wait to be killed by barbarians demanding to return to 7th-Century Arab lives, that we regard freedom, liberty, women's and children's rights as important enough to KILL anyone willing to kill men, women and children to overturn them.

You don't like Western values? That means you don't like any of the freedoms you use every single day and which we once planned to pass on to our posterity. With 1.57 B Muslims now on the planet, a 30% increase in a decade, and with Western Civilization in a depopulation mode globally, and with a Muslim apologist as President of the US, it seems fairly clear that the "multiculturalists" are about to find out that their anti-Westernism means the death of liberties fought for for centuries, and that our children will be living in a new Dark Age.

Thanks, Libs... good work.

The bad guys in Afghanistan need to be nuked NOW, or we may as well come home, pull our troops from Germany and Japan and Korea and everywhere else they are stationed and begin worrying about how to keep Western liberty alive as Muslims take over Asia and Europe.

Because demographics IS destiny... and not stopping these barbarians NOW likely means they will not be stopped EVER.. Europe already is hugely populated by Islamists... and Londonistan is called that for a reason.

http://inthisdimension.com/2007/11/07/war-and-reality/

 

SMCI60652

1:21 PM ET

October 13, 2009

Suggestions?

I'm sorry but I just don't see any answers in Mr Scheuer's argument. It's all well to critique another's dilemma, but you aren't doing us any favors by failing to present viable alternatives to a way out of this mess.

Michael Scheuer deserves credit, he was one of the first government (former) officials to speak candidly about the reasons why the US has become a target - all in the heyday of the "they hate us because of our freedoms" non-sense.

But I'd have to largely agree with PSGUTE. This is an ethnic war before this is a religious struggle. It would help if we replace the term Taliban with Pashtun, because effectively, THAT'S who the Taliban's ranks are composed of, and THAT'S who they are popular with. Anytime you talk about ousting the Taliban, you have to think along the lines of 'ousting' the 40% Pashtun's who have lived for millenia in southern Afghanistan, and who have extensive familial ties across the border in Pakistan.

This isn't a winnable war because we never knew what 'winning' was supposed to tangibly look like. At best we imagined a benign pro-US government with a strong pro-US intelligence service to weed out any bad apples that may want to harm our interests.

Maybe the answer lies in paying billions to help create and popularize a non-militant Pashtun Nationalist Party? Or i guess that's what Karzai was supposed to do. Sort of a Taliban-lite.

Or perhaps we can broker a solution that allows the Taliban to have an autonomous 'Pashtunistan' Emirate based around Kandahar, and allow the Northern 'Alliance' government of the other 60% Hazaras, Tajiks, Uzbeks etc. to have their own authomous federation in the Northern Provinces. Which would in effect mean that the current regime inherits the Northern Provinces. Thus we narrow the base of operations for any potential terrorists with international reach, and we maintain an ongoing (small) contingent of SOF in the North for rapid deployment if need be.

All of this is admitedly only remotely possible if the Taliban is still a force (or ever was) that is amenable to negotiations and compromise.

 

GERONIMO

2:02 PM ET

October 13, 2009

Scheuerism

Never mind the Scheuer of the past while harking to the Scheuer of the present. He may not be right, but at least he makes sense. In the present Nobel mood of America as betokened by the all too clear results of our last national election, we're not heading for victory in Pakafistan. Rather,it'll be a hopefully orderly retreat and thence another one from international predominance to mere membership in a multipolar arrangement as apparently desired by the Norwegians.For all I know it may just work out to our advantage and wellbeing provided the Unseen Hand fixes our bakruptcy and heads us back to times when the livin' was easy.

 

GERONIMO

2:04 PM ET

October 13, 2009

Scheuerism

Never mind the Scheuer of the past while harking to the Scheuer of the present. He may not be right, but at least he makes sense. In the present Nobel mood of America as betokened by the all too clear results of our last national election, we're not heading for victory in Pakafistan. Rather,it'll be a hopefully orderly retreat and thence another one from international predominance to mere membership in a multipolar arrangement as apparently desired by the Norwegians.For all I know it may just work out to our advantage and wellbeing provided the Unseen Hand fixes our bakruptcy and heads us back to times when the livin' was easy.

