The article says that the campaign for raising funds through mobile phones has raised $10,000. It does a poor job of quantifying and highlighting the contribution of overseas Pakistanis who are going out of their way to send donations in cash and kind. Pakistanis living in the United States have contributed over $1 million in the first few days of the fundraising appeals, just by my own calculation, based on people I personally know. The actual amount has got to be far greater as I do not know a lot of Pakistani-Americans personally. I do know, from my sources, that Pakistani-Americans have chosen ways and means other than mobile phone messaging to donate. They are wiring money to their relatives and friends for making donations to Army Collection Centers, and to local charities like Edhi Foundation, Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaaf / Imran Khan Flood Relief fund, etc. They are not limiting themselves to the Red Cross, UN, and other international agencies.

But thank you, for proving the author's point. Your comment is perfectly representative of the attitude he is lamenting. Picking up statistics and throwing them back in the face of a suffering nation, comprised of a few hundred militants and 180 million ordinary people. Excellent attitude...shows that the people who are not donating to Pakistan don't suffer from any kind of fatigue, except for a very weak, tired conscience.

Firstly, my sincere condolences for the losses suffered by the Pakistani people. I hope they will recover soon and will have an improved quality of life.

The author has done a good job of highlighting the actual problem here. One need not credit him in anyway for it but lets not derive negatives out of it. Also, the author is not singling out the American populace alone. He's clearly addressing the entire humanity that is turning a blind eye to the sufferings due to their opinion of pakistani intelligence agencies and pakistani civil establishment. Frankly, one cannot blame the world for not trusting the people. what else can be said of a president who goes on a world tour when his countrymen are being ravaged by floods back home?

The pakistani authorities are responsible for this lack of concern that the world in general is showing towards pakistan today. Their double talk, political and military game play, their utterly irrational anti-India attitude (so much so that the pakistani government dint even accept the aid that India offered until they were almost ordered to do so by the American government). It's pathetic to see that the distorted mindset and cynical thought process of a few elite members of the government and military can actually precede the sufferings of millions of common pakistanis!

This aint the time for accusations or name calling. Statistics do not matter in times like this. I second the author is his call for humanitarian aid for the millions of common pakistanis who are affected by this calamity. Hope this is understood by all...

During the Haiti crisis, it was impossible to go on-line without running into URLs and links provided for connecting people to sites for collecting money. I've actually tried, a couple of times, to find specific links for sending money to an organization - like the Red Cross - for sending money, not simply to the organization, but targeting Pakistan. A better question might be, where are the links? For example, why isn't there a link from the above article to an appropriate location?

More people than you think might have sympathy for the people hit by the tragedy. But very few believe that the money would actually get to the victims. The concern is that the money would be diverted towards terrorist causes instead. It is a high price for a very stupid political policy. As a people, Pakistanis need to seriously look inward. Also, the notion that Pakistani expatriates are contributing millions of dollars is a case of fiction. They know what is going on back home, and are probably more skeptical about contributing than the rest of the population. Hey, if Musharraf, Bhutto and Sharif families release a fraction of their Swiss (or Dubai) accounts- there would be enough to provide for the flood victims.

Vichar, I think it's far more likely that people will encourage terrorism by NOT helping Pakistan through this. What happens when the world ignores them, but the Taliban is ready to step in with much needed aid?

The comment by Vichar saved me time. Spot on.

I was rather shocked by my husbands attitude to this humanitarian crisis. He said some rather horrid things about these people's plight. I, being a woman (that's a little joke, don't get all offended people), mentioned the innocents...the babies suffering from cholera, etc. He pooh-poohed that and cut to the chase: It's an all muslim country by design....muslims let the extremists run things, blow people up, want to see a Sharia backed govt ruling the entire world...He feels that the great majority of muslims actually want Sharia law everywhere, including the western nations that a lot of them flee to. He pretty much writes them all off for not stamping out the insanity in their own religion and move out of the middle ages. Does have a point....I still can't help but feel for the innocents. That said, my charity $$$ will not go here. I reserve sending my $$$ to a group that helps spread the word of what the islamofascists are doing, how they are taking over western countries, etc. By the way...I think we've already lost this game...it's all in the numbers and we are pretty much done for. But, we can still fight.

Not really. Good question when directed to America's charitable instincts, or lack thereof.

Not so meaningful when talking about Americans of Pakistani descent. Why wouldn't a Pakistani with ties to Pakistan just send money directly, or through a native organization? Why would they use the Red Cross?

Rozmin,

There is a potential downside to everything. If the rest of the world does not contribute and the Taliban fills in the void, then yes there is the risk of alienating Pakistani perceptions. But that is akin to asking for ransom money. Give to Pakistan now or else... And, probably in response to that the US at the governmental level, the UN etc. make their share of contributions.

The geopolitical issue taken care of, the follow up question is whether individuals should contribute. And here is where the problem lies. If there is absolutely no confidence that the money contributed by an individual would actually reach the victims, why would one take the risk? I might be thinking that my contribution is helping to get shelter for somebody- when in reality the dough is going towards boosting the coffers of some terrorist group. The pilferage could be direct where these organizations actually skim the money (or what the money buys). Or it could be indirect, where if the dough outsiders provide reduces the pressure on local groups to contribute- their resources are freed up to pursue destructive policies. (Actually, I don't think this limited to outsiders, even

As far as Taliban goes, let them do something constructive for a change. If they focus in rehabilitating populations instead of ruining them- why would that be a bad thing? If the outsiders' failure to contribute causes a country to depend on itself and focus inward to develop themselves instead of say spending dough to create instability that would be great. It brings a sense of self confidence and pride to a nation for the right reasons (i.e. it worked things out without significant help from outside) . Beats any pride it might have for supporting some of the most notorious criminal/terrorist/religious nuts' groups and playing a destructive political game with its neighbors that has "lose, lose" written all over it.

Stevemartin, it amazes me to see your comment.

"It's an all muslim country by design....muslims let the extremists run things, blow people up, want to see a Sharia backed govt ruling the entire world...He feels that the great majority of muslims actually want Sharia law everywhere, including the western nations that a lot of them flee to"
I am appalled that somebody would actually believe this... It's an all-muslim country yes, but I am a resident here. And nobody in my circle of acquaintances, near or far, or family, would support what you think we want. Terrorism is Pakistan's biggest problem, and is recognized as such by most of its own population. We're struggling to overcome this, and its a hard and miserable struggle, because even if the extremists are a minority, the methods they employ are devastating and have wide-spread effects. Those are the things that make the headlines, so that's all you see of Pakistan, and I can't blame you for that. But people need to be more discerning instead of applying gross generalizations and forming such frightening stereotypes.

What's more, the 'insanity' isn't inherent in the religion; no religion condones violence. It's the damned interpretations of it by extremist mullahs that twist the religion into something that is unrecognizable even to me. But that's a subjective view, so I won't elaborate on that.

You said, "I still can't help but feel for the innocents. That said, my charity $$$ will not go here. I reserve sending my $$$ to a group that helps spread the word of what the islamofascists are doing, how they are taking over western countries".
First, I would say all flood victims deserve aid, not just the ones you label 'innocents' because their stories are more dramatic or heart-wrenching.
Secondly, your charity is needed badly to save the lives and livelihoods of people. Send it through a private NGO that you trust, if you don't trust the government or the different channels sending money there so it doesn't get to the 'islamofascists'. Many people here, for different reasons, don't trust the government to get the aid where it is needed most, ,and they have begun going to the affected areas themselves. (Just an example). But if the problem is that you don't want to send aid at all, then please stop pretending that you 'feel for the innocents'.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ynews/ynews_wl3431

Please go to this link and you will find at least 10 different ways of helping the flood-stricken survivors if you intend to. Please know that not all organizations in the world, trying to help out Pakistani flood victims are corrupt. If you don't trust the Pakistani govt, then don't - no one really cares. Just help, if you support humanity.

I think the world does care about the victims of the flooding in Pakistan. What is missing is regular input of the problems there. If there was more coverage of what is happening in Pakistan, you'd see more Americans donating to the cause of aiding human beings in distress. That being said, why is it that wealthy Islamic nations are not spearheading the fund raising efforts for relief? One commenter mentioned that Americans are not sufficiently generous; I think that is a falsehood.

By the way, when the oil rig blew up in the Gulf of Mexico, how much money for the clean-up effort and for the people affected by the disaster came from Muslim countries?

There are multiple issues behind it.
1) There is no trust in Pak govt.
2) They are mad at Mr. President.
3) They are angry and disappointed that all Pakistani people elected one of the corrupt President ever in our life time.
4) Whenever there is a mishap in Pakistan, Pakistani govt. can not handle their challenges. How long do they want to keep asking for help?
5) Have you ever read the Pakistani budget? They need to revisit their budget and allocate proper funds to infra-structure.
6) All Muslims in west are trying to recover from their own challenges. Being a Muslim in west itself a challenge these days. Of course, we are still better off.
7) In general, west is not interested in helping Pakistan. There is no coverage in CNN or local news. There is too much mis-communication about every thing.

Most of Pakistanis living in west are helping by sending money to their relative so they can help effected people.

The best thing you can do is to mention few charities in Pakistan who keep their accounting on internet so all Muslims living abroad know what these charities are doing with the collected funds.

Lastly, I will urge to all people in Pakistan to take a control of your own destiny and prepare for these crisis in advance. They should prepare to handle crisis as they are preparing themselves for last 60 years to exist by spending most of their budget in Pakistani army and weapons.

The Red Cross was able to raise more than 10,000. I can testify to that because the Red Cross was one of the three choices of charity to which to donate at the World Bank fundraiser for Pakistan. Five days of fundraising raised more than 150,000 dollars, of which I am sure a major chunk went to the Red Cross. Red Cross was nominated for being known to be good at getting humanitarian aid into areas where it is needed (it doesnt really matter in the end who gives the aid, it could have been the red star for all I cared) as long as it got there.

As far as I know Pakistanis in the US are providing a huge amount of funds, which we hope will be used well. We are grateful to everybody else as well who has contributed money.

