BY RICHARD MCGREGOR | JANUARY/FEBRUARY 2011

"China Is Communist in Name Only."

Wrong. If Vladimir Lenin were reincarnated in 21st-century Beijing and managed to avert his eyes from the city's glittering skyscrapers and conspicuous consumption, he would instantly recognize in the ruling Chinese Communist Party a replica of the system he designed nearly a century ago for the victors of the Bolshevik Revolution. One need only look at the party's structure to see how communist -- and Leninist -- China's political system remains.

Sure, China long ago dumped the core of the communist economic system, replacing rigid central planning with commercially minded state enterprises that coexist with a vigorous private sector. Yet for all their liberalization of the economy, Chinese leaders have been careful to keep control of the commanding heights of politics through the party's grip on the "three Ps": personnel, propaganda, and the People's Liberation Army.

The PLA is the party's military, not the country's. Unlike in the West, where controversies often arise about the potential politicization of the military, in China the party is on constant guard for the opposite phenomenon, the depoliticization of the military. Their fear is straightforward: the loss of party control over the generals and their troops. In 1989, one senior general refused to march his soldiers into Beijing to clear students out of Tiananmen Square, an incident now seared into the ruling class's collective memory. After all, the army's crackdown on the demonstrations preserved the party's hold on power in 1989, and its leaders have since worked hard to keep the generals on their side, should they be needed to put down protests again.

As in the Soviet Union, the party controls the media through its Propaganda Department, which issues daily directives, both formally on paper and in emails and text messages, and informally over the phone, to the media. The directives set out, often in detail, how news considered sensitive by the party -- such as the awarding of the Nobel Peace Prize to Liu Xiaobo -- should be handled or whether it should be run at all.

For More

Portraits of a Rising
Military Power


Photos of the PLA and its rivals.

Perhaps most importantly, the party dictates all senior personnel appointments in ministries and companies, universities and the media, through a shadowy and little-known body called the Organization Department. Through the department, the party oversees just about every significant position in every field in the country. Clearly, the Chinese remember Stalin's dictate that the cadres decide everything.

Indeed, if you benchmark the Chinese Communist Party against a definitional checklist authored by Robert Service, the veteran historian of the Soviet Union, the similarities are remarkable. As with communism in its heyday elsewhere, the party in China has eradicated or emasculated political rivals, eliminated the autonomy of the courts and media, restricted religion and civil society, denigrated rival versions of nationhood, centralized political power, established extensive networks of security police, and dispatched dissidents to labor camps. There is a good reason why the Chinese system is often described as "market-Leninism."

 SUBJECTS: CHINA, EAST ASIA
 

Richard McGregor, former Beijing bureau chief of the Financial Times, is author of The Party: The Secret World of China's Communist Rulers.

ROVERXIE

12:21 PM ET

January 4, 2011

Depressing

It's depressing to read that the ruling of CCP will continue for at least the next 10 or 20 years.

CCP has completely abandoned the very idealogy upon which it was founded 90 years ago, it has betrayed the people that sacrificed so much to put CCP in power. CCP has now become the biggest interest group in the world that relentlessly accumulates wealth for its members by shamelessly exploiting the hardworking, ordinary Chinese people. Look at how many people had to burn themselves to death to stop bulldozers from tearing down their houses! Look at how wide-spreaded corruptions are among all levels of CCP officials.

Dazzling economy growth has blinded the eyes of people. Excessive consumerism has posioned people's mind. Now most Chinese people just don't care, or have become numb about what terrible things are happening with other poor, unpreviledged fellows. I guess CCP is happy to see this happening---materialism individuals don't pose threats to its ruling.

 

MEGAKIDS

4:35 AM ET

January 6, 2011

Depression? Say Who?

Hey Buddy, why don't you go take a cold shower and sober up? You can only name the social ills but what's the alternatives? Taking the Indian model? The US model? Wake up. I think the only pair of eyes that was blinded is yours.

 

FREETRADER

9:47 PM ET

January 6, 2011

@Megakids

"What's [sic] the alternatives?" Oh, I don't know, how about NOT having a corrupt dictatorship rule over one quarter of humanity?

Are you seriously suggesting that the US "model" is inferior? Really?

 

BBURGESS66

2:37 PM ET

January 7, 2011

Depression

Me.. Been here 10 yrs .. and yes it is depressing to realize I'm only 1/2 (or maybe only a 1/3) of the way thru .. YUK!

 

WIXTROEM

11:50 AM ET

January 5, 2011

does it belong?

Still, the communist ideology is about economic planning and end of capitalism. I.e. collective ownership. The thing with propaganda and imprisonment of opposition is not connected to communism. Although this might be the picture in the US.

