Sir_Mixalot. You said: "besides the fact that none of the 9/11 hijackers were from Pakistan, and the fact that the US helped make AQ and the Taliban to fight the Soviets (read Coll's Ghost Wars) -- it is in fact US foreign policy that led DIRECTLY to 9/11."

OBL isn't from Pakistan, do you deny he is there and being aided by Pakistan and Afghanistan?

Iran and Iraq fought eachother for 10 years because of Shia and Sunni divisiveness, do you deny that they worked together to stop the U.S. and Israel?

So your argument is very amatuerish.

" Muslims do not “hate our freedom,” but rather, they hate our policies."

There are many American policies that are wrong. But the support of Israel should never stop. Because of this Islam has drawn their line and will not alter it. The agressors are Muslims, there is no compromise in them. Israel and the U.S. are constantly offering concessions and the Muslims take none and offer none. They believe they have the momentum and the upper hand which was their downfall in 1967.

I personally don't think Israel needs anyone. But the Bible says: "If we support Israel we will be blessed". That's not why I do it, I do it because it's natural for me to love the nation that God used to bring the Law, his Bible, and Jesus.

I can tell by your crass comment, you have no idea of the spiritual ramifications of what you spout. Maybe God will open your eyes, ask him.

But as far as nations protecting others and getting involved in the affairs of others to help them...as in helping Israel because they are a country like ours -a democracy- surrounded by dictators and thuggacracies, what would happen if France didn't come to our aid during the revolution and loan us the money needed to defend ourselves against Britain? Well I'll tell you my friend; they're would be no Constitution, no Bill of Rights, and not Repesentative Republic. We would still be a colony of the rascist imperialist crown, and her arrogant pretentious one-world elititists.

Read what Robert Baer thinks about the CIA. He was one of the only officers operating in the middle east. He shows them as incompetent, politicized, and inept. They have a nice image thanks to movies, but they are the typical Washington bureacracy that can't accomplish squat. Especially after Carter immasculated them. Baer said when he tried to gain intelligence on terrorists his bosses tried to stop him at every turn if it didn't wash with the state department who were trying to seal oil deals. They told him to just go to embassy cocktail parties and try to gain information there.

Baer didn't say he was the only one. He states that there was very few working in the field and almost no one that spoke any other languages but English. When he tried to run agents, his own people became the obstacles and they even tried to set him up for discipline because he tried to do a good job anyway. You can decide to keep a closed mind by refusing to see facts but it doesn't change the facts.

I have seen Robert Baer contributing to news agencies and movie productions.

You should write a book Sir. Quite Excellent nmd true argument-- the truth is mightier than any bag of lies people may promote. Good job!

On your "Not supporting Israel " comment, and in reference to your "Leaving the middle east" comment:

We support Israel because they are the only progressive democracy in the Middle East, they are our eyes and ears for much of our intelligence gathering.

On leaving the middle east: We have the Iranians where we want them, squeezed. Afghanistan has become nothing more than the largest military base in the world. Even if we left the Middle East, Muslims extremists will find an excuse to hate somebody. How many Americans are being killed by suicide bombers in Pakistan on a daily basis? Non. They're killing their own people. Until very recently it was common knowledge that Pakistanis were known for their Conspiracy Theories. Until recently almost three quarters of Pakistanis believed these suicide bombers were actually Americans. That number is quickly reversing as the population slowly opens their eyes. Osama bin laden is an opportunist who doesn't even know or understand his own philosophies and beliefs. A man who's reason for success was the United States; he was a horrible field "general" if you will but only succeeded because of our stinger missiles. Then he back stabs and becomes the man who raped us up the butt in 1993 with the first world trade bombing, raped us again with the USS Cole, then dances in the street when 3,000 Americans are killed on 9/11.

These people deserve zero tolerance. These people KILL others simply because individuals are "TALKING" about burning a Koran, not even burning it, but TALKING about it. These "extremists", will NOT hesitate to rape and kill your daughters. These people are the lowest form of society. These people are on a crusade to kill all non-muslims because they HAVE NO JOBS!

Marty, there is no clarity as to who was responsible for 9/11, there is growing evidence that it was an insider job. The whole premise of your arguments is sitting on a slippery slope.