Thanx Hassan for making this point!
I think most people forget how tainted media coverage of nearly everything is. We only get to see extremes. Imagine a country with 180 million extremists. It would probably pretty much rule the world, don't you think? We cannot close our hearts to the millions of innocent people needing our help. Since everyone seems aware of the political situation I hope humanitarian organizations will find ways of helping most efficiently.
And Stevemartin, you cannot fight hatred with negligence without stooping to the level that you so fiercly reject. If we let fear run our decisions the 'muslimfascist' that you are so afraid of have already won.
Any man or woman filled with hatred will be able to use any religion as an excuse for his aggression. The only thing stronger than hate is love. If you fail to let love prevail in your own personal decisions, is there hope for the world?

My Question is this, where are the so called Muslim Brother Countries. Whenever these is a disaster in any of the Muslim countries, who rush to their aide or mobilize funds, food, water or medicines???? Its the countries from the West.

Where are the Saudi Arabias, the United Arab Emitrates, the Kuwaits, the Irans, the North African Muslim Countries etc. etc. Well, we all know the answers, they think it more beneficial to fund terrorist activities.

I completly agree with you on the politicians and the elite but this is what happens when cuntires in ANOTHER continent try to force democracy in places they dont know a thing about.
Pakistan is a heavy name and it has a LOT of issues. Issues you cant understand by reading articles. You have to be there to appreciate the complexity and come on who are you kidding? i mean politicians are politicians i bet those in your country are not bathed in holy water. thats just no excuse. I get it why the West has trouble understanding us, thats pretty predictable countries with no culture have no issues, obviously you wouldnt get it. And please DONT EVEN TALK abt the INDIAN issue. You dont know what you are talking about AT ALL. Frankly i could shoot the government for accepting the aid from a country that is now causing the floods in the other rivers by releasing water and planning out starvation by building dams on those allocated to pakistan. thats not the way to HELP.
I appreciate the author's attempt but really people here dont need beggar money. There are things like "pride" then again you wouldnt understand. And if pakistani intelligence is being blamed i wud like ppl to read history. i mean HELLOOO what did the "West" do to people here in the fight against Russia?
Admit it guys you are no better then us. You are just better disguised.

I couldn't agree with you more. I'm honestly ashamed at the level of funding that Islamic countries have collected for the flood relief efforts and the Gulf Oil Spill. I know there will always be irrational voices who like to incite hatred by making comments about america like the one you mentioned, but there are a lot of people who deeply appreciate what the americans are doing for us right now... for instance, there's a popular saying here that the Americans and Saudis are helping the flood victims in two different ways; the Americans are donating necessities and the Saudis are praying for them! ;) It's meant to be an insult to the way many Muslim countries are claiming allegiances and speaking up but failing to help! It ran in a comic strip in a national newspaper recently.
I would like to say though that now is not the time to be flinging around blame or counting who's donated what. I hope people EVERYWHERE find it in their hearts to look beyond politics and just give.

This is the classic "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario. The trouble with asking the Taliban to do some charitable work is that this becomes a PR and recruiting tool for them. Just because they help some flood victims in their own back yard doesn't make them a charitable organization; they're still terrorists working toward the destruction of the non-Islamic West. They'll just be the terrorists who ALSO saved you and your family, when the non-Islamic West abandoned you to the ravages of the great flood.

But there's no reason to believe that much of anything donated to the Pakistani relief will ever make it to the individuals who need it. Anything that's going through the Pakistani government is going to wind up like pretty much everything else that's gone through the Paskistani government. Add to that uncomfortable fact that the US and the rest of the world are in the midst of their own financial crisis, and charities the world over are hurting for funds, and we certainly have had more than our share of expensive natual disaters of late, and it becomes harder and harder to crack open our wallets - yet again - to throw some more money down yet another hole.

If Pakistan is so proudly Muslim, why aren't some of the oil-rich Musim nations of the Middle East taking the lead? I'm sure there's a couple of billion dollars lying loose in Kuwait that could repave every road in Pakistan. Are they taking this author's heat as well?

So... you're saying that you DON'T want "beggar money" from the West in general and the US specifically? That certainly makes things a little easier on this side. When our politicians have been washed in holy water and meet your standards of excellence, we'll get back to you about helping out financially. In the meantime, I'm sure your pride will get all of those roads cleared and your people fed and housed. Best of luck!

Because most of them have donated to Islamic charities such as Islamic Relieve and Helping Hands.

Actually they were reluctant to accept indian aid of 5 million earlier, the US had to coax them into it . then India offered another $ 20 million, which Pakistan was too embarrassed to accept and it asked India to route the money through the UN .... so that it looks like the UN is giving the money and not India. At a time when the same floods have devastated northern India too, although that news is completely overshadowed, because Pakistan cries louder

Quite a big change from the last time when India sent blankets, tents, clothes to the victims of Pakistani earthquake and Pakistani authorities made sure that the MADE IN INDIA labels were removed before the aid reached the Pakistani people.

I HATE my govt. I cant believe they are helping the very nation whos entire national policy is to destroy India ....and has resulted in so many of my countrymen dying. Pakistanis were out on the streets rejoicing when 9/11, mumbai attacks ..... happened and now they expect help... oh let me rephrase that, we are begging them to take our help! as if they even remember ...as soon as this is over they will be back to burning flags and bombing our countries

Pakistan has 750,000 army. Why ! because the country is stuck between Afghanistan and India (who has never accepted the country).

What did it do to prepare itself for a natural calamity?
Can any Country prepare for a calamity of this size few numbers....
5th of the country flooded
15 ~ 20 Million homeless / affected. (total Poluation is 140Million)
6 Million need emergency assistance.
Is US prepared to have this size of Calamity, i know we are not, when we had the floods few years ago.

Finally, if you do not have the money just Say No, but tont lecture the country, we heard a lot of numbers during 2005 earthquake but no money so just Shut Up!

I. Pakistani army is smaller than US army and we need it to defend ourselves. If you don't know Pakistani history, India and Pakistan have never had very friendly relations with each other since partition; we helped bring down Russia; and separated from Bangladesh after a war. Same as Israel, we need to defend ourselves from countries that we consider hostile around us. Check the total and active per capita troops in both countries:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_size_of_armed_forces

II. After the 2005 earthquake, the government, forces and citizens did all that was possible to help aid the affected. My maternal family is from Kashmir and I know for a fact that people, even in remote areas and not just big cities, were given enough aid to help them build their homes and start earning their livelihoods again. What we did to better prepare ourselves was to work with architects and organizations to help design homes that would stand the test of similar disasters in future, since Kashmir up to Islamabad are on active faults and similar incidences might occur, God forbid.

III. Nobody in Pakistan supported England's tour of our President and he was heavily criticized both within and outside Pakistan. He was only supported by some of his followers in his own party but didn't get any support for that. That does not prove flood victims to be any less human than if the tour had not taken place.

IV. American government lies and misleads its own people and your own media says so. You claim to be a land of nations but have poor tolerance for other nations/ people who are different from you. Fortunately for Pakistanis, we have internet here as well. We are not sitting idle begging for aid from US. It's no easy feat to support 20 million displaced people. You see aid camps in all cities on all streets that are still safe. Army is doing an incredible job in reaching out to people with no direct access; and NGOs and civilians are doing an amazing job in reaching people through roads. Personally know a lot of friends who have taken supplies and are very actively involved in these efforts.

V. F16 was probably a big deal in the 90s. The world has advanced too much after that. Plus nobody could foretell that such a calamity would befall a nation. We are not begging for aid from “US”. But I think that expecting humans to help fellow human-beings at the time of need is not an unjust expectation.

It is time Pakistan is held responsible for its actions. They keep blaming India and the US for all their problems. The elites in Pakistan continue to steal and not pay their taxes. The ISI and the military continue to concentrate the national budget/aid towards the military and not civilian development. The ISI has hoodwinked the west and undermined Afghanistan. After receiving billions from the US, The Pakistani government continues to allow the ISI to arm the Haquani network that has ambushed and killed US soldiers serving in Afghanistan. As an American citizen this is what I have to say "You fool me once shame on you; fool me twice shame on me"

Having said this I do believe the poor victims of the floods should be supported. However, the support should be provided via NGO's and the UN with strict oversight.

It is time Pakistan decides between spending billions on arms vs. investing to build a modern dynamic state

WE ARE NOT BEGGING. THE FUCKED UP POLITICIANS ARE. Pakistan has and can manage without you low-lives. You are judgmental to a level that is.. beyond words. then again u think is al-qaeda really doing wrong?
p.s : osama bin laden ho-ho's adress is : the white house.
get over 9/11, live here it ll open ur eyes. i dont know why americans are such pussys. UGHHH

You said: "Did Pakistan have this poor image ... when ... supplying ... the Mujahideen to defeat the USSR...?

1. Pakistan was not doing the US any favour then nor now. Pakistani elites offered their services to the US in exchange for billions of US dollars and ship-loads of arms designed to be used against neighbors.

2. After the USSR was was defeated, it was Afghanistan (not Pakistan) that was abandoned by the US! Pakistan continued to get US aid until the embargo following Pakistan's nuke test.

3. It is the same story being repeated now, except that Pakistan has been caught playing a double game. Pakistan's Punjabi dominated military-mullah-terrorist militant alliance is now being watched carefully by the world. The floods are victimizing the weakest sections of Pakistan's citizens, while the elites have long since left for safety.

4. It is interesting to see the same English speaking elites of Pakistan shouting loudly for international aid as they sit in comfort far away from the misery of ordinary Pakistanis caught in the floods.

Islam is a religion not a race!

Palestine, Iraq Saudi Arabia Iran Afghan are completely irrelevant and including Pakistan are all Multi Racial Multi Ehtnic nationalities not a race!!!!

Unfortunately, Pakistanis constantly tell the world that the world is not welcomed there, and that Westerners in particular suffer low popularity ratings. They always keep saying they want to be left alone. Western religious organizations, which are leaders in charitable activities, are automatically accused of religious conversion, and local Pakistani religious leaders have done nothing to condemn attacks like the recent ones where a group of doctors were killed by Taliban.

Now suddenly, when disaster has struck, the Pakistanis want to do a 180, and disavow everything that they have been harping on for years. Is it any wonder that the world feels skeptical?