 

GRANT

8:30 PM ET

January 5, 2011

The economic side of

The economic side of Communism mentions planned economies and collective ownership*. The political side owes more to the idea of an educated vanguard party leading the uneducated people** which can be translated more or less to the elites leading the masses towards economic power.

* Which is somewhat political I'll admit.
** Which was one justification for why the Soviet Union didn't grant more decision making to the people that Socialism was supposed to bring and why there was a Communist state in the non-industrial state of Russia.

 

THE MAGUS

12:59 AM ET

January 6, 2011

There isn't a separate "economic side of communism".

Communism is all about economics. Collective, centrally planned economics. Everything else is secondary. Without communist economic policy, it's not communism. China is indeed communism in name only. That doesn't make the government any less totalitarian, but there are plenty of non-communist dictatorships, and dictatorship existed long before Marx and Lenin.

 

GRANT

2:45 AM ET

January 6, 2011

To start the current China is

To start the current China is not (despite what people seem to think) totalitarian. It is authoritarian. The two systems are completely different.
As for Communism, it has political aspects and economic ones. The economic side is (in my interpretation) initially what was most heavily argued over and indeed the proponents seem to have assumed that all people would happily work together and so there was no need to think of state institutions but as time went on and some countries actually became Communist they needed some kind of state structure.

 

KEVINSLATEN

9:03 AM ET

January 7, 2011

Agreed.

Communism is on the economic continuum, not the political one. Some political systems may *tend* to match up with economic ones, but the relationship is not necessary.

 

BBURGESS66

2:38 PM ET

January 7, 2011

U.S. Picture

Been here 10 yrs now .. it is my picture too. :-S

 

GRANT

8:26 PM ET

January 5, 2011

The first argument about the

The first argument about the nature of China's government ignores that many authoritarian states follow the same lines. I won't deny that the Chinese Communist Party (CCP) derives a good deal from the old Soviet model but they have imported (or independently created) some ideas from outside as well.

Also let's not forget the fate of the Soviet Communist Party. Ironically, since the CCP has all the tools it needs to prevent another political group from challenging it the CCP has also made it far more likely that some fatal blow will come from their own hands. My personal bet is that rising nationalism among the citizenry will eventually push the CCP into making some move that is political suicide abroad.

 

UFOINSIDER

3:23 PM ET

January 6, 2011

Most likely assessment

I would agree that without an internal pressure release, China will seek it externally or face internal decay. This is the fate of ALL authoritarian/totalitarian (call it what you want) regimes. When things go bad or become stale, the inability of leaders to accept criticism, and inability of citizens to replace them or the party which they have grown disillusioned with requires a scapegoat. This translates to internal purges and external aggression, with the underlying problems remaining, resulting in a split from reality, resulting in chaos, and China will prove no exception these tendancies.

Also, while it is true that Chinese culture has thousands of years of experience with highly centralized, efficient beaurocratic empire management, history also indicates periods of internal decline when the agencies themselves eventually take over and then fail to change quickly enough as times demand. These periods offer another window of opportunity for the citizens to speak up on their own behalf.

This is the central point: that the citizens choose this on their own, and those in the US who want to be 'right' about Chinese democracy are counterproductive as far as the international conversation is concerned. It is not viable to attempt to impose it in China, they will eventually choose it themselves. While the US imposes a certain amount of democracy where it can, it does so because it
A. can
B. sees itself as being compelled to
C. it is preferable to supporting a dictatorship
(US shortcomings in this area do not invalidate the intention, and are reflection of the realities of the real world.......)

The political theory driving democratically elected republics (the most durable of the configurations) is ultimately a result of the citizenry choosing to enact such a system. Any time China and anyone supporting them deny the viability of democracy simply to 'prove' how China is independant (we know this already) they are doing the citizens of China a gross disservice.

The OP accurately points out that the poorer, disenfranchised regions would have more to gain through noncompliance than the areas currently on the gravy train: this is one of the strongest drivers of democratic involvment, namely, to take an active role which otherwise has been denied. While a certain amount of centralization is becoming increasingly evident in Western society (on its own, with no guidance from China), this merely serves to strenghten the debate faculties of the societies regarding WHAT is and HOW it is centralized. In addition, 10% growth is not sustainable forever, and China's economy risks becomming a bubble (it it's not there already). Even were that not the case, basing the legitimacy of a authoritarian approach on economic success will not be enough in the long term.