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/zero-an-investigation-into-911/

Secondly, you need to look into the role of CIA anf other intel agencies in this whole episode and beyond. Their made-up and faulty intel resulted in the illegal invasion and Iraq and killings of hundreds of thousands of innocent people in Iraq. Blindfolded people like yourself have blood all over your hands and faces.

Muslims and Islam Were Part of Twin Towers’ Life:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/11/nyregion/11religion.html?_r=4

And Muslims are here to stay, they have the same rights as any other American. So get used to it.

What you state about Pakistani military and intelligence forces' hand in bringing about and supporting Taliban is fact, but only half the truth. What you omitted - whether unknowingly or willingly, is disturbing and calls your objectivity in question. The roles of Saudi and US intelligence in partnership with the PAkistani Intelligence was equally viable in bringing about and sustaining Taliban. And if you really want to revisit 911, then by all means why not mention the role of the US and Saudi intelligence in bringing about the Bin Ladens of this word to life.

Politics is a dirty business, and your article plays right into it. The Talibanzation of America is not a "reaction" to 911, rather a whipped up organized hate campaign of the neocons with the religious right to use 911 in connection with the proposed Cordoba Community Center to bring about votes for them in the coming midterm elections of this year, and ultimately in the 2012 presidential elections. Its dirty politics the victims of which are the unsuspecting American people, and ultimately the American values you all claim to uphold and defend.

What you state about Pakistani military and intelligence forces' hand in bringing about and supporting Taliban is fact, but only half the truth. What you omitted - whether unknowingly or willingly, is disturbing and calls your objectivity in question. The roles of Saudi and US intelligence in partnership with the PAkistani Intelligence was equally viable in bringing about and sustaining Taliban. And if you really want to revisit 911, then by all means why not mention the role of the US and Saudi intelligence in bringing about the Bin Ladens of this word to life.

Politics is a dirty business, and your article plays right into it. The Talibanzation of America is not a "reaction" to 911, rather a whipped up organized hate campaign of the neocons with the religious right to use 911 in connection with the proposed Cordoba Community Center to bring about votes for them in the coming midterm elections of this year, and ultimately in the 2012 presidential elections. Its dirty politics the victims of which are the unsuspecting American people, and ultimately the American values you all claim to uphold and defend.

Robert Baer (CIA middle-east officer) wrote about the ISI and Taliban training together at the same camps. The history ISI corruption is well documented. And the use of deception by Muslims is too prevelant to pretend they are always truthful.

Ok I'll try to find it.

...for you but you just prove that the article was correct on the "In the United States, decent people are unleashing unkind and hateful words upon Muslims around the world because they can. Their rage has nothing to do with Islam." Congratulations.

“but, formerly-progressive liberals like myself were working to help people all over the world. We supported free trade. We supported practically unfettered immigration. We supported truly wonderful ideals”. Wonderful for whom? This was simply cultural expansionism, with added economic benefits, promulgated in a spirit of evangelical euphoria. It is comforting you employ the past tense.

Mr. Wibberley, I disagree strongly with the assertion that, "This was simply cultural expansionism, with added economic benefits, promulgated in a spirit of evangelical euphoria."

Progressive liberals like myself saw opportunities to raise poor foreigners to middle-class living standards and for sound reasons.

How many middle classes, for example, fight guerrilla wars? People who are not constantly struggling to survive, who have what they need and some comforts; people who are allowed to pursue their own interests and see opportunity; people who have something to live for don't tend to blow themselves up. Middle-class people tend to be tolerant (to a fault), and they make good neighbors...

Instead, the "profits" of outsourcing were hoarded (never reinvested in any meaningful way), and opportunities were squandered on padded bank accounts. So, whereas you see "cultural expansion" and "economic benefit" in Western policies, I see failure to effect cultural empowerment and higher non-western standards of living as the result of an "evangelical euphoria" in pursuit of "profits" to which I (certainly) was not party.

Your comments contains no Truth. I am not sure where you were educated about Islam but you are missing a lot of details about the subject. It is a fact that Islam has changed, over the years, it's handling of Jesus and many other issues. It seems to be in dispute with Mohammed, who said: Koran 3:3 It is He Who sent down to thee (step by step), in truth, the Book, confirming what went before it; and He sent down the Law (of Moses) and the Gospel (of Jesus) before this, as a guide to mankind, and He sent down the Criterion (of judgement between right and wrong)".