I remember reading recently that the wealthy Pakistanis pay hardly any tax at all, resorting mainly to tax evasion. This has robbed Pakistan's treasury of huge sums of money. Is that any way to run a country? Even the Greek govt recently announced a crackdown on tax evaders in the wake of its debt scandal - will Pakistanis do the same? Or will they continue to place the onus for sustaining their nation upon the rest of the world?

Religionism

1. The irrational belief that followers of different religions have distinctive cultural characteristics determined by hereditary and religious factors and that this endows followers of certain other religions with an intrinsic superiority over others, viz. Religion A good vs Religion B Bad; god's chosen people implying others are god's rejects.

2. Abusive or aggressive behaviour towards followers of another religion on the basis of such an irrational belief.

http://www.haaretz.com/jewish
http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/news/canadian-jewish-committee-to-send-aid-to-pakistan-1.309219

Doesn't look like "religiousism" to me. Israel gave Pakistan aid for the 2005 earthquake by the way. I'm not sure why they haven't offered now. Maybe it's because they think they won't accept it considering how long it took them to accept India's aid. They also sent teams to Turkey following their earthquake about a decade ago which is a predominantly Muslim country.

Why you insist on making this issue about Israel I'm not sure.
Yes, the world has been slow to respond. The people of the U.S. doesn't seem to care like they did in Haiti.
But as much as you point fingers at all these parties, you need to blame the Pakistani establishment themselves for mismanaging this situation horribly.

2. Abusive or aggressive behaviour towards followers of another religion on the basis of such an irrational belief.

It appears that Islam fosters hatred of those who are not Muslims because it enables them to justify robbing, killing, raping and enslaving non-Muslims as "God's Will". Since Muslims clearly find robbing, killing, raping and enslaving others to be rewarding and enjoyable activities, I guess we would have to agree that their belief is not irrational. And the belief of the rest of us that the world would be a better place without them is pretty damned rational, too.

I am pleased to see that the Pakis' determination to return to the seventh century is being helped along by the Hand of Allah. Can't happen fast enough.

Sure, just keep trying and after a few iterations you might come up with a theory that isn't totally idiotic. I won't hold my breath though.

American people are the most generous. Individual charity contributions exceed corporate contributions by a wide margin. If you think you can coarse then into chipping in by calling names, you are mistaken.

At government level, both Pakistan and West took advantage of each other in the past and at individual level there is not much that can be done.

At personal level, I am wary that my contributions will reach the people in despair. Redcross or not I wouldn't trust anything that goes out there. Pakistan spends around 20% of GDP on military and it made it's choices. People of the world watched how previous aid were appropriated. You can fool everyone only so much.

Psssst...he is a bigot that is why

How about the private contractors of Pakistani army? Fair is fair

Why are the notoriously tax-evading Pakistani rich not paying their taxes, to pay their dues to their country? The Pakistani wealthy hardly pay anything - do they have any moral highground in asking others to foot bills that they should be paying?

Pakistan likes to speak of all the "brotherly Muslim" countries that it maintains close ties with. If you're calling the Muslims your brothers first, then why are you looking to the West for aid first?

Charity begins at home.

A few points in your post that I found extremely funny and ignorant on your part which I'd like to point out.
You say "Pakistani non-support for the Afghan US effort makes sense". Non-support to afghan US efforts is not the same as support to taliban/extremists. Pakistan wouldn't have been a failed state (refer to FP's failed states index) and a global diplomatic headache had it stayed neutral. Instead, fueled by its irrational anti-India sentiments, it backed the extremists and still is doing so (I hope u wouldn't deny this against all the insurmountable proof support this fact). And result is in front of all to see.
You say "Pak military is stronger". Remember Kargil my friend? Pak army was defeated so bad that they fled the war zone without even burying their dead soldiers. And even if we do somehow assume that the pak military is strong (owing to all the support they'd receive from all the taliban/lashkar terrorists), America wont come alone. The US war in Afghanistan and Iraq were support both diplomatically and on ground by dozens of countries. These were called the 'Allied' forces. And that is what's gonna come to pak. But I hope that scenario will never happen. A full blown war is the last thing the sub continent presently needs...

Why did so many Pakistanis welcome General Musharraf in overthrowing elected Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif?

Why do so many Pakistanis march in anti-Western demonstrations? Why do they on the one hand angrily denounce the West with low poll ratings, and then from the other side quickly beg to the West for money?

Have they no sense of ethics?

I won't bother going into the complexity of Kargil but suffice to say it wasn't a rout. Second my point is that compare to Iraq and Afghanistan, Pakistan is less of a pushover, and I am not trying to score machismo here just pointing out facts (A proper military unsanctioned and having recieved lost of military aid over past 10 years). So you may try to provoke me but it won't work. Facts are what they are. Considering Global security for whatever reasns Pakistan is worthy of aid - not delivering it maymake you feel righteous but is counter-productive. Key example the 2005 Earthquake where international efforts went unnoticed by pakistani's because everything was routed through a military dicatator an civilians were ignored. I am no fan of Zardari but principles have to be adhered to especially when times are tough.

Rigel, this is first time i am hearing US had a lot of support in invading Iraq on a pack of lies. Could you name those countries.
As for Kargil, it was actually American pressure who made Pakistan withdraw

Sanman,

I wonder why does American/Indian buy oil from Saudi when they hate them so much

Your utter ignorance about the US led war in Afghanistan is appalling to say the least. A simple google search would've led you to a million sites which detail the US war effort in Afghanistan. But being the 'frog in the well', I suppose you haven't heard about google and wikipedia so I'm attaching a like here for your reference.
"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_in_Afghanistan_%282001%E2%80%93present%29"
If you carefully look at the 'Belligerents' section in this article, you'll see that the Taliban was attached by a coalition of 35 countries! I hope you can read the rest, that is assuming you can actually READ!

As far as Kargil is concerned, your comment on this topic only furthers the fact that you are as ignorant as any pakistani army personal. Check this link out.
"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kargil_war"
Check out the sections 'causalities' and 'World Opinion' and you'll know where exactly pakistan stood. Even if you do agree that American pressure was the main reason Pakistan fled the war leaving dead bodies of your army men behind to rot in the hills, have you ever wondered why this pressure came about? I pity your ignorance.

You are a typical case of pakistani mentality and thought process. The terrorism you bread in your own backyard is back firing, the international community has lost faith in you so much so that they are actually ignoring humane crisis in your country, you rank in the global top 10 failed states along side countries like Somalia and Congo, close to a 3rd of your country is under militant control, and yet, here you are gloating over a war you lost and an army which strives on promoting a global evil! I cant help but wonder what can become of a country with such people.

Another testimony to your ignorance stands out when you state that India hates Saudi Arabia. How are you even surviving, let alone commenting on sites like this? Saudi Arabia was the 4th largest trade partner of India as on FY2008 with a total trade of $23.11billion! That's close to 6% of pakistan's entire GDP (I'm assuming here that you actually know what GDP, trade, etc means, although given your level of ignorance, I doubt you would!)

India hates nobody. Fact is, pakistan cant stand India's growth and it's strong position in the world. You are yet again a blatant proof of pakistan's thought process that only think's of maligning India. Grow out of it for your own sake. This discussion was about Relief to the flood victims in your own country! Currently, you are only 9th in the failed states Index. If such a mentality continues, it wont be long before you displace Somalia to claim the first place!

Telling people that they are ignorant and calling them names doesn't make your argument more persuasive either to the person you are insulting or to other readers. It doesn't make you sound smarter nor more correct. To some people, calling those you are arguing with names makes the name caller sound defensive, petty and childish; if some people will see it that way, why reduce the force of your argument by turning people off.

This isn't like Jerry Springer where rating points are scored by outrageous behavior. I thought the point of this website is to become more knowledgeable about the world and our foreign policy and to help others understand us better.

@SAMEER9900, the claim Rigel made about allies in the war was about all the allies who went to war against Al Qaeda and the Taliban in Afghanistan, and there were many allies.

Iraq was an entirely different matter.

First, the Bush administration didn't intend to abandon Afghanistan when they went to topple Saddam; they actually (though foolishly) thought that U.S. involvement in Iraq would only last a couple of months. When Bush stood on that aircraft carrier with the big sign behind him saying "Mission Accomplished," they really thought they were done. Many people, including people in the military (and the Army War College) tried telling the administration before the invasion, that it wasn't going to be quick & that a lot more troops were needed. It may be hard to believe that they really thought it would be that fast, but it's true. President Bush ended up with egg on his face afterward for having orchestrated the whole "Mission Accomplished" ceremony; they would not have done something so embarrassing if they had believed they'd be in Iraq for another 6+ years. Also, the Bush administration fired one of our best generals because he contradicted them about Iraq not taking long and the job being done with few troops.

Second, while the Bush administration's mistake about how long U.S. involvement in Iraq would take did have the unintended result that a large part of U.S. forces and the country's attention were diverted away from Afghanistan for several years, the U.S. didn't "cut and run." They just started having to divert more and more troops and attention to Iraq as time went by and things in Iraq got worse and worse. Still, the U.S. never left Afghanistan, there just weren't enough troops to do much in Afghanistan other than tread water. The Taliban took advantage of this and fought to regain territory and influence while the U.S. military was shorthanded, but Afghanistan was never abandoned.

Now, I know there's a lot of talk about whether President Obama is intending to cut & run because he set a projected date to start the withdrawal of troops. He doesn't and the reason for setting projected deadlinesand is obvious. The U.S. is a country where the populace's support is necessary for prolonged involvement in war, at least if the political leaders want to stay in power (otherwise, think LBJ). The people of the U.S. are quite war weary after all these years in Afghanistan and Iraq. In order to make it politically feasible to ramp up in Afghanistan even before beginning withdrawals in Iraq, the President gave a starting date for the beginning of draw-down in Afghanistan (not the date for leaving).