The last point is that China is merely assimilating from external sources and then refining/altering much of the ideas and technology driving their developement at this point. This brings us to the stongest benefit of an open society: the generation of new ideas. While there will continue to be innovation and advances in China, these innovations are merely derivatives of outside sources of wisdom. Stability, currently the CCP's strongest justification, is by no means the extent of Chinese ability to think. For China to tap into her own, historically rich wisom in a satisfying manner, such an inquiry will be approached by the whole of Chinese society and not by a small group of politicians.

When that day comes, I have no idea

 

MJKT

10:00 PM ET

January 5, 2011

An absence of Communist ideology does not a communist state make

What you describe is a totalitarian state. No one argues that China is not a totalitarian state. There is a difference between a totalitarian state and a communist state. If a state no longer lives the ideology of communism but instead state capitalism, it is truly no longer communist. So, yes, China is communist in name only.

 

KEVINSLATEN

9:05 AM ET

January 7, 2011

Pardon me.

*I* don't claim that China is totalitarian. And neither do most Chinese people. Even the author of this article argues that China doesn't control people's lives in this way anymore. MJKT, your comment is not grounded in reality.

 

MJKT

5:11 PM ET

January 7, 2011

Not totalitarian?

So China is not totalitarian because they've allowed their people some economic freedom and they have backed a bit out of the day to day lives of their people? Note that they still allow these "freedoms" from the top down. Until the rule of law is in place rather than the rule of the will of the party, it is still a totalitarian state. It is at the whim of the government whether or not they continue to allow these openings in freedoms rather than the will of voters. The Party could change its mind tomorrow in a leadership meeting. Wake me up when there is a free press, free internet, rule of law, freed political prisoners (including Nobel Peace Prize winners), and the government is directly responsible to the people.

 

MENG BOMIN

6:33 PM ET

January 7, 2011

The word "authoritarian" exists for a reason

I'd say that China definitely qualifies as an authoritarian state, not a totalitarian one. For an example of a living, breathing totalitarian state, one only needs to venture to China's northeast and look at North Korea. The "total" in "totalitarian" refers to total control over the lives of its people. China has loosened up on that since Mao's time, so I'd call it authoritarian (still not a compliment) and not totalitarian.

 

PAPAPENG

10:33 PM ET

January 5, 2011

State Institutions

Has it not occurred to anyone that an ancient and venerable civilization as China's is quite capable of evolving its own political institutions and institutions of state to be able not only to thrive in the 21st century but also to show the way to the future? In China's long turbulent history there had been at least half a dozen catastrophic epochs that would have wiped out other world civilizations never to recover. Yet each time China came back stronger and better than before. Do note that there is no Doomsday Scenario in China whether in folklore, in mythology or in religion. And so it was with the 19th century depredations of foreign invaders from across the oceans. The Chinese response was not despair or to seek solace in religion but how to fight back and restore China's greatness. It took Mao and 200 years. Mao's godlike status in the history of China is assured. All your attempts to demonize Mao won't succeed.

The next question is how did China manage to steer the Ship of State with such uncanny precision that it encountered no major setbacks and can produce an unbroken run of double digit growth for three decades? The answer is that China's leaders can draw on 2500 years of experience in governing a large empire. That imperial system fell in 1911. But the lessons in the management of men and societies learned through the centuries are still valid now as then. The 21st century evolution of China's institutions and polity will be built on the parts of this imperial legacy that work and to come up with pragmatic and tested solutions to eliminate the innate weaknesses of the imperial system. Marxism, socialism, western democracy, etc. are all western imports that served their purpose and China has accepted the best practices while rejecting ones that are obviously nonsense such as Western banking phantom wealth creation.

Do not try to force fit China into your western institutional prejudices. China is quite capable of charting her own path. Already your classical theories as expressed in the Washington Consensus is already falling apart. For all the Nobel prize-winning economists, the ridiculous number of think tanks in any field, your political institutions you have not been able to come up with a grand recovery plan. The United States and Europe appear to be headed for deeper crisis in the short term and stagnation in the long term.

 

DOM WYNN

6:31 AM ET

January 7, 2011

Quaint ideas

Papapeng....
Your knowledge of your own history seems fairly woeful. China wasn't even united until Qin Shi Huang in 221BC, and only delivered what we know as the centralised bureacratic state of today during the Song era from 979AD. Since the collapse of the Song in 1234AD until Mao, with a brief interlude with the Ming during mid C14th to Mid C17th, Chinese history has been continually shaped by external influences whether it be the Mongols, the Arabs, the Manchu or the West.
Mao was certainly up there with Stalin in terms of ability to command the execution of millions of his own people, but as far as the PCC having managed to 'steer the ship of state', I would suggest it has done so only by stuffing the mouths of the urban populace with gold. The reality is that rural dissatisfaction is accelerating rapidly (58,000 public order offences in 2003 vs 87,000 in 2005, the last year that the PRC has actually allowed figures to be published). If I was describing China as a ship of state, it would be a merchantseaman stuffed full of gunpowder with the Captain running around attempting to put fires out, while liberally spilling Kerosene everywhere.
On another note, the moment a Nationalist Han can actually explain in a coherent and informed way how Western thought has progressed from Aristotle, Aquinas, Descartes, Locke, Kant and Witgenstein and concede that these are not 'classical westerncentric' world views but actually contemplations on the human condition, is also likely to be the moment I take note of the 'grand theory' of a one party state.