 

DESI4EVA

3:49 PM ET

October 13, 2009

I Agree with Geronimo that we

I Agree with Geronimo that we are looking for a way out now

Leaflet Distribution Jobs

 

SIR_MIXXALOT

9:07 PM ET

October 13, 2009

Get nasty or go home?

Go home.

Like the founding fathers would have wanted.

 

SIR_MIXXALOT

9:10 PM ET

October 13, 2009

The CIA says we should go home -- time to listen

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/graham-e-fuller/global-viewpoint-obamas-p_b_201355.html

Graham E. Fuller

Former CIA station chief in Kabul and author of The Future of Political Islam
Posted: May 10, 2009 03:41 PM
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Read More: Afghanistan, Islam, Jihad, Obama, Obama Afghanistan, Pakistan, Pashtun, Radical Islam, Taliban, World News

For all the talk of "smart power," President Obama is pressing down the same path of failure in Pakistan marked out by George Bush. The realities suggest need for drastic revision of U.S. strategic thinking.

-- Military force will not win the day in either Afghanistan or Pakistan; crises have only grown worse under the U.S. military footprint.

-- The Taliban represent zealous and largely ignorant mountain Islamists. They are also all ethnic Pashtuns. Most Pashtuns see the Taliban -- like them or not -- as the primary vehicle for restoration of Pashtun power in Afghanistan, lost in 2001. Pashtuns are also among the most fiercely nationalist, tribalized and xenophobic peoples of the world, united only against the foreign invader. In the end, the Taliban are probably more Pashtun than they are Islamist.

-- It is a fantasy to think of ever sealing the Pakistan-Afghanistan border. The "Durand Line" is an arbitrary imperial line drawn through Pashtun tribes on both sides of the border. And there are twice as many Pashtuns in Pakistan as there are in Afghanistan. The struggle of 13 million Afghan Pashtuns has already inflamed Pakistan's 28 million Pashtuns.

-- India is the primary geopolitical threat to Pakistan, not Afghanistan. Pakistan must therefore always maintain Afghanistan as a friendly state. India furthermore is intent upon gaining a serious foothold in Afghanistan -- in the intelligence, economic and political arenas -- that chills Islamabad.

-- Pakistan will therefore never rupture ties or abandon the Pashtuns, in either country, whether radical Islamist or not. Pakistan can never afford to have Pashtuns hostile to Islamabad in control of Kabul, or at home.

-- Occupation everywhere creates hatred, as the U.S. is learning. Yet Pashtuns remarkably have not been part of the jihadi movement at the international level, although many are indeed quick to ally themselves at home with al-Qaida against the U.S. military.

-- The U.S. had every reason to strike back at the al-Qaida presence in Afghanistan after the outrage of 9/11. The Taliban were furthermore poster children for an incompetent and harsh regime. But the Taliban retreated from, rather than lost, the war in 2001, in order to fight another day. Indeed, one can debate whether it might have been possible -- with sustained pressure from Pakistan, Iran, Saudi Arabia and almost all other Muslim countries that viewed the Taliban as primitives -- to force the Taliban to yield up al-Qaida over time without war. That debate is in any case now moot. But the consequences of that war are baleful, debilitating and still spreading.

-- The situation in Pakistan has gone from bad to worse as a direct consequence of the U.S. war raging on the Afghan border. U.S. policy has now carried the Afghan war over the border into Pakistan with its incursions, drone bombings and assassinations -- the classic response to a failure to deal with insurgency in one country. Remember the invasion of Cambodia to save Vietnam?

-- The deeply entrenched Islamic and tribal character of Pashtun rule in the Northwest Frontier Province in Pakistan will not be transformed by invasion or war. The task requires probably several generations to start to change the deeply embedded social and psychological character of the area. War induces visceral and atavistic response.

-- Pakistan is indeed now beginning to crack under the relentless pressure directly exerted by the U.S. Anti-American impulses in Pakistan are at high pitch, strengthening Islamic radicalism and forcing reluctant acquiescence to it even by non-Islamists.

