Life and Death of a Radical Mosque

Al-Quds, the Hamburg mosque that hosted several of the 9/11 attackers, has been closed down. The only question now is: Why on Earth did it take 10 years?

BY IAN JOHNSON | AUGUST 10, 2010

This week's closing of one of Europe's most notorious mosques, Masjid Taiba, formerly known as the al-Quds mosque in Hamburg, Germany, has significance beyond the continuing saga of a place where several of the 9/11 terrorists were radicalized. It also helps counter a myth surrounding radical Islam: the notion that mosques don't matter.

When experts are pressed on why young Muslims turn to terrorism, they usually give one of two answers. The first is the socioeconomic argument -- that poverty or discrimination caused the turn to violence. We heard this most recently in the aftermath of the failed bombing in New York's Times Square: The perpetrator was said to have been a victim of the economic crash, which caused him to lose his home and, supposedly, turn to violence.

The second answer is that radicalization takes place via the Internet, where preachers of hate circulate videos and writing that corrupts receptive minds. Terrorists, so goes this argument, become what they are through the spread of new media -- not person-to-person contact.

These two arguments, however, miss the full picture. Most terrorists come from fairly prosperous backgrounds, and though the Internet does help disseminate hate, a close look at terrorism shows that, almost invariably, a necessary step in the process to radicalization occurs in a place of worship. This doesn't mean that all mosques are bad, of course, but it does mean that some have played an important role in the West's decades-long struggle with radical Islam.

The mosque that was closed on Aug. 9 is a good example. It's better known around the world by its old name, al-Quds, where Mohamed Atta and two other of the 9/11 pilots worshipped. (It was renamed in 2008.) When the attacks took place in 2001, I went to Hamburg along with many other journalists and tried to talk to the people who ran it and worshipped there. Everyone we met said that they didn't know the plotters and that their radicalization must have taken place elsewhere.

That turned out to be exactly wrong, as police investigations later showed. In 1998, in fact, the al-Quds mosque showed up in a German police investigation. A Sudanese man, Mamdouh Mahmud Salim, had been arrested in a Munich suburb, charged with conspiring to build an al Qaeda network in Germany.

Bodo Marks/AFP/Getty Images

 SUBJECTS: AL QAEDA, ISLAM, EUROPE
 

EMMETT23

1:10 PM ET

August 10, 2010

Expertise

The above article contains major errors. There is no empirical base for the claim that the Hamburg mosque that was closed yesterday was where "several of the 9/11 terrorists were radicalized." Nor is there any empirical base for the claim that Mohamed Atta was a pilot on 9/11. In fact, the very attempt to connect Muslims to the mass murder of 9/11 is a major scandal, for the simple reason that the US authorities have never produced any tangible proof that Muslims (fanatic or else) boarded any of the aircraft allegedly hijacked on 9/11.

The absence of evidence to prove the 9/11 blood-libel against Muslims can be ascertained by anyone who has studied publicly available evidence produced by the US authorities regarding 9/11. The only question now is: Why on Earth did Foreign Policy fail to realize this fact for almost 10 years? Does US foreign policy relies on fraud?

 

EVERETT

3:53 PM ET

August 10, 2010

nutty comments

Uh, yeah, Mohammed Atta didn't fly a plane into the WTC. None of this was done in the name (however misguided) of Islam. It's all a big conspiracy. It's the whatever commission, or the elders of whatever who were all behind it. Take another toke, dude.

 

BT2160

7:18 PM ET

August 10, 2010

A Quick Aside

I thought the article was interesting, informative, and finally made a solid point at the end.
However, reading Emmett23's comment on the article was more entertaining. It's like comparing
an Errol Morris film (The Article) and an Oliver Stone film (Emmett23).

 

ELKYYY

1:37 PM ET

August 11, 2010

Expertise ? .. hardly

Most Americans know what 'baloney' is ... and can see it in the 'Expertise' post.

I would venture a simple guess, knowing that German and US counter-intelligence are not populated with idiots: the mosque was allowed to operate because that is one of the ways to catch 'bad guys'. Simple, yet effective. Undoubtably, there were other efforts going on.