 

COLINMCA

12:46 PM ET

January 7, 2011

Well put Dom Wynn. It seems

Well put Dom Wynn.

It seems that Han chauvinists are like all other varieties of nationalists when they artificially construct and hopelessly romanticize an imagined past to shape their contemporary reality. China like all other societies has had a complex and dynamic history, shaped by internal and external forces, with many facets of its culture and political life shifting dramatically throughout its historical experience. Summing it up in a quaint phrase like "2500 years of experience" is downright ridiculous considering the true complexity of history and human societies.

It requires a truly absurd level of essentialism along the lines of the "Chinese are like THIS," as well as an attack on the source of alternative ideas (accusations of Eurocentrism and the like) rather than their content to sustain such a line of thinking. For apologists of the CCP its a particularly ironic condition - considering China's contemporary political system was imported from the Soviet Union and the state's still official ideology is at its core a Western political philosophy.

I have no doubt that China's unique culture, historical circumstances and traditions will partially shape its future political development - but so too will the forces of modernity, development and exchange with the rest of the world. Your allegorical description of the Chinese state speaks to the enduring challenges of maintaining a contradictory, closed and opaque political system in the modern era. I am doubtful that the CCP will be able to sustain it in the long term, considering their significant success in establishing modernity, prosperity and dynamicism in many segments of their society. These forces will eventually run up against the backward authoritarian structure of the Chinese state, and will reform it.

 

BBURGESS66

11:43 AM ET

January 8, 2011

Lessons learned?

.. they still show that those lessons of eons past have not been learned .. at all, it seems.

 

COLINMCA

11:33 PM ET

January 5, 2011

On the long-term viability of CCP rule

I am skeptical on your conclusions regarding the long-term viability of party rule in China. China is a unique case, but not all incidents of democratization and political liberalization have occurred within US "protectorates." In addition, I have a hard time considering your view when a plethora of Asian, African, Latin American and Eastern European societies (with limited democratic histories in most cases) have rapidly liberalized in recent decades. The notion of Chinese exceptionalism - especially considering their increasingly modern consumer, business, and social behavior is very problematic.

Perhaps the party will be able to extend its rule for a few more decades, but this doesn't change the the reality that fundamental contradictions exist within the country's political structures. Simply put - should economic growth slow significantly, or a crisis of some type (environmental, political, social, ethnic, foreign etc) emerge - the system cannot fully account for possible political failure. It is interesting you bring up the Leninist mode of party organization, as it was information and protracted crisis that led to its demise within the USSR, simply once public discontent has been unleashed, the system cannot effectively control it short of a reversion to totalitarian modes of control.

The Chinese case is defined by economic growth, consider it a sort of bribe to the Chinese middle/upper class - sort of along the lines of we will keep delivering the goods as long as you keep your mouths shut. This is fine and dandy, but citizens that have an economic stake will eventually demand input, protection of their interests and full accountability. They will also demand personal recognition of themselves as full and equal citizens. Future crises or shifts will spur this process, as they have in other societies.

The PRC is not China, it is the party's state. So for example, if the democrats are unpopular, their congressmen and members of the executive are punished in an election. The United States with its governing institutions, legal apparatus and state functions persists, as it is not a party state. The same thing cannot be said about China's communist party, it is the state and when it falls so too will the state it has erected. Should the party be discredited, the only viable political outlet is systemic reform - likely through the inclusion of alternative political groups, or some form of democratic pluralism.

I think your argument is on the wrong side of history, and in the long run will be proven invalid.

 

ALEXBC

1:40 AM ET

January 6, 2011

Bribery

"The Chinese case is defined by economic growth, consider it a sort of bribe to the Chinese middle/upper class - sort of along the lines of we will keep delivering the goods as long as you keep your mouths shut."