More importantly, indicating that there is a limit to U.S. military commitment is intended to stop the political leaders in Afghanistan from dawdling. It was a message that they won't have the U.S. around forever to back them up and provided funding, so they'd better move as quickly as they can on the things they have to do to bring stability and order to their country. This same strategy was employed in Iraq and hasn't worked very well since it's been almost 6 months and they haven't even agreed on a government despite knowing U.S. withdrawal was coming. Now there's also a deadline for "complete" withdrawal in Iraq - which really won't mean all troops and all U.S. influence out. That date comes from the "Status of Forces Agreement" with Iraq. Yet, there have already been hints that we'd be willing to stay longer if Iraq asks us and if it can demonstrate progress. So, the meaning and intention of these draw down dates is clear.

Is this a smart strategy to also follow with Afghanistan? I don't know. We may not know for a long while; perhaps we'll never know since we can't know what would have happened with a different strategy.

It is unreasonable, however, to expect the U.S. to stay in Afghanistan indefinitely, especially in the absence of progress by Afghanis themselves. The U.S. did not create Al Qaeda, nor the Taliban. The Taliban was plaguing Afghanistan long before 9/11. There are self-interest reasons for the U.S. continuing to help Afghanistan in its fight against the Taliban, but they are not major reasons.

Is it understandable that if you run into financial problems a friend may help you, but say "I can help you but only this long" or "only for this much"? Even if the friend did things in the past that contributed partly to your problems, is it reasonable to expect the friend to help you forever, even when the help doesn't seem to be making things better for you?

Although a portion of the U.S. population is anti-war altogether, and another larger portion is war weary, the U.S. has no intention of cutting and running on Afghanistan, nor on Pakistan, but how much the U.S. helps depends in part on what Afghanistan and Pakistan, respectively, do in the meantime.

"I wonder why does American/Indian buy oil from Saudi when they hate them so much"

...... well Americans and Indians dont burn Saudi flags! or bomb their cities or kill their citizens where ever they can find them

My friend, India is home to more Muslims than there are in pakistan. Over 700,000 Pakistanis live and work in the US, besides other Muslims from all over the world. UK too has an established muslim population! Get your facts straight and your brain repaired before you label any country as Islamophobic!

You know why your so called muslim brother are not coming forward to help you? It's not Islamophobia, it's pakistanophobia! Even the arabs are weary of doing business thanks to your military's strong association with terrorists and your government's inept inability to deal with your military!

Besides, pakistan is surviving on western aid. Have some shame, will ya? don't drill a whole in the plate you eat from!

""I do not expect anything from USA,UK or India since they are already Islamophobic nations.""

We have more muslims in America than Christians in South Asia; and there has ben no religious violence between muslim Americans and anyone else. Muslims in the UK also - by and large - find the country so welcoming that it is usually the #1 location muslims want to have their children educated, and where many wish to resettle. India has had less violence between muslims and hindus in the last few years than Pakistan has had with Muslim-on-Muslim violence between extremist sects and more mainstream or niche groups.

I'm not sure how you define, "Islamophobia"; impassioned criticism of the Park51 mosque at Ground Zero? Perhaps. But that's pretty small potatoes compared to say, people blowing themselves up at Sufi shrines because they consider them apostates?, or stoning women to death for infidelity? Or smashing planes into a building?

The islamic world's reputation in 'the West' is entirely of its own making; its not like there's some inherent bias that Americans or Brits have against Muslims that wasn't directly created by the experiences of Islamic terrorism, or rampant irrational behavior by muslim communities against the US. (e.g. recall that Pakistanis burned down the US embassy, killing a few people, in 1979, because of irrational and false beliefs that Americans/Jews were somehow behind the terrorist attacks in the Grand Mosque @ Mecca. I don't recall Americans every burning down anyone's embassies in the last century or so. Or ever.

So if you want to start calling nations "phobic" of anything, first look at yourself, then maybe do a little compare/contrast. I find comments like this a little laughable in the context of Pakistan suffering from violent religious extremism nearly every day. Most Americans believe we're fighting "Islamic terrorism"; not "Islam". There is a difference, and most are able to distinguish between the two. The proportion of Americans who are "phobic" of Islam is certainly less than South Asian muslims are of say, Judaism, something with which they likely have zero experience.

Aside from that point, I very much agree with your comment that response from wealthy Muslim nations has been sorely lacking in the past. Saudi Arabia is happy to fund Madrassas, but not feed victims of natural disasters, which is something of a shame. But one should not discount the contributions of the West, which typically ultimately foot the bills in the end for recovery efforts in events like these. The author of this piece seems to be sometimes contradicting themselves in saying it's "everyone" that should be caring about this topic (which I agree with!), but then only highlighting American lack of initial response.

I agree with you that aid should come from other Muslims. Where is the so-called Muslim brotherhood that so many oil-rich Middle Eastern countries boast of? Why is the US always one of the first countries to send aid? Has Pakistan never heard of the quote "Don't bite the hand that feeds you"? I think the US should stop giving aid and then we shall wait and see if Pakistan's wealthy allies come to save their fellow Muslim brothers...

I think you raise some very valid points in your extensive response. I am Pakistani, and I am affected by this flood. And it's painfully obvious to most of us, that most of the mess that Zaidi is talking of, is our own doing.

You seem rather angry about Pakistan's nuclear status. It's ok; you're not alone- since I'm equally frustrated by the fact that we have one too many nukes, and not enough medicine. I agree, again.

You're angry about Pakistan's lack of tolerance for minorities. Again, that is nothing someone like Zaidi or I am proud of. We fight these battles with our own people day in and day out, as educated Pakistanis.

But, let's get honest here: every time someone brings up the poor treatment of Muslims in India by Hindus, we are shown pictures of Muslim Bollywood stars on red carpets and told "Look- Shahrukh is a star; who said we don't love Muslims?". Never mind burning them alive in many a riot orchestrated by ministers in the government, of course. This article was really not anti-India in the least; I wonder why you got so incensed just because Zaidi used the words 'gaga over India'. So are you saying that he's not even entitled to an opinion now? If India's teaching the world anything, it's democracy in large numbers- which values above all, the freedom of expression. I am still wondering how you managed to interpret a journalist's humanitarian as 'us versus them, anti-India' writing.

This article was attempting to connect with readers on a personal level, alongside an admission of problems galore. You see, the thing I'm realizing about being a Pakistani, is that we serve the world as 'what NOT to do in the precarious field of nation building'. No one's made this many mistakes, in such a short time. But we're human- and to kick us while we're down is leaving the 170 million of Pakistan questioning how human the rest of the world is, too.

Like it or not, no one's been as undeniable as Pakistan for the last 60 some years. Yes, we're nation of emotional and fundamentalist people- but we're so much more; you know this already.

You read our well-edited newspapers- whether to monitor or for personal interest. You certainly knew of Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan's genius as a singer (by the way the birthday celebrations were held back here in Lahore in light of the morose brought on by the floods). You know of our technical and professional expertise, especially in the American and European diaspora. And as for your comment on scenery not being an achievement of the people- I'm sorry: we build the roads and infrastructure that get you there, enjoy it, and then share it with the world. You're reading this post thanks to a very versatile internet backbone that Pakistan has. It is the very same internet that has brought on a new found realization amongst Pakistanis that personal freedoms really, really matter. So you see- Zaidi is right; there is much we are good at- but there's a long, long way to go. Sample any blog or newspaper, and you won't find the vigor of debate equalled in any other developing country. Pakistan is changing- for the better more than the worse. It's just that we're spending more time figuring ourselves out, than publicizing it. So excuse us for trying to improve human rights laws, checks and balances on the judiciary and runaway organizations like the ISI- for we are too busy fixing things to be blowing our horns about them just yet. Sure, our government is corrupt. Sure, our morals are suspect. But we are human. Again, we are human, and all we are asking, is for the world to remember that beneath inflated stock points, GDP growth indicators, shiny factories and hyper-developed metropolises, they are, as well.

This article was appealing to the readers to reach into the depths of their humanity, and set aside heavy analyses of the sort that you've served, and just see if you could have helped.

It's quite clear to see that you're not on board, and that is perfectly alright, sir. We are only appealing to humanity now- not nations, not organizations and certainly not armchair commentators. I think that if you can't help out- the least you can do, is not make matters worse with loaded commentary, written in an angered instruction format, as if the comments of this blog go straight to the foreign policy desk in Islamabad's offices of power. Zaidi is but an author. Your 6 pillars of savior wisdom would be better served at a meeting with our foreign minister and other elites who we quite frankly, have nothing to do with. But we both know that as concerned human beings, sleazy politicians are not people we waste our time on. We've rolled up our sleeves and pants, and started to fight off the devastation of the floods. There are numerous problems here. But we'll fix them, whether commentators like you choose to mock us along the way, or not. I'm writing this on behalf of the 20 million affected people who will benefit not so much from the relief assistance, as they will from your open minds.

Mr Siddiqi, the fact is that Pakistan's own rich and wealthy don't pay their share of taxes to keep the country afloat, and yet are now running around trying to drum up money from the rest of the world to foot the bill that Pakistan's better off people refuse to pay.

The Pakistani upper classes are the source of the corruption in the country, and then they have the audacity to quickly turn around and demand that foreigners prop up their country.

A house divided cannot stand.

Aurangzeb Khan
lalqila.wordpress.com

Mr Siddiqi, Firstly allow me to recognise that your comments are much more balanced then most Pakistani's comments I have come across in most forum. So that was refreshing.

With your disarming charm however, you have tried to compare two incomparable. In India major instance of rioting was in 2002 in Gujarat while in Pakistan you know how it is- everyday persecution for minorities! No, I am not talking about Shahrukh Khan here. If you want to compare, do remember that Pakistan CONSTITUTIONALLY banns a minority to be Prime Minister or President. You also know status of the same in India. So please, let us not compare status of minorities and their rights in India (a secular democracy where PM and Presidents have been from Minorities) v/s Pakistan.

If you want audience to connect to Mr Zaidi's human appeal you need to understand your audience. Just by saying "we are in trouble, help us in name of humanity" is truth but not enough. To get support, one has to understand that wider world needs an assurance that its help will not be siphoned off this time (like in 2005) by groups like Jamaat Ud Dawa or ISI.

You have conveniently (and cleverly) avoided responding to some suggestions like giving up Nukes, becoming secular and transforming Pakistan in a modern, secular nation! By calling my suggestions as "6 pillars of wisdom" would perhaps belittle my comments. But it will not change the reality.