9/11 should not happen again, in whatever form -- I think thatmuch we can agree on.

 

HAYDENHARNET

11:38 AM ET

August 12, 2010

I don't heard until now a

I don't heard until now a base for claiming Mohamed ata fly into WTC ,
US and European Media tried to convince the world that always Islamic people are behind all world big crimes without base , i don't say that there are not Islamic terrorist group but there is no sense to blame them for every crime in the world because it guide to more terrorism.
routers home
Hayfrn Harnet

 

ABDULAMEER

11:09 PM ET

August 10, 2010

Closing a radical mosque

What's the difference between a "radical mosque" and a non-radical mosque? All mosques teach the Koran and the sayings of Muhammad, so they are all "radical" in the sense of propagating sharia law and the doctrine of offensive jihad. However, some imams are more firebrands than others; and Moslem radicals tend to gather more in some mosques than in other mosques. So, they closed the "radical" mosque in Hamburg. So what? The "radicals" who attended that mosque will find another mosque to meet in.

Islam is NOT a religion like other religions; and Islamic scholars are the first ones to say so. For example, Yusuf Qaradawi (the most influential Muslim cleric in the world today, the spiritual head of the Muslim Brotherhood) said: "Islam is not a religion in the common, distorted meaning of the word, confining its scope only to the private life of man. By saying that it is a complete way of life, we mean that it caters for all the fields of human existence. In fact, Islam provides guidance for all walks of life — individual and social, material and moral, economic and political, legal and cultural, national and international." This "complete way of life" is the Sharia sacred Islamic law which calls for the legal subordination of non-Moslems to Moslems and of women to men; it requires death for homosexuals, apostates and blasphemers. And, it calls for eternal war (jihad) against non-Moslems until Islamic law dominates throughout the world. These doctrines all come from the Koran and the sayings of Muhammad which are preached and taught in every mosque in the world, and will be taught in the proposed mosques. People questioning the new mosques need to understand why Islam is unique and not like other religions. Then they would know that mosques are not like churches because mosques are centers for the propagation of sharia law. If Islam is not like other religions, it should not be treated like other religions. If mosques are not like churches and other houses of prayer, then mosques should not be treated like other houses of prayer. Mosques are centers for the propagation of Islamic supremacist ideology, and they should be treated like other centers for the propagation of supremacist, violent and imperialist ideology, such as the Communist Party or the Nazi Party.

 

ASHOK2718

4:33 AM ET

August 11, 2010

I think places of worship (whatever religion)

are like recreation center where people meet to more closely knit a community. There are violent things you can find in most major religion (except buddhism) it depends on the preacher whether he wants to teach peace or war. Also the community must have a level of education to discern right from wrong like at the time of reformation (Martin Luther) people questioned almost everything and didn't accepted everything blindly, this must be present in society to counter superstition and blind faith.

 

EMMETT23

2:44 AM ET

August 11, 2010

Attribution of criminal responsibility requires hard evidence

Disregarding the unfriendly comments above, I submit it is a reasonable for citizens in democratic countries to expect their government to provide hard evidence when it accuses individuals of mass murder.

The U.S. government indeed accused 19 Muslims (the alleged hijackers) of mass murder. This is an undisputed fact.

However, that government never produced any hard evidence that these 19 individuals boarded the aircraft that they allegedly hijacked, neither certified passenger lists, nor boarding cards, nor positive identification of their bodily remains. In addition, no person has actually seen these individuals board any of the flights (AA11, AA77, UA175, UA93). Finally, there exists no authentic CCTV proving that these individuals boarded these flights. There exists no CCTV at all from Boston and Newark airports (flights AA11, UA175 and UA93) and only a dubious CCTV from Dulles airport purporting to show some of the hijackers (the CCTV was released privately in 2004 and does not show the date and time of the recording).

The absence of evidence does not permit anyone to accuse these 19 individuals of mass murder. And it is certainly improper to designate someone as a nut who demands hard evidence in a criminal case.,

 

AJAX3715

2:30 PM ET

August 11, 2010

It may be surprising to many,

It may be surprising to many, but EMMETT23's comments seems to be rule rather than the exception in Muslim countries, even among high-ranked government officials. Either people such as EMMETT23 are just so closed-minded or Muslim countries must have messed up so bad in battling this type of ignorance. It can be infuriating at times, but they are here among us. We have to live with them so I guess we just have tolerate their views.