Only the withdrawal of American and NATO boots on the ground will begin to allow the process of near-frantic emotions to subside within Pakistan, and for the region to start to cool down. Pakistan is experienced in governance and is well able to deal with its own Islamists and tribalists under normal circumstances; until recently, Pakistani Islamists had one of the lowest rates of electoral success in the Muslim world.

But U.S. policies have now driven local nationalism, xenophobia and Islamism to combined fever pitch. As Washington demands that Pakistan redeem failed American policies in Afghanistan, Islamabad can no longer manage its domestic crisis.

The Pakistani army is more than capable of maintaining state power against tribal militias and to defend its own nukes. Only a convulsive nationalist revolutionary spirit could change that -- something most Pakistanis do not want. But Washington can still succeed in destabilizing Pakistan if it perpetuates its present hard-line strategies. A new chapter of military rule -- not what Pakistan needs -- will be the likely result, and even then Islamabad's basic policies will not change, except at the cosmetic level.

In the end, only moderate Islamists themselves can prevail over the radicals whose main source of legitimacy comes from inciting popular resistance against the external invader. Sadly, U.S. forces and Islamist radicals are now approaching a state of co-dependency.

It would be heartening to see a solid working democracy established in Afghanistan. Or widespread female rights and education -- areas where Soviet occupation ironically did rather well. But these changes are not going to happen even within one generation, given the history of social and economic devastation of the country over 30 years.

Al-Qaida's threat no longer emanates from the caves of the borderlands, but from its symbolism that has long since metastasized to other activists of the Muslim world. Meanwhile, the Pashtuns will fight on for a major national voice in Afghanistan. But few Pashtuns on either side of the border will long maintain a radical and international jihadi perspective once the incitement of the U.S. presence is gone. Nobody on either side of the border really wants it.

What can be done must be consonant with the political culture. Let non-military and neutral international organizations, free of geopolitical taint, take over the binding of Afghan wounds and the building of state structures.

If the past eight years had shown ongoing success, perhaps an alternative case for U.S. policies could be made. But the evidence on the ground demonstrates only continued deterioration and darkening of the prognosis. Will we have more of the same? Or will there be a U.S. recognition that the American presence has now become more the problem than the solution? We do not hear that debate.

(C) 2009 GLOBAL VIEWPOINT NETWORK; (TM) TRIBUNE MEDIA SERVICES, INC.

Graham E. Fuller is a former CIA station chief in Kabul and a former vice-chair of the CIA's National Intelligence Council. He is author of numerous books on the Middle East, including The Future of Political Islam.
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LUVMY91STANG

10:00 PM ET

October 13, 2009

All or Nothing? That's it?

Let me get this straight:

All in (including, as one commenter advocated, dropping nukes) or all out. Just take our ball and go home. These are the options?

Of all the faults my fellow Americans have, probably the most harmful is their belief that they know enough to form an intelligent opinion. They should have a greater appreciation for their own ignorance.

I'll put my faith in the opinions of Petraeus, McChrystal, Kilcullen and the other Pentagon advisors on the military side. For the political questions, I'll put my faith in the knowledge that this is Obama's war and if he screws it up he'll be as reviled as George Bush.

Have a nice day. Turn off the TV and go read a book.

 

KAYKURI

10:24 PM ET

October 13, 2009

Time for another face saving surge?

It's hard not to conclude that it's time to get out of Afghanistan, which seems to be a growing consensus even including Michael Scheuer here, at least as far as I can tell after stripping out the gratuitous political jabs.

This feels like a tragedy to me, because I get the sense that we had a shot there. Not to create a western democracy, but to stabilize the "arena" and let the Afghans do their own thing. The Taliban had been in charge long enough that I doubt they were greatly missed.

Maybe not, but I find this statement from the article significant:

Until roughly late 2006, the war against the U.S.-NATO coalition was largely fought by the Taliban, other Islamists groups like that led by Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, and al Qaeda. Since then, however, the Islamists have been joined by Afghans who simply do not want Muslim Afghanistan occupied by all sorts of infidels from all sorts of Christian and polytheist countries.

That's a _FIVE YEAR_ grace period we were given, but we totally blew it between a combination of boneheaded policies and a woeful lack of resources. _IF_ we ever had a real shot in Afghanistan, it was lost primarily because the Bush Administration had its eye on Iraq all along.