If you found my comments acidic, such is the taste of truth Sir!

Just for your record, my user name is "Aryabhat" not Aryabhatt". Also, I am NOT Indian. I am British. Thirdly, yes, I cherish everything that is good irrespective of its religious origins. That includes my love for Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan's Sufi Qawallis and respect for Pakistani columnists like Dr Farukh Salam and Kamran Shafi. I have been to Ajmer Sharif, Bodhi Gaya, Golden Temple as well as Kedarnath and prayed. What you call my "anger" is not to Pakistanis. That anger is for the virus of intolerance that is pervading its society.

>>>You know of our technical and professional expertise, especially in the American and European diaspora.

No, actually I don't, at least in the US. Most of the high tech South Asians I see are Indians. Sorry to be so blunt about it, but you sound like the kind of guy who will face facts. Let me know if you have facts/stats to prove otherwise.

First British deprived them when leaving the sub-continent and then screwed them over when India them in 1965 and 1971 western world world looked the other way.

Pakistan has been fending for themselves from the first day in 1947, I think Americans who nuked Japan twice (still the only country who used it against any country) their Citizens should not preach about small army.

Another reason, because the US army is too chicken to fight they send unmanned drones to do their dirty work, so dont talk about US has a smaller army.

Do not tell others what to do, if you can help, Fine!. Otherwise keep your pennies for your friday night liquor and lap-dance. Pakistanis are a proud nation. they will come out of this as well, with the help of Allah......BECAUSE THIS is Pakistan....

I do not agree there is persecution for minorities - it is a perception created by the Anti-Islam media. Presidents have been muslim who is actually a figure head as in your style of government it is the PM who runs the affairs. How many of them were from lower cast, let alone Muslims in the history of India.
on the other hand, Pakistan's highest Court, Supereme Court's Chief justice has been from a Monirity, specially Hindu.
Sine this conversation is regarding ontributions, there are several very good non-government organizations EDHI, FATMID, Citizens's Foundation who are doing a great job, so lets keep this onversation within perspective.
Subject of Nukes, India built it first and has been refusing to sign No-First-Strike treaty, so they are not so clean either. Since they have already tried twice. Was that Pakistan who invaded in the middle of the night. NO, this has always been India's mode of operation, striking in dark.
Your comments are ertainly acidic and irrelevant to the article's context.

That was very Narrow minded and quite ill-informed person's response. Your response reaks of immaturity and to a greater degree bias, otherwise even indians who atually know the truth dont say this openly.

Pakistan professionals have been present in everywalk of life, from medicine to aerospace, well before Indians started to come out from India. Yes there are many India upstarts, plying the streets but these are numbers people who made a difference in the development of the western world have already taken retirement after having made the diference.

Um, you might want to brush up on your history there a bit, pal. Pakistan was a creature of the British who favored the Muslims, generally speaking, over the Hindus and accordingly encoured the split between India and Pakistan.

As far as the US being 'too chicken to fight' - well, the US not being willing to fight is not a complaint I have heard much recently, so at least your comment is novel. The reason the the US launches drone raids at Al Queda in Pakistan is precisely for the opposite reason - the Pakistani army doesn't want to get its hands dirty by policing their own country, don't want to be seen as letting the US Army operate on their soil, so they step aside and let the US take care of AQ elements with drones. That, sadly, is a fair example of typical Pakistani double dealing - it allows the US to take any heat for causualties while allowing the Pakistani Army to sit on the sidelines and not get blamed for any collateral damage - total commitment to anti-jihadism is hardly notable in Pakistan.

I find it humorous that you feel the need to bring up the atomic bombings of Japan - 65 years later and completely out of context. It doesn't speak well for your ability to think logically.

When there was Katrina in US, there were some countries who sent aid, but I can bet there was no individual who said US should scrap it nuclear weapon to help its own people. I wonder what you would say about it.
As for Pakistan being secular or not, why you have problem with it? That is what Pakistani chose. Islam is our way of life.
I wonder if Indian govt would ask Saudi to become secular. If you do not, then you are really an hypocrite.period.

Mr Siddiqui, I am an Indian and proud to be one. I also appreciate the fact that every person is proud of his/her motherland/fatherland depending on how you call your nation. India and Pakistan have not been able to get past their differences for past 60 plus years. However, this is an unforeseen and critical time for 20 million people of Pakistan as is being reported and such times demand getting over personal differences. These can wait as has been the case for last 60 plus years. Those who can help should do so in whatever little manner they can and if they cannot directly help, they should simply pray for these affected people to overcome their moments of difficulty as soon as possible.

Let me help explain some of the reluctance of financial aid on the part of some of my Western colleagues and from me specifically. From my personal experience. I have always been , as a Westerner , a rather generous financial supporter of humanitarian aid whenever there has been a natural disaster. I am not an Uber-rich capitalist , but I earn a comfortable living and believe in a personal obligation to help those in need whether locally or abroad. I have donated money to almost every major cause or disaster, regardless of a particular country's political or religious persuasion for the majority of my adult life. I have sincerely believed my entire life that violence is the last resort of a limited mind.

With these things in mind , I would hope you see the following experience from my perspective.

After your 2005 earthquake in Pakistan I donated a generous amount of money to aid Pakistan as I felt the need was great and although I have always expected some of my donation to go to some source other than intended (political graft, etc) I truly believed what I was doing was helping decent people in need.

About 6 months after my donation, a young man that attended school with my daughter came home from Afghanistan to be buried by his parents whom I know well. One of his fellow soldiers attending the funeral explained to me the explosive device that had ended his young life had come from Pakistan.

The question that wanders relentlessly through my mind is: "Did I somehow pay for the device that killed this fine young man?"

Needless to say my financial contributions will not be forthcoming anytime soon, and I have made it my personal mission to see no other money does either. I have written to my elected officials explaining my utter disgust about this and have sworn that if they vote for any financial or military aid , I will finance their political opponent during the next election with every penny I have.

Maybe this helps explain some of it for you

Firstly, you must forever thank British for creating Pakistan. In fact for converting Mr Jinnah towards partition during his 6 years in 1030s in UK. Before that stay Mr Jinnah had not even thought about two nation theory! So…..

Secondly, in 1971 world looked the other way because it KNEW that West Pakistanis were butchering Bengalis! As for 1965, Pakistan got what it deserved.

As for US using Drones, get REAL Dude (“Luki” or unlucky), wars have been won by superior technology. IF they can kill without loosing their men, why would they waste precious lives in name of bravado?

IF Pakistanis are SO proud, why the hell they are begging all around the world in name of this disaster? I can use my money for whatever I like, lap dance or throw it in bin. At leats that way it would not be used to kill others like me whom you call “Infidels”!

Sorry, my previous note should read "1930s", not "1030s" pls.

Dear Sameer, NO ONE would ask US to renounce Nukes when Katrina hit it because USA did not go around the world with begging bowl! I had clearly said WHY Pakistan should be asked to remove Nukes. BECAUSE rest of the world do not feel secure with Nukes being in backyard of Jihadi ISI!

Pakistan being secular would reduce the venom its population is being inculcated in every walk of its life. Citizens of secular countries turn out a bit more tolarant then of Religious countries, especially Islamic ones. That is WHY it should be asked to become Secular.

Indian Govt would not ask Saudis to be secular because Saudis do not go around the world with BEGGING BOWL like Pakis do!

If you don’t get this then you are in DENIAL!

Luki, IF Presidents are only figure heads, India had Non-Muslim Prime Ministers too. Forget Dalit ones, even NON-HINDUS! Go back to your history class please!

As for Pakistan, which one is only “Figurehead” position in your opinion, President or PM? BOTH Positions are BANNED for Non-Muslims! Supreme court chief justice was NOT a Hindu – he was BLOCKED by your Jamaat brothers to be even a temporary Chief Justice. And as for Chief Justice, there have been so many in India from all backgrounds, Dalit, Non-Hindus, etc etc….

Forget all that, even today, ONLY Nobel prize winner Pakistani’s gravestone has been amended to REMOVE “Muslim” because he was from a minority ISLAMIC sect! Even in death he is not allowed a dignified like as a “Muslim”! If this is how you treat great achievers from Islamic minorities in Pakistan, imagine what it is for ordinary Non-Muslims!

So please, get REAL dude! Indian and Pakistani systems are NO comparison. Don’t even try! It won’t sell!

As for Nukes, India built it because there is NO Comparison between Pakistan and Indian in Military terms India’s concern is Chinese. Pakistan had to be stopped in its genocide of Bengalis. Else, India has always respected boundaries, its Pakistan that keeps exporting its terror.

IF my comments are acidic, so it TRUTH my friend!

Dear Sir,
You stated in your response "No, actually I don't, at least in the US. Most of the high tech South Asians I see are Indians. Sorry to be so blunt about it, but you sound like the kind of guy who will face facts. Let me know if you have facts/stats to prove otherwise."

I am an American who works in the computer industry here in America. I have worked with many Indians and Pakistani on large and small computer contracts. My experiences working with both groups has been mostly pleasant as they are knowledgeable, friendly, and helpful. While there are more Indians there are many Pakistani as well.

I have two observations to share;
1) Neither group seem willing to socialize with others outside of their ethnic group. This characteristic hurts them more than they realize, as in America, socializing with coworkers helps in the advancement of professional careers. However, the Pakistanis I have known do socialize to a greater degree.
2) The animosity between Indians and Pakistani that work here in America is apparent. They do not work together well. I have seen this negatively effect projects where the two groups must work together. This attitude hurts them professionally here. Given America's history of racism, we find it somewhat amusing to observe the racism between these two groups.

Very well said. Although I am not a big fan of country's system and it's policies, yet I appreciate your civil and objective look at the ground realities that challenge Pakistan.

Salaam (peace) all,

For those who are more interested in helping alleviate the suffering of their fellow human beings, below are the names of two welfare organizations that are very well known to me for their humanitarian work; one is based in Pakistan while the other is based in the US. Feel free to do your own research if you are skeptical. I know from my own experiences that they are trustworthy and I have not had to think twice about giving to them.

If you do decide to donate please make sure to tell them and/or choose the right option (if donating online) so that the monies are allocated and spent for flood relief work in Pakistan.