 

NICOLAS19

6:31 AM ET

August 11, 2010

give me a break

How about closing down churches where Christian fundamentalists do their prayers? They are quite radical, they commit crimes too. But here's a better idea: close down everything hat might radicalize people! Close down the shops where the prices are going nowhere but up. Close down the cinemas where they only give violent movies. Close down the parks where those "radicals" meet. Close down the pet shops where they sell unhealthy animals. Shall we all just curl up and die because you Americans are paranoids? Germany has the authority to decide on its own devices.

 

MARS

4:52 PM ET

August 11, 2010

How About

the IRA, Lord's Resistance Army, and abortion clinic bombers as modern examples of Christian terrorists? Oh, they don't count because they're not mainstream Christianity? I'm sure that's how most Muslims feel.

I realize this is minor but Hamburg's red light district, the Reeperbahn, is no where near Harburg.

 

EMMETT23

5:07 PM ET

August 11, 2010

Summary

It is a symptom of a deep social pathology when no one of the above commentators could provide the evidence to back-up the official tale on 9/11, or merely a link to a single document that proves this absurd tale. Everett, BT2160, Dr. Kuchbhi, Elkyyy and AJAX2715 found no better arguments than displaying their arrogance. I challenge you to address the factual allegations I have made, if you really believe that Muslims committed the mass murder of 9/11, and if you really believe that the perpetrators should be brought to justice. You may rely on any government document you want, but don't quote Osama bin Laden: I don't think he's a credible source.

 

AVI OF MONDOWEISS

6:56 PM ET

August 11, 2010

Ian Johnson and 5th grade education.

Ian Johnson is either clueless and ignorant or deceptive and bigoted.

First off, he would have his gullible readers believe that a person needs to be "radicalized" in order to carry out an attack on innocent civilians.

Ian Johnson would have his gullible readers believe that decades of western European colonialism, meddling, wars, destruction and dispossession are supposed to make Muslims AND Arabs happy. Yes. That's how idiotic the premise of his argument is.

Ian Johnson would have his gullible readers believe that if someone punched him in the face and broke his teeth, he would have to spend a few months at a mosque to get radicalized and only then will he go back to punch that aggressor.

He goes on to state that: "a necessary step in the process to radicalization occurs in a place of worship."

This utter nonsense. Time and again, those who carried out the attacks, those who planned them, those who were subsequently arrested for having had ties with the so-called hijackers, have clearly said that they committed these acts because of US intervention in their own countries, as well as, due to the United States' unrelenting support for Israel as it continues to brutally occupy the Palestinians, demolishing their homes and stealing their land.

In fact, the Jordanian doctor who was born in a Palestinian refugee camp in Jordan, the same doctor who carried out the suicide attack in Afghanistan killing 9 CIA officers, made it quite clear earlier that he was disillusioned and distressed after the slaughter and the killing he saw Israel commit in Gaza in 2009. An attack on innocent civilians. 1300 were killed, at least 350 of them were children. See the Goldstone Report.

Wikileaks documents on Afghanistan and the US occupation of that country, show that several hundred innocent Afghan civilians have been killed by US aerial bombings. Women and children were slaughtered in their sleep.

How about the Special Forces unit known as 373 that has been butchering Afghan civilians and non-civilians since 2001?

So, here comes Ian Johnson, attempting to convince us that with all this death and destruction, what the average Muslim or Arab really needs, is a mosque to "radicalize".

It's nonsense.

He then goes on to peddle common bigoted stereotypes: Muslims by nature believe conspiracy theories, Muslims see themselves as victims (Even though they really are victims).

He goes on to write that: "One brochure talked about the "genocide" going on in Palestine, while another bemoaned the role of Jews in the world. Almost all the worshipers were immigrants from Arab countries, and they clearly hadn't left their conspiracy-theory-ridden politics back at home."