You see Mohammed spoke of Jesus as a Prophet and spoke of the standing of the Scriptures (Bible). So your latter day commentators have some explaining to do. Jesus said: "I AM the Way. The Truth, and The Life. No one comes to the Father but by Me. This is a conundrum with Islam. The two cannot be True.

"The Quran is beautifully preserved its original form and nothing, not even a letter has been changed since its revelation to Prophet Muhammad,"

Actually, you also have to give Zaid full credit. If the Quran really has not been changed by even one letter, then Zaid's gathering together of the complete revelations was also a miracle. After all, the Uthmanic version of the Quran, the currently accepted version, based on people's memories, camel bones, papyrus, reeds, etc. - all the sources that Zaid could find - was one of many early versions.

As long as you have hate in the back of your mind, you cannot understand even a word that the Qur'an tells you. I have repeated time and again that the current bible is corrupted. We Muslims believe in the book named Injeel, that was revealed to Prophet Jesus, peace be upon him and not this bible that has several versions and it's totally perverted. We do not consider it to be original word of God.

Moreover, there has not been a single unequivocal verse even in the multiversion-bible where Prophet Jesus (whom we call Issa), peace be upon him, may have said that I'm God or worship me. This bible cannot prove whether Prophet Issa, peace be upon him, was ever killed or crucified. There is a beautiful lecture by Ahmed Dedaat and Dr. Zakir Naik on the topic "Was Jesus Really Crucified". Dr Naik proves from the bible that he was not crucified. If Jesus is not crucified, I'm sorry there's no such thing as Christianity!

Even more, Jesus did not himself said anything like Christianity or Trinity or claimed divinity! Those were the followers who later wrote gospels and convoluted the Message of Prophet Issa, peace be upon him.

About Qur'an, Caliph Usman, may Allah be pleased with him, never wrote anything with his own hands. He simply compiled the writings into a book form. Unlike bible, which does not have a single soul in the entire world who could remember it, Qur'an had many Hafiz (persons who memorized the Qur'an totally) and it was not difficult for the Caliph to have it checked for number of times for any inconsistencies. There was no such inconsistency, read history written by Christians if you don't trust me! There can never be such inconcsistency as it's a true word of Allah who has asked the non-believers to try and frame even a single verse like that, people have tried and people have failed!

Lastly, we believe Prophet Jesus, peace be upon him, to be a prophet of God. He's not a son of God. He was not cruicified. He was not killed. At the time of his being tried, he was ascended to heavens and will return before the Final Hour to kill Dajjal, to break the Cross and kill the pig! Without such beliefs, one cannot be a Muslim. Prophet Jesus, peace be upon him, delivered the same message as was given by Prophets Abraham, Moses, David, Solomon etc, peace be upon them all.

My advise to you is that if you continue to see Qur'an and Islam through the lens of hate, suspicion and ignorance then you'd continue to present comments like the ones you have been posting. There are better sources than Fox News out there which have more credibility and they work on rational reasoning not illogical bigotry.

Assalam o Alaikum, wa Rahmatullahe wa Barakatuho,
May peace, blessings and mercy of Allah be upon you!

Where is the text you speak of? That we may compare it to the Bible of today. Not one dot and letter of God's Word has changed for over 4500 years. You might repeat vain attempts to try and understand it, but they prove themselves foolish. The more Islam tries to blaspheme God's Son and his Word, the more exposed they are of the great deception. "they're hand shall not prosper". In the Torah Jesus is spoken of as being fully GOD. "The LORD said to my Lord, Sit you at my right hand, until I make your enemies your footstool." Psalms 110:1 David called God LORD and Jesus LORD. David was the King, he wouldn't have called any earthly creature LORD. So that leaves one explanation, David understood the Devine nature of the One who would save man, be slain, and arise from the dead, as spoken of by Isaiah, to sit on the right hand of the Father.
“The law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul;
The testimony of the Lord is sure, making the wise the simple;
The statutes of the Lord are right, rejoicing the heart;
The commandment of the Lord is pure, enlightening the eyes;
The fear of the Lord is clean, enduring forever;
The judgments of the Lord are true and righteous all together.
More to be desired are they than gold, Yea, than much fine gold;
Sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
Moreover by them Your servant is warned,
And in keeping them there is great reward.”
Psalm 19: 7-11

Verily, the Mighty Thor Odinson will smite your desert dwelling godlings and rend their texts asunder! The runes on Mjolnir are the only truth!