I hope you find this information useful and may God bless you and guide you regardless of your decision to donate.

With salaam (peace to you all),
Soulat.

====================

(1) Edhi Foundation - Pakistan's biggest and very, very well respected welfare organization. It's founder Mr. Edhi, is well known and highly respected in Pakistan. Their website is www.edhifoundation.com

You can get more information on how to donate to them by looking up this link from their website - www.edhifoundation.com/contact.asp - read the "Note to donors" at the top of the page.

(2) Islamic Relief USA - www.islamicreliefusa.org - don't let their name confuse you; they were on the ground helping those in need in New Orleans (Katrina) and Haiti (recent earthquake) just to list two examples as they help regardless of religious affiliation. They have set up field offices and have placed personnel on the ground in Pakistan to help. Charity Navigator gives them a four star rating (their highest).

In addition to what has already been said by Mr. Aryabhat, I would like to add just a few more things.

Mr.Zaidi talks about how muslims are mistreated in India. I agree that there are many extremist groups formed to fight against various relegions and/or races. This is prevailing all over the world. But, think about this: Are the muslims in India being hated for what Pakistan has done to India? the answer is NO. I quite frankly hate the fact that you played the "relegion card" on India. We have nothing against muslims or the innocent people of Pakistan. But I have every right to say: Your governemnt sucks, and if people are not helping the country at times like these, the Pakistani governemnt is to be blamed.

Media goes gaga over India. Why?? Because India is a peaceful nation which is working hard to become a developed and technologically advanced country. We are no trouble makers. All you hear in the news is mostly about our advancements or the problems within our country. Unlike Pakistan, the news is mostly about the country harboring terrorist groups or causing problems to neighbouring countries.

India has supported and lended a hand to countries who face environmental crisis. India would be glad to help Pakistan, if only Pakistan hadn't stolen most of Kashmir OR plan and execute a killing spree in Mumbai.

Taking all these facts into consideration, it is quite clear why people all over the world are hesitating to help Pakistan. Muslim countries too, are not supporting Pakistan.

Pakistan on the whole is perceived as a threat, though there are thousands of innocent people in the country. People would rather sit and watch a trouble making country slowly perish, than aid them so that they can rebuild the nation and come back to pose as a bigger threat to the world.

Sorry to say this, I may seem cruel, but do not expect any aid from me to help Pakistan. Not surprisingly enough, I know a 100 Indians who would do nothing to help Pakistan.

India I believe has maintained a no first use policy on nukes. and realistically I dont think India has the wherewithal to go for a military confrontation with the big boy China breathing down their neck.

no persecution of religion minorities?

i read on ur own country's newswebsite that a 'mosque' was bombed, because it belonged to a 'sect' which is not considered 'islamic' by you guys. to the extent their 'place of worship' is not called a 'mosque' and they are not considered 'muslims'. I was like zapped on reading this!!!

even in this crisis the Christians have been targeted and the Pope just yesterday raised his concern. and Hindus being forecefully served beef!

dude no one's got time for the hell whole you guys have created. and dont blame US for it. you created the taliban way after the Russians left Afghanistan following which Americans too had wrapped up. Only pakistan and saudi recognised the taliban govt. their only achievements - atrocities on women, bombing archaelogical sites, and 9/11.

and please stop chest thumping of your military's fighting prowess and that Americans are chicken shit to fight wars. It will take America exactly one day to bomb the whole region to stone ages including your nuke defended land of the pure. till date both in Afghanistan and Iraq, more muslims have been killed by muslims themselves than American military. that offcourse doesnt count - muslims killing muslims. thats all within the 'brethren'. so its all good.

its funny how the 'muslim' world goes into rampage over some random cartoons. but its nowhere to be seen when their 'brothers' are dying like animals.
and you like a rat are still 'demanding' aid.
i wish America elects its own asshole as President. For once I want a guy like Newt Gingrich out there. Enough of this PC and multicultural tolerance bullshit.
If there was a weak case to nuke Japan, there's 100 times stronger case to nuke some of the hotheaded soldiers of allah.

China cant do shit to India.... speak to a defense analyst (preferably an American) and he will tell you china cant deploy more than 2 battalions on its border with India. India has over 6 battalions deployed, which can easily over power any chinese aggression.

furthurmore these batallions cannot be supported in winter, because the passes get filled by snow.... thats exactly why chins beat a hasty retreat during the Sino-Indian War in 1962. Thats the reason why India is never worried about its eastern border.

and a naval attack is not possible, because chinese navy is weak compared to the Indian navy and neither have the force projection to take on the other

also to expect china to enter into a war with India for a rouge state like pakistan is a complete fantasy! So why dont you tell me how much did your dear friend china donate towards the pakistani flood relief? Pakistanis are just cheap chinese puppets, who are completely expendable

also have you forgotten 1971- Independence War of Bangladesh, India did invade Pakistan and china couldnt do shit .... dont get too cocky, when you go to war, you should have the bronze to fight your opponent and not count on allies or in this case enemy of my enemy to be there for you

China cant do shit to India.... speak to a defense analyst (preferably an American) and he will tell you china cant deploy more than 2 battalions on its border with India. India has over 6 battalions deployed, which can easily over power any chinese aggression.

furthurmore these batallions cannot be supported in winter, because the passes get filled by snow.... thats exactly why chins beat a hasty retreat during the Sino-Indian War in 1962. Thats the reason why India is never worried about its eastern border.

and a naval attack is not possible, because chinese navy is weak compared to the Indian navy and neither have the force projection to take on the other

also to expect china to enter into a war with India for a rouge state like pakistan is a complete fantasy! So why dont you tell me how much did your dear friend china donate towards the pakistani flood relief? Pakistanis are just cheap chinese puppets, who are completely expendable

also have you forgotten 1971- Independence War of Bangladesh, India did invade Pakistan and china couldnt do shit .... dont get too cocky, when you go to war, you should have the bronze to fight your opponent and not count on allies or in this case enemy of my enemy to be there for you

First sensible indian i have seen.. Thanks !
People have side tracked the conversation.

Do you not see your comment of "first sensible indian..." and hideous and part of the overall problem?

The unfortunate reality is that it's impossible to provide aid to indvidual Pakistanis without providing that aid to the Pakistani government. The Pakistani government could be using it's own resources to help its people but it's not, in large part. The military is still guarding the border with India, the ruling class still has billions squirreled away that should have been paid in taxes, the infrastructure has still collapsed, at least in part because it was in a shambles before the flood ever struck. There's an old expression, common in the US - "you've made your bed; now you must lie in it." If the world decides that the human cost of the flood is so great that it must be paid by the rest of the world, but not by Pakistan, then we've told both the Pakistani leadership and the people of Pakistan that we support the policies that have lead to this situation. We've assured them that there's no reason to change the way they do business. It's okay that they take huge amounts of relief and channel it into private bank accounts and support of terrorist organizations (as happened in 2005 and afterwards), because we're here ready to support that decision with our dollars and our food and our manpower and heavy equipment and whatever else they might need, but chose not to provide or prepare for themselves.

It sounds harsh. It IS harsh. But we don't send aid to someone who's activiely shooting at us, and that's what Pakistan is doing. If the individual Pakistanis feel that the aid is more important than supporting the government that supports the goals that prevent the aid from being given, well, perhaps it will convince them to make a change in the government that they have. India tried to offer humanitarian aid, and the government of Pakistan said NO. If you ask the individual Pakistanis - starving, dying of thirst for lack of clean water, without dry ground (let alone a bed) on which to sleep - if they'd like a little assistance, I don't imagine too many of them would say "yes, please, so long as it doesn't come from INDIA!" After this is over - and that's going to be a long time, of course - I hope that the individual Pakistanis reflect on their immediate past. That they at least consider that their government was prepared to let them starve to death, rather than accept aid from India. Rather than pay their taxes. Even rather than repurpose their own military. And to keep such considerations in mind when they decide whether to continue with that same government in power, or to demand a change.

Because the only way you get a change, is when the people demand it.

Aurangzeb Khan
lalqila.wordpress.com

Beause it is Pakistan and Majority is Muslim.

Haven't we seen enough Anti-Islam, Anti-Muslim, Anti-Pakistan sentiments to understand why the biggest catastrophy of the living memory has taken a back seat in media.

Besides, our own leaders were busy as well taking delivery of chateaus and pludering wealth in London Hotels.

Listen to yourself. each sentene reaks of negativity not because the people who are sufferring said or did something to you or to Westerners, but beause their beleifs are different than yours. AND I THOUGHT Western world was enlightened and waa tollerant society, shame on me for beleiving that.

Who will come for our help if India tomorrow tries to overtake Pakistan, they have tried twice in the past and both times westerns world looked the other way and ran with their tail between their legs. So Pakistan had to depend on their own strength and Military.

You do not need India to take over your failed state of Pakistan! Your Punjabi dominated military has done a good job of breaking up your own country so far - Bangladesh first and now all the killings of fellow Muslims in Karachi Sindh, Balochistan, KP and even in Lahore - the one time cultural capital of Punjab!

Your paranoia can only be explained by the "Hate India" brain-washing that goes on 24/7, in Pakistani media and in your madrassas run by illiterate mullahs.

If Islam is a religion of peace why do you spend so much time teaching your people to hate?

I'm an American. I can't contemplate the disaster that has struck Pakistan without feeling pity and an impulse to help. But...

I do think nearly all of whatever I might contribute would be skimmed off through corruption endemic to the country. I want to help people in need, and so I choose to give to those causes in which it's likely at least most of my aid will reach those who actually need it. I don't know how to do that with respect to Pakistan. I do know how to do that with respect to, for example, a battered womens' shelter in my community.

Krypter's points 2 and 3 are human reactions, but they're not among the reasons I'm not donating to the Pakistan relief effort. These views arise from vengeance and fear, and they're not reasons to withold help from people who need it.

Point 4 - yes, this influences me. Pakistan's underfunding of its infrastructure makes me wonder how useful it is to send relief to a society that hasn't valued its own citizens enough to moderate its profligate arms expenditures in favor of more investment in its own people.