Hasn't there been an ethnic cleansing going on in Palestine for the last 60 years? What else does Ian Johnson call the forced expulsion of 800,000 Palestinians in 1948? What else does Ian Johnson call the close to 25,000 Palestinians homes demolished by Israel between 1967 and the present? Read what Israeli historians are saying about it all. Try Tom Segev's The Seventh Million, for example. Or, read Illan Pappe's The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine.

What else would Johnson call the razing of entire villages, more than 580 villages, in 1948?

What does he call the slaughter of more than 6,500 Palestinians in the last decade (that's 10 years for the edumecated out there) alone?

And the 4 million refugees as a result of US and NATO invasion of Iraq in 2003 doesn't even factor into that. But, how about the sanctions that resulted in more than 1,000,000 Iraqi infants dying over the course of 8 years, between 1992 and 2000?

When asked if the sanctions were worth it, Madeleine Albright at the time said it was worth it.

So what is Ian Johnson blathering about with his nonsense, masquerading as truth?

But, he doesn't stop there. No. Johnson goes on to allege that there is some kind of decades-long conflict between the "West" and Islam".

Surely, Johnson must think that overthrowing a democratically elected government in Iran in 1953 was a way of saying to the Muslim world, and more specifically, Iran, that the "West" likes democracy, will promote democracy, so long as it doesn't interfere with the "West's" strategic interests. Just ask the Prime Minister Dr. Mohammad Mossadegh whom the US overthrew and installed a dictator, a friend of the "West".

Is Johnson aware that the "West", including his own government in Germany has been supporting and propping dictators throughout the Middle East for at least 40 years now? Does Ian Johnson know that Egypt's president, Mubarak, has been in power for more than 25 years now and continues to rule over Egyptians with an iron fist, torturing to death those who disagree with his policies? Does Ian Johnson know that Afghanistan was a secular, liberal and modern society in the 1960s, before "the West" invaded their country and turned it into rubble?

How about all those Mujaheddin that the US and YOUR country too, Western Germany at the time, supported? Does Ian Johnson know that the Mujaheddin were the bread and butter of the "West's" war against the Soviets? Heck the US was paying the Mujaheddin and supplying them with weapons. And these Mujaheddin were no moderates. But, Ronald Reagan called them Freedom Fighters, and the vast majority of them came from OUTSIDE Afghanistan.

So, the next time, Ian Johnson, has the urge to write nonsense, he's better off sending it to one of his friends, Geert Wilder, or Abe Foxman. I'm sure they'll both find his article to be "interesting and enlightening".

And I have one last suggestion for Ian Johnson; mind your own business and keep your nose in Germany. We sure don't need a bigot and a liar lecturing us Americans how to conduct our business, whether it's related to a Muslim cultural center or anything else -- It's not a mosque, but you didn't know that either, did you?

 

ERION2

9:59 AM ET

August 12, 2010

Just a thought

The 'West' invaded Afghanistan in the seventies....?
It seems like you have to much time to post a long tirade on the 'Western' abuse of the poor and innocent musilm world, but putting together a mess of arguments stiched together with statistics of dubius origin, will not help your argument. No regime survives without the support of a good size of the population, whoever might be supporting them from the outside. It is so easy and convenient to blame some 'western' hotel or airplane as the cause of muslim suffering and blow them to pieces. And sure, let's blow up some shia mosques in the process as they are so related to 'western' values. PLEASE....give me a break...!
Dude, take a chill pill, try to get a life, and relax. It's just a blog!

 

EMMETT23

1:37 PM ET

August 12, 2010

Blowback fantasies

There is out there a wide section of American lefties who truly believe that Muslims would attack the WTC as a response to US imperial policies. I say "believe" because they have not much evidence beyond their own speculations. In fact, most Muslims in the world, even those aware of the harm caused by US imperial policies, are not engaged in any activist, let alone military, resistance against US imperial policies. This can be ascertained by the fact that extremely few Americans or American installations are actually the object of attack around the world, including in Muslim nations. I am not referring, however, to Iraq or Afghanistan, where the US is actually the foreign occupier, only to those countries where Americans are merely the "villain".