It is a bribe, but to an even smaller sliver of the population that you realize:

http://blogcritics.org/politics/article/china-worries-more-for-eus-growth1/#ixzz1A7iINKAv
http://english.eastday.com/e/101205/u1a5589976.html

"The PRC is not China, it is the party's state. So for example, if the democrats are unpopular, their congressmen and members of the executive are punished in an election. The United States with its governing institutions, legal apparatus and state functions persists, as it is not a party state."

Well, the US has not had a regime change since the midway point of the Qing Dynasty. Consistent rule of law probably has something to do with that.

 

DINGYIBVS

6:31 AM ET

January 6, 2011

You're looking at it the wrong way

The CCP isn't the party's state. Despite of its name, it isn't even a party. The CCP is China's state. It's not the equivalent of a Democratic party or a Republican party, it's the equivalent of the Government of the U.S.. The Chinese equivalent of parties are the "Shanghai gang" or the "Communist Youth League cadres." When they do not perform, they, like the Democrats/Republicans, are indeed punished by having less net influence in the party, tantamount to losing seats in the Congress.

 

COLINMCA

12:17 AM ET

January 7, 2011

That seems like a stretch

It seems like a farce to compare internal party squabbling, jockeying and infighting satraps and apparatchiks to actual democratic competition between separate political parties in constitutional systems. One's BS detector has to go off on that one.

Internal-party factions, divisions and interest groups are significantly different than separate political parties competing for authority within state institutions. I think you are alluding to the fact that current internal CCP politics are significantly more fragmented than historical communist parties like that of the USSR or its Eastern Bloc vassals. This is a good point, however it is important to note that internal debate does not constitute a true multi-party system; in that competition is not fully transparent, structured or institutionalized. If anything, these informal "cliques" and interest groups in the broad tent that is the CCP are the makings of future independent and autonomous political groups that will better pursue their respective agendas in a fully competitive and participatory system.

You are right to say that the CCP is the Chinese state, or at least like in the traditional Leninist mold it has constructed a facade of state institutions (I.e. a formal constitution) in parallel authority with internal party organization. The former are dominated, and penetrated by, as well as subordinated to the party. But make no mistake, there are potential political groups in China beyond the rather opaque structure of the party, as well as elements within the party (as previously seen by the splinter sects in the Soviet CP) that depending on circumstances will have their interests better served in a more competitive and transparent system.

The party is the Chinese state, and when its organization reforms, fragments or shifts, the challenges to its hold over the Chinese state and its facade of institutions will be immense. I have no doubt that the China of 2050 will be an influential, prosperous economic juggernaut and modern nation - But I doubt it will still be the "People's Republic of China."

 

FEYNMANFANGIRL

12:11 AM ET

January 19, 2011

Democracy is a funny word.

Japan was technically a democracy since 1945, but for most of that time has been a one party state under the LDP. In China I think the Party is likely to endure, but it will be increasingly answerable to the Chinese citizenry. Already activists for mild change have put up fights against land confiscation and the like, things which would have been impossible even a decade ago. The Rule of Law and Democracy will not come overnight to China, but they will come bit by bit, as the government has to do more and more to keep it's people happy.

 

TOCHARIAN

12:33 AM ET

January 6, 2011

Chinese Orwellian talk

I am employed at a North America University and there are a lot of Chinese students and academics (including professors) in Science and Engineering. Most of them tell me openly that they would prefer to stay in the West, even if they feel loyal to Han Chinese culture and civilization. That proves to me that, in spite of all this talk about "China's rise", the government of China can't even convince their own citizens, especially intellectuals, to study and work in their own country. It's not a secret that many a bright young Chinese student or professor would rather go to Harvard, Stanford or Cambridge than stay in China, if they have the chance. That's why I am very skeptical when people talk about 2500 years of Chinese wisdom and imperial legacy that the West cannot match. Why is the Chinese government then so interested in sending their brightest minds to the US (or Europe)? And why are they so intent on technology transfers from Western companies (Siemens for example). It would be a lot more honest to say that humans learn from each other (and also from each other's mistakes), but apparently the politburo of the CPC (and the ancient Chinese emperors) are infallible!
I believe that many Western intellectuals (and perhaps also politicians and businessmen) have a rather simplistic and naive view of the long-term strategy of the Chinese State (which happens to be Communist for now). It seems like wishful-thinking to me for the West hope that sooner or later "universal values" such as human rights and freedom of speech will prevail in China and I hope we are not in for a rude wake-up call soon.
My personal memories of the time of Mao Tse Tung: I was living in Burma during the 60's when Mao forcefully (PLA is a communist army!) tried to impose Communism and this rubbish called "The Cultural Revolution" (with those little red books!) onto Burma and he almost succeeded! It was a scary moment for me.