I guess our best option then is to find some way to make the last election look legit, and then do what we did in Iraq: give Gen. McChrystal enough troops to beat down the statistics a few notches, declare victory and skedaddle before the Spring thaw.

It's pretty pathetic to try to hang this on Obama at this point, but if he buys into continuing to fight this battle with half-measures it will become well and truly his soon enough.

 

SIMMSA

10:45 PM ET

October 13, 2009

Shame on you

Mr.Scheuer, your suggestion of the wide use of landmines is not only a terrible idea but would cause wide-spread international condemnation and give support to the Taliban cause. The truth about landmines is that they end up mauling just as many innocent civilians as they do enemy combatants and will sow the seeds of hatred against the U.S forces. Look back at Vietnam and Cambodia where many civilians limp around on one leg today because of the American landmines that were planted there during the war. This is not the way to win the hearts and minds of the Afghan people.

 

JACKFKELLY51

11:59 PM ET

October 13, 2009

You had eight years and failed

Mr. Scheuer, you and Bush/Cheney had eight years to capture Osama bin Laden and failed your proposals do nothing to make America safer or more secure. This President sets the national policy and he will with due deliberation decide which way to go on Afghanistan.
I hope he listens to his advisors and not to those who miserably failed us during the Bush regime. Your all in advocacy has posters here actually pondering nukes. Estimates have Al Qaeda strength in Afghanistan at around one hundred or so, we have 81,000 troops with the latest 13,000 going to this war. You argue nothing more than the same policies that failed so sadly in Viet Nam.

 

JOHN JOYCE

2:48 AM ET

October 14, 2009

Scheur's remedy

Can you see Obama committing to 10 years of war in Afghan . not in our lifetime . I know Gates is briefed and I detect a little wobble in his stance by his knowledge of how the war is evolving.
We have no alternative but to extricate ourselves in as a dignified a way as possible and the sooner the better . Once that is done we will then have unintended consequences to sort out ,
No matter where we look we can't find any sugar to add to this lemon in making lemonade .

 

RUSTAM

5:03 AM ET

October 14, 2009

Escalation is a bad idea

All the people who think the US is not tough enough with Taliban because of the human rights concerns and the liberal media etc. Do you believe that the Soviets were soft on Afghans as well or they lost because the US supplied the Mujahideen with Stingers?! The truth is the Taliban have a lot less to lose than the average GI, and rightly or wrongly they believe in what they're fighting for.

 

J-MAN

11:51 AM ET

October 14, 2009

Was the Iraq Study Group a Joke?

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it the group think mentality and myopic worldview of the Bush administration what created this mess and the other mess that has somewhat cleaned itself up in the Middle East? As I remember it was Don Rumsfeld that said "You go to war with the military you have" when answering a question as to why all US soldiers lacked armor plating on their military vehicles. It's this same administration that fired the Chief of Staff after he said that it would take around a half a million troops to secure Iraq after total de-Bathification.

So now we have a president that has discovered that his original strategy may not be working. This same thing happened with Iraq but it took years for the Bush administration to do anything about it; and the beginning of change came with the Iraq Study Group Report which on the surface not taken seriously by the Bush administration, but in policy reality was largely implemented.

So now Obama is in the process of deciding what the best strategy should be, just as Bush FINALLY did.

This over embellished need for urgent decision making has never led America to sound policy whether it was Bush, Obama, Kennedy, or Johnson. Nobody wants to see a waffler, but I do believe that Obama will come to a sound decision in the near future.

 

SIR_MIXXALOT

4:27 PM ET

October 14, 2009

Let's Listen to what the CIA experts are Saying:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/graham-e-fuller/global-viewpoint-obamas-p_b_201355.html

 

MDREW

4:59 PM ET

October 14, 2009

Why the 40,000?

You say there is no chance we will committ the forces necessary to actually defeat the enemy in country. I'm inclined to agree. What then is the justification for the additional U.S. deaths that are guaranteed under your advocacy for accession to MChrystal's request for one tenth of the forces necessary to win, just to 'delay defeat'? You explicitly recommend what observers in retrospect mock U.S. leaders for doing in Vietnam: commit additional U.S. personnel to an inevitable defeat. That is immoral from a purely U.S. state-citizenry standpoint.