Anyone actually interested in 9/11 must start with the basic facts, much as a criminal investigator would: Determine the time, the location, the persons present at the crime scene, etc. Anyone interested can buy a textbook on criminal investigations. Even a casual examination of existing evidence leads us to the conclusion that the US government (which accuses Al Qaeda and Muslims) for 9/11, has failed to produce any concrete evidence in support of its account, in particular regarding the identities of those who boarded the aircraft allegedly used in the attacks. Unless we see concrete, and verifiable, evidence, we are entitled to regard the official account as a monumental lie aimed at justifying US attacks on foreign countries. This reasoning has nothing to do with conspiracy theories. It is founded on the principles of criminology.

 

SREEKANTH

6:01 PM ET

August 12, 2010

Fine. Let's assume all these

Fine. Let's assume all these assorted terrorists are acting purely on political motives, not religious. Mind you, this flies in the face of all available evidence, including statements by principals such as UBL, but let's pretend.

So we observer that these various terrorists, all inspired by purely political grievances, are plotting and planning and creating support groups in their places of worship. Who would have thought ? But given that we observe this pattern, we'd be right to observe, monitor and if necessary shut down such places of worship.

Duh.

 

TG CHICAGO

4:12 PM ET

August 12, 2010

Ten years?

This is a pet peeve of mine. From the article's sub-headline:

"The only question now is: Why on Earth did it take 10 years?"

Ten years from when? The 9/11 attacks happened less than 9 years ago.

I've seen a lot of this lately (often related to the length of the Afghan War). It's as if people think we're coming up on the 10th anniversary. We've still got over a year to go!

 

BOREDWELL

7:06 PM ET

August 12, 2010

I believe that the mosque

I believe that the mosque controversy both here and abroad conflate the rantings of a few extreme fundamentalist to be those of a whole congregation. Worst, the animus is extrapolated to include 1 billion innocent and faithful adherents of Islam. Any cleric can proselytize heresy or, in this case, terrorism-cum-jihad but not succeed in turning all into an advocate/follower. It's dangerous to assume that some bad apples are reason enough to shut down this mosque. It will very well play into the hands of those who want to prove the world is anti-Islam.

 

ARHMEDNO

11:46 PM ET

August 12, 2010

I agree with your

I agree with your observation; the author seems to be biased and/or unbalanced. The article implies that mosques are an increasing tool of radicalization. A more potent argument lies in the other camp: that mosques can also be tools of positive integration, and community upbringing/uplifting.

 

ARHMEDNO

11:34 PM ET

August 12, 2010

Not a valid argument

The author, Ian Johnson, makes a major logical error in this article. In the article he describes how the "9/11" Hamburg mosque is "a linchpin in the Muslim Brotherhood's worldwide network of mosques". Does the author not know that AlQaeda is totally against the ideology of the Brotherhood? The terror group AlQaeda has on numerous occasions declared the Brotherhood to not only being too soft, but also 'munafiq' (hypocrites) + traitors. Clearly, either author did not get his sources straightened out, or he intentionally made an biased observation.

Lastly, it seems to me that the author is implying that the imam of the proposed Cordoba House center in NYC is also radical. The author's language seems to imply such, and that too is disingenuous and outright lying. Just look @ the recent announcement of the State Dept. sending imam Rauf to the Middle East to showcase what American Muslims are about & their experiences.

 

ALIGEMBA

2:52 AM ET

September 9, 2010

Life and Death of a Radical Mosque

As commented above "When experts are pressed on why young Muslims turn to terrorism, they usually give one of two answers. The first is the socioeconomic argument -- that poverty or discrimination caused the turn to violence. We heard this most recently in the aftermath of the failed bombing in New York's Times Square: The perpetrator was said to have been a victim of the economic crash, which caused him to lose his home and, supposedly, turn to violence." Search for current sports news.

 

ALIGEMBA

3:07 AM ET

September 9, 2010

Life and Death of a Radical Mosque

As commented above "When experts are pressed on why young Muslims turn to terrorism, they usually give one of two answers. The first is the socioeconomic argument -- that poverty or discrimination caused the turn to violence. We heard this most recently in the aftermath of the failed bombing in New York's Times Square: The perpetrator was said to have been a victim of the economic crash, which caused him to lose his home and, supposedly, turn to violence."