 

ALEXBC

1:34 AM ET

January 6, 2011

"That's why I am very

"That's why I am very skeptical when people talk about 2500 years of Chinese wisdom and imperial legacy that the West cannot match."

You are right to be skeptical, since that standard Netizen line is pure boilerplate. The West's intellectual tradition is as old and sophisticated as China's, stretching back to Greece, Rome, and ancient Europe's productive dialogue with Mesopotamia, Egypt, and Northern Africa. None of that even touches upon how the West has more or less run away with the intellectual race over the course of the past half-millennium. Have you ever been to a Chinese university? It's a cultural vacuum compared to any of its Western counterparts.

Present-day China has advanced quickly in part by stealing from the West. High-speed rail technology is a perfect example. Years of corporate espionage and weak intellectual property protections let China purloin technology that had been honed in France in particular.

I'm split on my feelings toward this article. On the one hand, the other is definitely correct about China's persistent Leninist tendencies, which throw water on sentiments of writers like Tom Friedman who view the CCP as a "reasonably enlightened" group of people. On the other hand, the idea that the party can rule forever seems naive. The CCP would still have to hold power for another 12-13 years merely to match the USSR's duration. Erstwhile Asian dictatorships like Indonesia and the Philippines seemed bulletproof at one time, too, so I would not dismiss "The Party cannot rule forever" with a flippant "Yes it can."

 

TCH

3:59 AM ET

January 6, 2011

Alexbc

You encapsulate my thoughts perfectly.

 

XTIANGODLOKI

11:08 AM ET

January 6, 2011

Of course living in the US is better

The reason why many people stay in the US is because the US is better for the most However, not everyone can migrate to the Western countries because of immigration policies.

The fact that living in the US is better doesn't mean that the Chinese government is failing. It means that the standard of living in China has not caught up yet, and it giving the population of China it is unlikely that the average person in China will ever catch up to the average person in the US. That is changing though for some. I personally know half of a dozen couples who are research assistants/post docs at Harvard or MIT and one couple just left the US to head his own department at a leading Chinese university this year. Another is actively looking for opportunities in China. I can't blame them for leaving, given their knowledge and skills they are getting paid only about 65k a year by the top universities in the world. Their universities are also slow in getting them greencards which will allow them better employment in the US. Chinese institutions on the other hand are starting to offer much better incentives for qualified people.

 

KEVINSLATEN

9:08 AM ET

January 7, 2011

XTIANGODLOKI

Agreed. Good points.

 

GANYMED

6:22 AM ET

January 6, 2011

Washington Consensus

Maybe I missed something but since when exactly has the WC been about "democracy"? Good joke.

 

MOBILEJACK

7:22 AM ET

January 6, 2011

Neighborhood controls are alive and well

Very interesting and spot-on in most respects. However, the author could brush up on 'Myth' number 2. It may be true that intrusive neighborhood-level totalitarian controls have eased in many areas, but they are alive and well in the most intimate and personal area: permission to have children. Those who defy the rules are subjected to a range of penalties that today include dismissal from employment (including for family members), house arrest, beatings, property destruction (sometimes the family home) and forced abortion. Chen Guangcheng has done much to expose this state of affairs, and has suffered for it.

 

XTIANGODLOKI

11:42 AM ET

January 6, 2011

The average Chinese women has 1.8 birth in 2008

This means that the average Chinese woman on average will have close to two children in her lifetime.

The enforcement of the one child policy was more strict back in the 70s and 80s in urban areas. However anyone who has the basic knowledge of China will tell you that today it's barely implemented in urban areas and has always been overlooked in rural areas. Minorities have never been subjected to this policy.

Since last year, even in Urban areas like Shanghai, the government now is doing away with this policy by allowing those who have no siblings to have more than 1 kid.

 

KEVINSLATEN

9:12 AM ET

January 7, 2011

MobileJack: stop fearmongering

The far majority of Chinese live without gov't influence in most of their decisions. Of course, the gov't heavily influences many systemic factors, but in the micro-world of individual life, most people are free to do as they wish in China, with a few political exceptions.

Usually when foreigners (relative to China) exaggerate such aspects of China, they either 1?have never been there, 2) don't more than one or two Chinese people, or 3) are intent on demonizing China, separate from facts.

 

KEVINSLATEN

9:15 AM ET

January 7, 2011

One more add-on...

Ask Chinese people, is China ??? (fa zhi de) or ??? (ren zhi de) country. After that, ask them to explain these concepts to you. This conversation may give you some insight into the "power" of the CCP at the individual-level in China.

 

KEVINSLATEN

9:18 AM ET

January 7, 2011

I can't use Chinese characters?!