Logically a God does not have a son to begin with. It's totally irrational and absurd idea to associate partners with God. It's 21st century but you seem to be living in age of caves and darkness! Well so you always have a choice!!!

As for the comparison is concerned, dearest Malinse, the orignal stuff doesn't exit that can be compared . . . it's all changed!!! Do you even know which langiage did the bible orginally revealed??? Does it exist now??? No. You don't have to google!!! Here is easy one: Bible has several versions and numerous errors - try listening to Dr Zakir Naik (he speaks extremly good english); his lectures are available on YouTube. Here is link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPzZRn0lHXc

Ok . . . watch this one. Here's complete account of your perverted bible that how many inaccuracies and massive contradictions it possesses.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaI0niPwl5U

Seriously . . . there are few people who need one sign to change their lives - but there are those who even see the clearest of signs but the change is not in their fate. May Allah help those!

Please watch these videos and other related ones in total peace, hope this may bring some change in your extremist thinking!

Assalam o Alaikum Wa Rahmatullahe Wa Barakatohu.

Voxoceanus: My imaginary sky fairy and b.s. "holy" book is better than yours!

Malinse: Nun-uh! MY imaginary sky fairy and b.s "holy" book is better than YOURS!

Voxoceanus: Is not!

Malinse: Is too!

ad infinitum

...when Mohammed took his last breath upon this earth, Muslims were split (Fourth "who should be first Caliph" Ali and First Caliph Abu Bakr). Henceforth there have been divisions and struggles and battles and bloodshed, with various fatwas in between to try and mend the wars and rifts. But the divides are as deep as love and hate, and no amount of Ulamas and Caliphs can bridge the divide of a sinful heart toward God. Man needs a saviour, not a leader. So God sent the only one who has ever been spotless who could mend the rend, His Son Jesus, who died as a sacrifice to pay the price for us. What does Islam offer that can equal that?

Where is the text you speak of , you say..... The of Christian god has not changed in 4500 years. To start with that predates Christianity and Jesus, so lets cut the BS and to the chase. There are no less than 16 Different Bibles for the different Christian denominations. If we take one of them lets say the King James version, it has been revised no less than 5 times, omitting and adding to every print. Even with those revisions, one has to read the preface of the KIng James version which will tell you in black and white that despite their best efforts this version still contains many mistakes which are so grave and so many .. etc.

After the above, how can you claim the word of god in Christianity is pure and has been pure for 4500 years? If the word of god is different from one denomination to another and is revised in every version.

The word of God that is pure is the Holy Quran, and that is why Muslims guard it viciously. We are not asking you to believe in Islam we frankly do not care one way or another. We are already Muslims thank god and can only ask guidance and mercy for your ignorant hateful souls.

God said in the Holy Quran: Oh say unbelievers, I do not worship what you worship, and you do not worship what I worship, you have your religion, and we have ours ...

Its Islam's live and let live attitude in a spirit of tolerance to the ignorant "others". Having said that, Muslims are not the "turn the other cheek" sort, they are more of the "Do not tread on me" sort. So do not stick your hand inside the bee hive and then scream damn bees stung me. If you can understand that parallel then you are beginning to understand Islam's attitude towards you. Muslims are fiercely proud of their religion and culture. And you maybe more advanced technologically but culturally you have nothing to offer us, rather you can learn much from Islam.

Hear, hear. A religious apologist at his best.

First of all things could get a lot worse if we act to make them worse instead of working to make them better. Second, freedom of speech and expression means that a person can not be silenced and arrested for what they say if it does no harm to others. It does not mean that what is said is right or necessary. If one person says something inflamatory and idiotic, one hundred thousand people can and should say that that person's espression is wrong and that they should not be sayng it. Those one hundred thousand also have the right to freedom of expression, and this in no way violates the individual's rights. The idea of free expression is to be able to change people's minds. Third, do not become like your enemy - this is what they want.

I'm an atheist, fuckwit. So, try again...and see if you can string together a coherent argument next time. You might even try reading what is written before you attempt a snarky response - it usually makes one look less stupid.

I agree with everything you wrote. So, what's your point?

what a comment by you . . . who's forcing to like?