 

SCRAMBLE101

1:50 AM ET

October 15, 2009

Energy and Moral high ground

In regards to pull-out options, make note that what is driving the "AfPak" war more than anti-terrorism is control of territory to run oil and gas pipelines from Central Asia to the Arabian Sea. Lets call a spade a spade, this is a Pipeline War. The ME is expected to run out of energy resources in less than 25 years, and the next mother lode of energy resources is Central Asia - resources that are being vied over by Russia and China, and by a hand-rubbing Iran. Iran is an easy route, and they are reportedly signing treaties with Pakistan and India for just this purpose. Is it worth 40,000 more troops to control this energy conduit? Perhaps yes, IF a reasonable policy is in place to cooperate, not control (which is impossible) Afghanistan. This is not a conspiracy theory, it is a reality, and it should be expressed openly to the American people. (Search "Pipeline War" online).

I have lived many years in Afghanistan, but a final solution or advise to give that solves the current quandary escapes me. However, when I run into confusion in my own life, and I can't see my way thru to the other side, I step back and just ask myself, "what is the NEXT STEP?". With that in mind, I can make a confident recommendation - which is quite simple: Foreign forces must enforce an election process, designed for the realities of Afghanistan that will lead to their own self determination - government of the people, by the people, for the people. If the Afghans want visionaries, let them elect visionaries; if they want scoundrels, let them elect scoundrels; if they want the king's family back, let them elect them back in; if they want the Taliban, well, let them elect the Taliban. The key words here are "LET THEM", whether by war-lordism or tribalism or ideologicalism, LET THEM! Some Taliban stood for election in the last round. (Communists are allowed to run for election in the US, and they do). And if they do elect the Taliban - then we can bow out gracefully, saying that we don't want to support their style of rule (lets try to leave 'ideology' /Islamic fanaticism out of our criticism) - Whoops, except we need that pipeline! How about making friends with Iran?:) That could be easier than fighting an opportunistic, populist, guerilla insurgency against foreign control, which is what the Afghan resistance has turned into, and which can't be won.

So how to do the elections?? Certainly not by carting ballot boxes to remote sites by donkey and helicopter. First, empower the provinces to elect their own officials, then let those officials come to Kabul, in number and power like the US's brilliant House and Senate. Then have them all sit in their parliament building, and LET THEM vote. Then count the number of reps and the number of ballots. It would be hard to cheat, though easy to bribe - but its better than what is going on now.

This system is not a true democracy, but we don't have one in the US either, we have a "Constitutional-based, representative Republic", and it works. Think of the reps as a flesh and blood "electoral college system", all the state's votes going to one candidate or another. If the people back home don't like how their rep voted, then he/she will hopefully loose in the next election. Afghanistan has never been "ruled" from Kabul, though it has been "led" - the last king's words. The provinces need empowering.

Along with this, WE MUST ENCOURAGE THE FORMATION OF POLITICAL PARTIES. I have read reports that we have discouraged political parties so that we can more easily support one candidate - in direct deviation from what we have found works in the US. Encourage the 41 candidates in the last election to write platforms, clump together, hash out issues, present united fronts - and keep our self-serving hands out of the details.

One more point. We Americans like to claim moral/logical high ground, but our solution to our own economic crises is to bail out the rich, and a big component of our health care is to kill the unborn!! Hello?? No talk of economic austerity and personal accountability, and no talk of health care premiums statistically based on lifestyle choices, and... Now we want to clean up Afghanistan? God help us.

Finally, citizens, Afghanistan is NOW at a PERFECT juncture to redo the elections. Lets redo them. Good elections are worth 200,000 more troops - and I think General McChrystal is the perfect man for the job. I have talked to many Afghans, and the election credibility gap must be closed, or WE WILL FAIL.