This is an article about Chinese politics that directly comments on Chinese people's lives, yet Chinese people have no way of discussing on here unless they are English literate. Moreover, perhaps they want to share specific ideas that are hard to translate into English. All of this is complicated, to say the least, by a Chinese language restriction on this forum.

Of course, most readers here don't read Chinese. But I still think the function should be here, even if for principle alone!

 

XTIANGODLOKI

11:24 AM ET

January 6, 2011

It's not the type of government its the results which matter

For all of the argument about China's one party rule, people seem to forget that it's not the type of government which matters, it's the quality of the life in the countries. The author mentions that the key reason why the middle class is not revolting is because their lives are getting better: they are getting paid more, they are getting fancy cars and houses, etc. That makes perfect sense. If the middle class is getting better in China, just why would the people want change? Why would the West want to change this?

Granted, the life of an average person in China is still not all that great. Their living standards are currently ranked slightly below the average for all countries in the world. However, their living standards have also been improving faster than most other nations in history. Major changes are not going to happen when things are going well.

If any of the Western democracies have China's population I seriously doubt that they would perform any better than China today. This is exactly why Western nations are very tight on immigration control. Most of their domestic policies, especially those involving government benefits, would seriously deteriorate if the population becomes much much larger.

On the other hand, India has been often referred as a beacon of good opposite to China because India is a democracy with open media. However, the average life of Indians are much worse than those in China, positive changes are happening at a much slower pace, corruption is worse in India than China, and violence in relation to human rights abuses (particularly in Kashmir region) is often worse than what is going on in China. Why is this?

What's troubling the Western NeoCon types is the rising China is challenging their long held belief that democracy and freedom makes a better nation. This is one of the major reasons why you see so many China bashers going out of their way to discredit any positive changes in China today even when its clear that China is getting much better as a country. If the idea is that Democracy and freedom will make better a nation of over a billion people, then India will be better than China in the future. When the average Indian lives better than that of the Chinese, then you will definitely see more Chinese wanting democracy and freedom.

 

MJKT

3:51 PM ET

January 6, 2011

Human Rights

"If the idea is that Democracy and freedom will make better a nation of over a billion people, then India will be better than China in the future. When the average Indian lives better than that of the Chinese, then you will definitely see more Chinese wanting democracy and freedom."

Every developing nation develops at a different pace. Many different factors are in play with the development of China and India economically than just democracy/freedom versus totalitarianism.

The view from much of the free world is more that human rights of more importance than economics not the other way around. However, it is also recognized that it is difficult for a population which is lacking basic living standards to focus on their individual rights.

I think China has some very good examples that Chinese people can be both economically successful AND free; just look across the strait at Taiwan. Hong Kong as autonomous from the PRC is also doing very well. I don't buy the excuse that the Chinese people need their freedoms restricted in order to succeed economically.

 

BEN1398

1:06 AM ET

January 7, 2011

Democracy not ripe for China yet

I was born in HK and live here thru the British rule till now. HK's success is never based on its so called "democracy" but rather on the "rule of law". The democratisation process in HK creates political deadlocks and inefficiencies even for a city just over 7 million. Taiwan's democracy is not an admirable model either if you probe deeper into their elections. Their legal system is a joke.

But when we are travelling and operating businesses in China, we have to resign to the fact that with a population over 1.3 billion and grossly diversified educational levels China is right now not yet ripe for full democracy. It might take generations to get to that level.

However, CCP is doing a great job that they pump out 6.5 million university level graduates which has a even higher per capita figure than in Hong Kong. So, they are doing a lot of catch-up work (after losing the early decades on meaningless political in-fightings) to improve the educational mix of the vast population but it is also a very dangerous act that if China cannot provide sufficient jobs for these new graduates then the challenges to the one party rule may arise rapidly.

Look at the results of PISA 2009, you have to give credit to CCP that they have been trying hard to improve the education system in China for the benefits of all Chinese races even though the embedded risks of higher social and political demands will follow. In my opinion, major political changes will come slowly first and speed up from the next generation with more political freedom but I won't dare to bet against the one-party rule of CCP at this stage yet.

 

SALVADOR FELIPE

1:07 PM ET

January 6, 2011

The "Nine Commentaries" on the Communist Party

I strongly recommend the "Nine Commentaries on the Communist Party" (I think it's free online if you don't want to buy it). The authors, native to China, have shown a great deal of detailed accounts from inside the party, and some of its atrocities that aren't well documented before.

Last forever? Not a chance. Have a deeper look.