And yes, I'm painfully aware of my country's participation in helping Pakistan make the poor decisions it has with respect to infrastructure neglect and in supporting corruption at all levels in the Pakistani government. But I still have to make a decision as to where my small contribution might best help somebody get enough to eat, get a tent, buy a cow, get back on their feet after fate has bitch-slapped them and theirs. And I think my contribution would simply be wasted in supporting Pakistan's powerful. Sad as hell.

Stop lying to the people out here ..... you know it as well as I that it was Pakistan who attacked India in all three wars.... check out wikipedia if you have any doubts. If you weren't around when those happened, then look at kargil war it happened in your life time ...see who attacked who? India is a peace loving nation and has NEVER attacked any nation in its entire history

Stop lying to the people out here ..... you know it as well as I that it was Pakistan who attacked India in all three wars.... check out wikipedia if you have any doubts. If you weren't around when those happened, then look at kargil war it happened in your life time ...see who attacked who? India is a peace loving nation and has NEVER attacked any nation in its entire history

"meh, My Red Cross donations this month are going for Louisiana and Palestine."

Sad.

Actually, a new survey showed that US has surpassed India as enemy #1. Congratulations.

Why not take a look in the mirror to see who has their "blinders on"? The floods are a great human tragedy and helping those in need is a natural human instinct - not just an American interest.

But this is also time for Pakistan to do some honest soul searching. Those suffering in the floods are the same people who are victimized by misgovernment of Pakistan's corrupt elites, particularly the elites of the Punjabi dominated military enterprise which also has covert links to AQ and its many affiliates.

If you are so down about the US and its involvement in Pakistan, why not just refuse and refund $billions of US aid, return the ship loads of lethal US weapons along with the nuclear capable F-16's and "just say no" to America?

All the factors Jacob Blues mentioned are in part responsible, but I think the biggest reason people, at least here in the U.S. have not given more is due to the lack of coverage about what was going on. Perhaps I missed where the extent of the flooding was covered, but I don't recall hearing much about the extent of the devastation until people started complaining about why no help was getting to them. I heard there was flooding, just like there was flooding in China at some point; flooding is a frequent problem in some areas of the world (including in the U.S.), but I and people around me had no clue about the extent of the disaster and the need.

We in the U.S. are very influenced by what we see. Haiti's disaster had round the clock news coverage in papers, radio and, most significantly, television. People saw suffering and wanted to help. Celebrities and political leaders became aware because of the news coverage and used the same media to urge people to help. Probably, many people who gave help to Haiti would have not done so in the absence of the news coverage and the appeals. There is a large population of Haitian expatriates and descendants of Haitians in the U.S. and they would have given, along with organizations that can regularly be relied on to help in these kinds of disasters. But there is no way there would have been such a massive outpouring of aid in the absence of TV coverage.

So the question that should be asked is: Why was there not more immediate and substantial news coverage, especially by television, of the extent of the flooding?

One reason is that it happened in August. There is this peculiar pattern in the U.S. that because Congress is in recess, it is the time that the heads of agencies go on vacation since they're not subject to being called up to testify or otherwise respond to congressional demands; as a result, there isn't much political news, and many top news people in the D.C. area go on vacation.

This can't be the complete reason for the dearth of coverage, because there are outlets in other parts of the world that don't suffer from the August doldrums. So, what are the reasons? In the past, the government of various countries have initially suppressed news on the extent of disasters, or the disasters have happened in areas that are remote geographically, or kept isolated by their government (e.g. Myanmar). Sometimes there's no one left alive to tell what happened, or it takes the few surviving individuals a long time to reach places where the news can be spread. Sometimes the disaster takes out the area's means of communication.

If you want to know why there was so little aid, then you must determine what happened in Pakistan that produced so little coverage besides it being in August. If you want to increase the amount of humanitarian aid, get crews with cameras to the disaster zone.

Mr. Marty,

After 9/11, in our pursuit of the taleban and their counter attacks, PAKISTAN HAS LOST 3000 SOLDIERS . .. AND ... i repeat AND 3000 CIVILIANS.

The 'taleban' werent carved out by ourselves. They were heroes back in the day when they were the US' and West's poster boys against the Russians.!

How many soldiers and civilians did the AMERICANS or their ALLIES lose in the aftermath to 9/11?

We've done so much for the rest of the world, yet you shun us by leveling allegations against us that are no more than conspiracy theories.

Also, there is NO WAY a handful of taleban can get hold of our sophisticated nuclear weapons program. For your naive brain, let me tell you, it takes a no. of parts to assemble a weapon, that are spread throughout the country, and only a seasoned trained expert can assemble them. And we do have a strong army and a very very large number of patriotic citizens who are ready to defend our bombs.

We have our share of problems, but if you cant or are unwilling to donate for the 20 million people affected, then take you anti-Pakistan rant somewhere else!

This is only ONE answer to you. But i have ONE advice as well. Stop watching FOX NEWS and the likes, do your own research. Maybe someday you'll realize the truth. MAYBE, if youre not that naive.

Mr Ali, Pakistan made a CHOICE to support US efforts in ousting Taliban govt salivating over American aid. Pakistan’s loss of lives is not BECAUSE it has chose to support efforts to oust Taliban but because of its DUPLICITY. Pakistan on one hand is supporting Taliban with a seat on Quetta Shura and on other hand grabbing US Aid and F-16s. Pakistani foot soldiers and civilians are paying price of this double game.

In the same period – since 9/11 attack, world has suffered terrorist attacks planned and financed from Pakistan, be it London, Madrid, Mumbai or failed attacks like for New York - Shahzad the Bomber or Shoe bomber Reid.

So go tell someone else that Pakistan is sacrificing for world’s fight against terrorism.

Pakistan has been and remains world Terror Central!

""The 'taleban' werent carved out by ourselves. They were heroes back in the day when they were the US' and West's poster boys against the Russians.!""

Actually this is factually incorrect.

The 'poster boys' against the Russians were people like Ahmed Shah Massoud, Ismail Khan, and the Gulbuddin Hekmatyar groups like Hezb-i Islami (although Gulbuddin, even during the Afghan wars, fought other Afghans about as much as he did the Russians). Arab jihadis and Pakistani agents/volunteers were a vast minority, but significant because of the money they brought in, mostly to people like Gulbuddin - who got almost a billion dollars, but did the least actual fighting of any group against the russians, and was basically a regional terror-warlord, more interested in grabbing power than in fighting the Soviets. The 'Taleban' didn't even exist as a coherent organization during the Afghan/Soviet conflict. In fact, the fundamentalist islamists were some of the least popular people in the resistance movement because of their habit of interfering with local tribal customs, religious practices, local politics, alienating the population. Much of the extremist, arab financed resistance was also seen with disdain by local Afghan fighters, who saw them as interlopers and lacking any understanding of the regional culture (even many pashtuns resented the extremism of the highly-religious pashtun warlord groups). It was only after the Soviets left that the ISI started funding the larger Pashtun resistance groups and empowering them to take over what was left with the power vacuum post-occupation. However, it simply planted the seeds of a civil war, and they lost their control only 2-3 years later. That (around 1994-1996) was when Pakistan shifted their funding over to the 'Taleban' groups, which while nascent, quickly took over much of the power structure that had been laid by others after only 1-2 years. Basically, the 'Taleban' never existed until about 1994, well after the Soviets were gone, and the country had gone to crap in civil war and lawlessness.

You'd think you'd know more about this? This isn't exactly obscure, hard to find information.

Dear friend, have you ever heard the name 'A Q Khan'? I suppose you haven't. If you had, I do not think you'd blabber stupidly about your 'well protected' nuclear resources and 'very large, patriotic army'. Go ahead and read about this character. He's accused of proliferating pakistani nuclear technology to North Korea and possibly to Iraq as well. There's solid proof that he did so and he's admitted it himself. Now given that your country's nuclear assets are well protected as you claim, how did this one individual manage to sell them to other rogue nations? Now, that's a no-brainer, isn't it? Answer is, He dint do it alone.
Now, heard of the ISI? I'm sure you have. This is your 'ultra patriotic' intelligence wing that is suspected of aiding A Q Khan. It's the same department of your army that is presently accused of aiding the taliban against the US. It's the same wing that runs terrorist camps in POK and has been exporting terrorists to India for over 2 decades.
Now, lets set the nuclear resources aside for a while. Do u know that close to a 3rd of pakistan is actually under the control of the extremists in one way or the other? Heard of places called North Western Frontier and Waziristan? Do u know that at one point in time during the last 2 years, taliban was just 10 miles away from your capital city? That's how good your 'very large army' actually is.
Now, with such glorious records of infiltration and proliferation, do you really expect the International community to trust all those nuclear weapons in your hands? Think about it!

well mr ALISOMEBODY, you and I both know that Pakistan is just trying to milk US funds by pretending to be an ally in the war on terrorism. leave the eastern terror training camps i.e. in kashmir for your war on India, which have been untouched because they are different terrorists and do not threaten pakistan, even on the western front Pakistan has taken up the policy of pic and choose who to fight! the only people you guys are fighting are the Tehrik-i-Taliban who have declared you as kuffars and are killing Pakistanis

Infact you continue the same policy and have even gone ahead and armed their enemies( other terrorist groups) just so that they help you to fight the Tehrik-i-Taliban. There is still open support to groups that are fighting the US and its allies on the western front .... part of the reason why the US has to use drones to patrol the border

so its not a sincere commitment to fight terrorism, but just a way to make sure you get US aid and making sure that the US doesnt invade you! you guys wouldnt ever own up and say, this is my problem the hell with US funds we will sort it out! and those people who died, died because of our stupidity of funding them in the first place and not because of the war on terror!

India is fighting naxals in their country, on a larger scale that the pakistani operation currently going on, do you see them begging for funds? do you see them blame their problem on china ? NO its an internal problem! learn to take up responsibility for your own actions!

Mr. Khan, I do not recall using the word 'India' even once in my write up? I did not indulge in any kind of comparative analysis between the two South Asian neighbors. My attention was predominantly focused on Pakistan.

It is amazing that Pakistanis just cannot get over their 'India Syndrome'. Why don't you try to put your own stuff in order before taking a peek across the border? Why don't you resolve your own issues before thinking about India or any other country? This is typical Pakistani mentality - you yourself are broken, beaten and battered, yet, you are concentrating on other's flaws before venturing to correct your own!