I agree with what you have written, which echoes Orwell in "Politics and the English Language"..."...so are as the word 'fascism' has any meaning at all...it simply connotes something undersirable." I am not sure how you intend it to apply to this particular article, but my personal view is that a failure to distinguish between an idiot Florida pastor agitating about "Islam" and a suicide bomber out to actually kill people is an example of the 'labeling' issue you have raised.

It is indeed an example; when labels are applied to religious matters it is much worse because religion demands faith, which already involves a suspension of reason, so what you get is emotions working on emotions without an iota of commonsense in sight. A further point is that, for all its destructive potential, these emotional states, born one might say of ignorance, are more exhilarating than commonsense and abandoning them is like reluctant descent from a high. I don't see how you get rid of all this unless you put something in the water.

You cannot seriously believe that Arab negativity over Israel is no more than a cover for ‘self-made problems’ whatever they may be. If anything, the opposite is true and the ostensible acquiescence of some Arab regimes, particularly Egypt and Jordan, to Zionist adventures stirs the local grassroots unrest that calls for strong control. 97% of Egyptians believe Iran to be perfectly entitled to its nuclear program, Ahmadinejad comes third on their list of favoured leaders http://tinyurl.com/244d6gt , bread prices in Egypt have recently risen 500%, the masses are getting restive, Mubarak is ailing and without an obvious successor. That is where the real problems lie that the Arab states, or rather their unelected leaders, keep under control. Be grateful for it. I don't want to get into your Arab/Israel circularities but your comment above illustrates precisely the point the author here is making.

You seem to think people "misunderstand" Islam, why don't you enlighten us? First explain the concept of Dal al harb and Dar al islam, if you dare. What about Dhimmitude?

Islam is like a turtle. When they are ounumbered or about to be defeated they cry "peace" and go into their shells, but when they have their enemy under the sword, they do not return mercy. It will all end soon for them though. Revelations talks about their blood reaching to the horses bridles (those in control of their going out) in the valley of decision (Armageddon)

It was Standard Oil of Southern California who led the oil exploration that began the process of bringing up the oil. the Saudis decided on the US over Britain for the contract to produce it in 1945. It was a business deal. We use oil and they had it. What followed was the once bandits-now royal "princes" funding Wahabbi radical schools all over the world with the petro dollars. We didn't make them radical, the money and the power that went with it did.

DISIGNY. Why not go back farther with your assumption of "Muslim meddling"? John Quincy Adams said, to have nothing to do with Islam:

"In the seventh century of the Christian era, a wandering Arab of the lineage of Hagar (mohammed), the Egyptian, combining the powers of transcendent genius, with the preternatural energy of a fanatic, and the fraudulent spirit of an impostor, proclaimed himself as a messenger from Heaven, and spread desolation and delusion over an extensive portion of the earth. Adopting from the sublime conception of the Mosaic law, the doctrine of one omnipotent god; he connected indissolubly with it, the audacious falsehood, that he was himself his prophet and apostle. Adopting from the new Revelation of Jesus, the faith and hope of immortal life, and of future retribution, he humbled it to the dust by adapting all the rewards and sanctions of his religion to the gratification of the sexual passion. He poisoned the sources of human felicity at the fountain, by degrading the condition of the female sex, and the allowance of polygamy; and he declared undistinguishing and exterminating war, as a part of his religion, against all the rest of mankind. THE ESSENCE OF HIS DOCTRINE WAS VIOLENCE AND LUST: TO EXALT THE BRUTAL OVER THE SPIRITUAL PART OF HUMAN NATURE...Between these two religions, thus contrasted in their characters, a war of twelve hundred years has already raged. The war is yet flagrant...While the merciless and dissolute dogmas of the false prophet shall furnish motives to human action, there can never be peace upon the earth, and good will towards men"

John Quincy Adams
Sixth President of The United States of America
1830

Only the blind refuse to see, Islam cannot co-exist in any free democratic states. Their whole concept is: "rule by Koran". Anyone sho tries to teach otherwise is speaking from the pit of Hell!

...analysis and whatever that useless pile of Glenn Beck garbage that you linked to is 2 completely different things.

You have lost sight of who you truly are!

Consider yourself properly duped.

Please do not be phobic! Welcome to the twilight zone where we control your criticisms and your moral values. Sharia law coming to a town near you soon!