 

REDWELL

12:12 PM ET

October 15, 2009

The wit and wisdom of Machiavelli

I agree with Kuriti: US strategists and Afghan decision makers need to read "The Prince." It's NOT about brute force and DOES advocate (a Roman-style) republicanism. A good prince is not corrupt, wants citizens invested in the system and appeals to religion. He also brutalizes his venal friends (ahem, Karzai) as well as his adversaries. The Taliban? You can't wipe them out, but since Islamic Machiavellianism is their game, now, we could at least keep them tied up with an unending moves. This does not require an army, but it demands closer attention than Clinton-era missle launches.

 

REMIXEDGDOG

12:17 AM ET

October 16, 2009

The war in Afghanistan

"ask the commander of the U.S. post at Kamdesh, Nuristan, mauled on Oct. " Yes, please do, Mr. Scheuer. Ask him why there was even such a poorly manned, remote outpost built there where on the higher, surrounding mountain slopes local insurgents could fire down upon them; an outpost where the resupply helicopter was regularly fired upon prior to the battle? Why aren't the military brass under review for selecting terrain that affords the insurgents a tactical advantage, which they shrewdly exploited to their advantage? Also could you perhaps ask: Why did the the American officers also announce prior to this attack that they planned to close down the outpost. You don't need to be Clausewitz waving a red flag at the insurgents that whatever the final outcome of the attack it would serve them a great propaganda victory to the locals in Afghanistan and the American civilians back home. But please, Mr. Scheuer, lay the blame where it really belongs: on the field-grade officers in Afghanistan rather than on President Obama's desk in the Oval Office. Try to refrain from exploiting the death of fine, brave soldiers only doing their duty to make a political point unworthy of your obvious knowledge and expertise.
I understand your frustration and anger. I served as a medical corpsman in Vietnam during the Tet Offensive of '68. Then I came back to a nation of civilians. And the definition of a civilian is a fellow citizen who believes that he or she will live forever. The actuality of death is simply not an viable option in their lives. Of course, we both know how the third act ends. Badly.
And never will dotting the landscape in Afghanistan with land mines serve any real military advantage in the war against the insurgents. We'll just read news articles ten or fifteen years later on all the children walking around in Afghanistan with artificial legs, much in the same way that I have read about all the Cambodian children maimed and crippled by land mines from my war. Again, a propaganda victory for the insurgents whom we have declared to be heartless and cruel fanatics with no concern for human lives. A very bad p.r. decision in your argument of how to really win the war. But the image of Princess Diana spinning in her grave afforded you the opportunity to lash out with a cheap joke at a woman who is unable to defend herself. You probably will win very few hearts and minds either in this forum for comments or among Europeans who daily live in the aftermath of the carnage to civilian populations during the firebombing of the Second World War,
I've seen the human face of war every day that I went to work in the hospital during my tour of duty. And it broke my heart.
But Afghanistan is not Vietnam. The stakes are higher, with a politically shaky regime in Pakistan with its nuclear arsenal.I think that is the real prize the Taliban and al Qaeda have their eyes on. And despite what I experienced as a young, naive man over four decades ago in Vietnam, I think this war is necessary to the national security. And the Taliban must be brought to their knees pleading for mercy. But so many Afghan civilians and American soldiers will fall as the war escalates. I really don't know if the civilians back home will be able to stomach such a long commitment as the brutality and suffering mounts, as it surely will with troop escalations.
But that's the real test of leadership, President Obama convincing the American people to stay the course. And I have a friend whose son, a Marine, is going to be deployed to Afghanistan in February of next year. He's the best of the best and I want all the resources he needs to serve his country. So it's more than just an intellectual debate for me.

 

YAKANASTAN

9:58 AM ET

October 16, 2009

Wow

Thank goodness Mr. SCheuer is a former CIA employee. His article is full of clumsy political jabs, and barren of any solutions.

Our path is clear:

1) Pakistan is not an ally. Stop supporting them.
2) We are propping up a central government that is corrupt and does not represent the whole of Afghanistan. Fraudulent or not, the elections are meaningless for the whole of Afghanastan.
3) Our sole purpose for being in Afghanistan is to keep America safe. This means preventing Islamic Militants from attacking us. That is not happening now and won't happen with an additional 40,000 troops.
4) Bring the troops home, improve security at our borders and ports, work with the international community, build up our intelligence services, and retain the capability to attack get nasty with threats that we identify,