Anyway, good luck to Pakistan and its teeming millions if this is the mindset adopted to deal with matters of serious concern by its citizens!

God is a figment of your imagination and wondering if "he" - as a petty and judgmental entity - is angry at Pakistan is really stupid. Leave that kind of logic to the Pakistanis where it belongs. I am sure there are imams who are confidently preaching that this occurred because girls went to school or showed too much skin etc. I agreed with everything you wrote until you decided to supplant your arguments with a personal God who likes to disrupt nations because he's "fed up." Do you religious people even hear what is coming out of your mouths?

Mr. Must-Not-Sleep, I never claimed to be religious! I, as a matter of fact, do not follow any religion. Period.

To my mind, religion creates distortion in our minds, divides us, as humanity, and destroys our will to live peacefully. But that's none of anybody's business - it’s my personal concept and no one has to either necessarily support or condemn the idea.

What I really meant by God not being happy with the Pakistanis was that the country is truly creating chaos on a global basis through its patronizing of the Taliban and the terrorists. It is indeed playing a double game (totally agree with the British prime minister) - accepting aid from the West and supporting those elements that it should not be.

The rest is your own prerogative - to improve or not to improve depends on your ability to bring Pakistan back on its feet.

No one can envision a disaster of this magnitude. It's similar to asking why wasn't anything done before Tsunami? Why didn't the whole Europe have vision enough to see that volcano ashes will affect the flights of the whole Europe and cause a huge loss to airline industry? Why is it that US nationals suffer from hurricanes and tornadoes every year? The reason is simple.. these are natural calamities.
After the 2005 earthquake in Kashmir, architects from Pakistan and all over the world have come up with plans to mitigate risks in case of a similar disaster (God Forbid). I know for a fact (since maternal side of my family is from Kashmir) that people were given enough funds to reconstruct their homes and start earning livelihood. People are now being educated about the impact of living on an active fault, houses are being made from lighter material etc.
Similarly, after we've helped the flood-affected people, I'm sure we'll see irrigation plans that will help reduce, if not completely avoid, similar disasters.
Don't just read international news. We're not all bad or heartless people. :)

Mr. Zaidi is diligent about airing two of his grievances, this being one of them. The other is that according to him, just about anyone can call him- or herself an expert on Pakistan. Since he's so much more authentic, his face ought to get a lot more airtime.

But he doesn't stop there. By all accounts, this flood was an act of God. Western hands can't be blamed for causing it. But if foreigners don't help, the flood becomes their fault. Somehow, the blame never lands at the feet of the Pakistani government. In fact, visiting Mr. Zaidi's website, one gets the distinct impression that everything befalling Pakistan is the result of outsiders (India, the IMF, etc.) actively thwarting Pakistan's natural rise to greatness.

Mr. Zaidi should translate his pitch into Chinese and see how it plays there. One would expect that China, so eager help Pakistan normally, would be jumping at the chance to donate even more now. But why so little this time? Perhaps because they realize that there's no payoff in this.

Forgive the rest of the world, Mr. Zaidi, if they follow the lead of the very intelligent Chinese.

cheers especially point 26

The ROOT of all Evil is INDIA !!!!!and the INDIANS

You're absolutely right...but every countries including muslim countries don't want to be in relationship with pakistan as they scared of being affected by bad impression of Pakistan.

According to me it's not Religion but its bad attitude of Pakistan.

Juninho,

"you Pakistanis chose to create your own ghetto" - how many average Muslims/Hindus before partition do you think cared about partition? Millions were forced to flee to their respective new countries not because they wanted to be in a religiously homogenous state but because they faced mass riots and death by an extremist minority if they stayed.

The whole point of this essay is to make a distinction between a people and its government - and clearly there has developed a huge gap between the will and basic needs of the general Pakistani population and their government. How dare you simply write off the Pakistanis' plight with a "now DEAL with the consequences..."

GW, Paki hiding under great name of a great person!

Get your facts right. Tom Cruise has already asked for Paksitani flood relief and so has others like Angelina Jolie.

However, ever got sense in your head that WHY the hell Hollywood should care about Paksiatn that hates Bikini wearing, sex propogating culture that Paksianis hate?

And before Bill Gates etc. care, could you please find out how much money from PERSONAL pocket your Pakistani luminaries have donated? Let me give you some names to help in your search :

Sharif Brothers - Billionairs by world standards
Zardaris - Asif, his sisters, children - each a Billionaire in their own
Chaudharys of Gujarat
Fazlur Rehman
Gen Gul
Gen Mirza Asmal Beig
Andyou KNOW who else..................

List is pretty long!!!!

"God helps those who help themselves" applies to Pakistan too!

Excuse me, but when I first came to the US, it seemed to me that the social, religious and cultural mores here (and I was in DC) were more in sync with a small town in a Pakistan backwater. A first world country which still has raging debates about abortion, where doctors do not openly state that they are willing to perform one, where one state (Utah) has actually criminalized miscarriages , these are all examples of how illiberal this country is in its attitude towards women who want to exercise the choice of whether to have a baby or not.

And dont give me the reply that its ok, its our religious belief, because that is exactly what the nutjobs in Pakistan would say on forced marriage. What makes your country's religious intolerance and bigotrybetter than ours - its still intolerance.

Oh and btw I recently found out that it is legal to fire someone on the basis of their sexual orientation in 33 states in the US.(Human Rights Campaign) http://www.hrc.org/issues/3306.htm

Not the right forum for this

The real question is why Indians are not "obsessed" or even concerned about the issues I raise, why Indian-Americans do not shout about the Dalit from the rooftops, do not attempt to get something, anything done to ease their sufferings. But, things will change. There are Dalit academics in the US and they are publishing about the horrors. Two international conferences on "untouchability" have occurred in the last two years. Three thousand years of oppression. Three thousand years....

As an Indian from a "Backward community" whose family has eliminated all prejudices against us through mutual love , respect and education, I can say with pride that I love my country and the fact that the media is gaga over us and Mr Farnaz.....I dont need the likes of you campaigning for me....

My heart bleeds at the plight of the poor Pakistani people and I hope God and his subjects from all over this wonderful planet come together and help these poor people so that they can live long productive and harmonious lives....

To any and all who would read this comment....Please do anything you can to help them irrespective of what religion or what nation they belong to. Help them build a better tomorrow. Thank You.

I have done a great deal to help the people of Pakistan, and I have brought attention to the three hundred million enslaved Dalit in India. Sorry, but this cannot go on. The facts of life on the ground there are a blur to most Westerners who would rather condemn Pakistan. In this, the author has a point. And I have not mentioned Gujurat, note.

I do not accuse either you or anyone else of prejudice against the Dalit or anyone else. This is a matter of institutionalized racism that has gone on for more than three thousand years.
And then there are India's seventy-five separate mafias, not to mention the contributions it has made to world-wide crime. Ibrahim comes to mind, among others.

Realize this. India will continue to attract Christian and Catholic missionaries, who will convert the Dalit, continuing to make a horrible situation worse. It needs no further complications.

On Pakistan and India, the first step would be bilateral denuclearization. Think how that would benefit not only international relations but the poor of both nations.

The people of Pakistan are in danger in every direction: from the government, the mullahs, the Taliban, the floods, etc. This is not the time for pointless defensiveness. It is a time, as the author suggests, for us to begin to consider whether a Manichean view of India and Pakistan is hindering progress in the latter.

Excellent post. It is quite true that much of the money is squandered, and in Pakistan, there is the opinion that the generals are aiding the Taliban, not out of conviction, but to extort more money from the US. The poor, among the military, however, are ideological captives.

I believe that giving money to Pakistan is pointless. WE need to send our own personnel, perhaps, through NGO's, perhaps using an elaborated Peace Corps model, enlisting Pakistanis who can be trusted. Moreover, those we send must be accountable for every penny spent. How we can do this I do not know.

NOte another recent, insane instance of going our conventional route. Secretary Clinton announced that the bulk of US development aid would go to agriculture since Pakistan is primarily an agricultural country. In fact, this means that the wealthy, feudal landowners will get a big chunk of cash. Pakistan needs to industrialize, to become an outsourcing venue, to implement taxes. Once the economy has entered the twentieth, not 21st century, a need for decent public education will develop along with the resources to provide it.

Of course, there is Nazi you, a type all to prevalent now in Pakistan and other Muslim nations, wither please go. The Taliban await you. You can complete your autobiography there, Mr. Adams.

Having established yourself as a racist, you would be doing Pakistan a favor if you kept off this thread. The country does not need more lunatics at the moment. People are starving, without shelter, suffering from exposure to the elements, disease, etc. Harvests won't happen, animal life has disappeared, and the price of commodities is about to soar. Then there are your co-lunatic extremists. Let the sane people--Muslims, Jews, Hindus, agnostics, atheists, etc.--help the people of Pakistan.

i completely agree with you John,ppl are starving here and the economy of pakistan has set back to wat it was 50yrs ago. our country is trying its level best to combat terrorism as the ppl hre are the biggest victims of it.
zardari may be vacationing in france during this catastrophe but y shud it stop every1 from helping the poor,helpless ppl of this country...20million ppl hv been displaced and yet ppl still hv to first point fingers on our political and judiciary system.i agree its corrupted but is this the time to argue over it?? ppl r dying everyday frm diseases like cholera,snake bites,malaria,etc..and yet ppl are saying y shud pakistan be given aid ...the medis has always projected us in the worst light possible but still to think tht ppl can be so inhuman is unbelievable..

Maybe God is upset. But floods are not His doing. The persecution of minorities, the demonization of certain groups, etc., many things must change in Pakistan. But now, the most important thing is aid.

If "the floods are not His doing" then what exactly is "His doing"? And who is making the floods if not "Him"?

I seem to recall that He has previously used floods to exterminate most of the human race -- see Noah -- so the flooding of Pakistan is 100% in character for Him. If the respective holy books of Jews, Christians, and Muslims are to be believed, then God positively relishes sending natural disasters to wipe unholy nations out.

Not that I support Him in that effort, but it's completely business-as-usual for Him.