Obama's Handcuffs

Was the Ahmed Ghailani verdict a victory for the rule of law, or the final nail in the coffin of the Obama administration's attempt to try terrorists in civilian courts?

NOVEMBER 18, 2010

Robert Chesney:

It was inevitable that participants in the larger debate over terrorism and detention would make too much of the Ghailani trial's result. An across-the-board conviction would have been touted on the left as proof that civilian criminal prosecution should completely displace both military commissions and indefinite preventive detention (subject to habeas review). An acquittal would have been touted on the right as proof of the opposite.

Neither argument would have been persuasive. In any one case, the efficacy of prosecution is deeply contingent on the particular mix of evidence, legal issues, judge, and jury. Failure or success in one instance is no guarantee that the same result will be achieved in the next case.  The ambiguous nature of the Ghailani verdict -- a near acquittal, but a conviction on a single count that could still could open the door for the maximum sentence of life in prison -- leaves both poles in the debate trying to make lemonade from lemons. They are both doing their best to portray this as either a sufficient victory (though it does not look that way to many) or a complete defeat (which is just ridiculous).

Much of the post-verdict debate has centered on the question of whether obstacles the government encountered in this case could have been avoided had Ghailani been tried by military commission. While there has been much talk of evidence that could have been admitted in a commission that was excluded in the civilian setting, there has been very little convincing explanation of why this would have been so. At the same time, there has been insufficient attention to the unique problems that would have arisen had the case been tried by military commission -- most notably the certainty of protracted appeals over the propriety of a military commission's ability to prosecute a conspiracy charge. The U.S. national debate would be better served if it focused less on the question of the proper prosecution venue, and a lot more on the question of whether and when it is worthwhile to pursue any prosecution under circumstances in which the government has already decided it will hold the defendant indefinitely even if it loses the case.

Robert Chesney is the Charles I. Francis Professor in Law at the University of Texas, a distinguished scholar at the Robert S. Strauss Center for International Security and Law, and a nonresident senior fellow at the Brookings Institution. He blogs on national security-related legal topics at www.lawfareblog.com.

SHIRLEY SHEPARD/AFP/Getty Images

 

WINSTON SMITH 9584

10:21 AM ET

November 19, 2010

A victory for our Constitution...

The truth is the "War Terror" is threatening our freedoms...this issue needs to keep being raised and people need to fight back against the authoritarian mindset.

This verdict in NYC of an accused terrorist is a victory for our Constitution, civilian justice system with jury trials and our way of life.

Shame on Republicans and conservatives such as Rep. King to militarize our justice system, abandon the constitutional principles of our justice system which has protected our liberties while requiring the government to prove its accusation before a civilian jury trial...now authoritarian minded conservatives are even proposing subjecting American citizens to military commissions...so much for the rhetoric that conservatives and Republicans favor small government or respect our Constitution.

 

CHRIS SMITH

4:14 AM ET

November 20, 2010

Constitution <a href-"http://www.whichreviews.co.uk">reviews</a>

The verdict is a great victory for the constitution. It highlights the justice system is still doing its job and protecting our liberties.

 

PALMER

1:21 PM ET

November 19, 2010

The justice system is the principled legal approach

"It's time for a step back -- for a principled legal approach that admits that the United States is at war with al Qaeda, provides a legal framework that allows for preventive detention, and permits the use of the criminal and military commission systems to hold terrorists accountable in certain, specific cases -- as with American citizens."

Well, actually, trying Ghailani in federal court was the principled legal approach, and resulted in conviction with a sentence that will be, at minimum, 20 years and may extend to life.

The prosecution could not prove the charge of murder to the jury's satisfaction. A major reason for that is our own policy. If we follow Mr. Zarate's suggestion, we are at war with al Qa'ida and therefore mr. Ghailani would be a prisoner of war and entitled to full Geneva Convention protections, which he has not enjoyed. On the other hand, if he has committed a crime, he needs to be tried in a civilian court. The problem with the prisoner of war/al Qa'ida soldier approach is that the prosecution was not able to demonstrate that Mr. Ghailani was a sworn member of al Qa'ida.

The fundamental issue here is that the U.S. subjected Mr. Ghailani to "harsh interrogation techniques." That is a choice. If the U.S. subjects prisoners to harsh interrogation techniques, we must accept that we are sabotaging our ability to take that individual to trial. Whether tried in civilian court or in a military commission, evidence obtained by torture, abuse or "enhanced interrogation techniques" will not be admissible. If we decide that the intelligence value of what may be obtained through interrogation and detention overrides the possibility of later obtaining a conviction, then that is the risk we take. It is just silly to be upset later when evidence is excluded from a trial that makes a murder conviction unlikely. That is the logical consequence of choosing harsh interrogation, actual or quasi torture, imprisonment in "black sites," and incarceration at Guantanamo. The murder conviction would probably not have been possible in a military commission, either, due to similar rules of evidence.

So, we already have a "principled legal approach that admits that the United States is at war with al Qaeda and provides a legal framework that ... permits the use of the criminal and military commission systems to hold terrorists accountable in certain, specific cases -- as with American citizens." What we don't need is to adopt a policy of preventive dentention, which is clearly unconstitutional. The United States has clarity and legitimacy in its long-term legal and policy approach to detaining terrorists in this long war, if we just use our own laws and court system.

 

MISSDIM_SS

5:59 PM ET

November 19, 2010

A victory for our

King to militarize our justice system, tatil abandon the constitutional principles of our justice system which has protected our liberties while sinema requiring the government to prove its accusation before a civilian jury trial...now authoritarian minded tutune son conservatives are even proposing subjecting American citizens to tv shop military commissions

 

ARMEDLIBERAL

2:58 PM ET

November 20, 2010

Victory for the Rule of Law

It's a wonder that there was any conviction at all, considering the way the military and the Bush administration bollixed-up the handling of these cases. If they'd been tried sooner, the probably would have been executed as soon as useable intel had been gotten out of them--no need for torture or illegal extortion; it's ineffective. The holding of these prisoners played into their leaders' hands. There is no greater danger to our security than incompetent leadership. Thank (the Christian) heaven for Obama.

 

ENLISTENZ

4:09 AM ET

November 22, 2010

To Robert Chesney

II perked up my ears, and those of the U.S. Army JAG officer I was working for at the time,- President Obama's initial statement that some Gitmo prisoners could be held indefinitely because the evidence of their guilt was corrupted, but we knew they were dangerous, so couldn't release them. But your assumption that this was one of them is throwing me. Apparently, an American jury could still convict on some charges. So why was this one of those? Or were you making a broader statement that I also don't get?

 

HRIS

4:33 AM ET

November 22, 2010

what a waste of money

just hang him instead - he is a terrorist after all, with blood of innocent peolpe on his hands