 

BEN1398

1:25 AM ET

January 7, 2011

I am one of the mis-informed

I was demonstrating in the streets of Hong Kong in 1989 shouting "Fall to Li Peng" and "CCP goes down" and some renowned PRC defectors told us that they had reliable inside knowledge that CCP would break up within 2 years telling us to push harder.

Now, I am agaped at the improved standard of living and education achievements in China after 22 years of deceit by those mal-information claiming that CCP will break up soon.

 

BBURGESS66

11:40 AM ET

January 8, 2011

Still mis-informed

living standards and education are still not that great

 

JAMESC

11:49 PM ET

January 6, 2011

"The Internet Will Topple the Party."

Whether it will or not is a *long term* question, and one that's probably unanswerable at present. Especially since we're still only in the early days of the Internet. Yet the article's answer is a flat 'Nope' that's based purely on the fact that up till now, the Internet's effect haven't seemed to work against the party.

 

KEYBASHER

11:11 AM ET

January 7, 2011

The Olympic Curse

When ever a one-party state hosts an Olympics ten years later that state circles the drain if not already down it. To wit:

1936: Berlin Olympics / Garmisch-Partkenkirchen Winter Olympics.
1946: Allied Occupation

1980: Moscow Olympics
1990: Collapse of Communism

1984: Sarajevo Winter Olympics
1994: Yugoslav Civil War

2008: Beijing Olympics
2018: ?

Look for some serious changes in China around 2018-2022.

 

RAY WALKER

2:48 PM ET

January 7, 2011

China's Rising military ambitions

China is developing a credible Blue Water navy and technologically advanced aircraft, as well as a large and well trained army. Anyone considering challenging China's influence and control of Asian waters should be extremely cautious. China has complained about the American/South Korean naval exercise in the Yellow Sea. I assume that in the near future America may see a Chines naval presence in Mexican and South American waters, a tit for tat.

Wars between nations are always won by the one with the greatest economic and industrial power. America was well insulated in World War 2 by two oceans that our enemies could not control. Our industrial strength defeated Nazi Germany and Japan.

During the Korean War the PLA sacrificed manpower to halt the American military actions in North Korea. American firepower brought the war to an armistice that is still in effect. But today China's firepower and economic power is expoentially greater than in 1950.

I think actions that lead to war with China would be insane. The question I can't answer is to what extent China is willing to gamble on pushing America to a confrontation that could end up in a war. I cannot see either side in such a war winning a profitable victory. If China's internal political system is weakened they might well decide to strengthen their internal political control by a war, limited I would think to removing American power and control in Asian waters.

The future is up for grabs. I hope sane men rule in both nations.

 

ZHANG FEI

10:11 PM ET

January 7, 2011

The unspoken reason countries

The unspoken reason countries near China provide the US with significant amounts of land at no cost (and indeed, provide financial subsidies) for American military bases is to protect them from regional powers like China and Russia. This is no surprise, given the historically expansive territorial ambitions of both countries. The only reason China would have for sending ships to the Latin American or Caribbean regions would be to interdict trade between North and South America. This will be vigorously opposed by all of Latin America, given that the US comprises one of their biggest markets.

 

WWWWW5AAAAA

10:13 AM ET

January 9, 2011

what have the West done?

I'm a Chinese. It's really depressing to here the CCP's autocracy will continue. If the western people think so, how can you hope the Chinese people to set up a democratic country?
Maybe The CCP has sell the interest of Chinese people to the Western countries, if not , Why don't the Western countries put their words into actions?

 

OLIVER CHETTLE

11:29 AM ET

January 12, 2011

China is too big to conquer,

China is too big to conquer, and it has nuclear weapons. The West is in decline. You are on your own.

Westerners created democracy without external help, but now our democracy is failing us. If China wants democracy, it will also have to get there on its own. Hopefully you will find a way to avoid the built-in flaws that are increasingly obvious in Western democracies. Certainly, once China is rich, the Chinese people will discover that wealth does not lead to happiness, just as every other country has when its GDP reached advanced world levels, and then the Communist Party will be in a pickle, because the oppression in exchange for growth deal it offers will no longer seem worth taking.

 

OLIVER CHETTLE

11:23 AM ET

January 12, 2011

China is communist in name

China is communist in name only. It is actually fascist. State ownership of the economy defines communism, and once it has gone, a country can't be communist, no matter how many other characteristics it has in common with other communist regimes.

Read this list again: "eradicated or emasculated political rivals, eliminated the autonomy of the courts and media, restricted religion and civil society, denigrated rival versions of nationhood, centralized political power, established extensive networks of security police, and dispatched dissidents to labor camps." If this is your definition of communism, Nazi Germany was communist, and so is Saudi Arabia. It is actually a list of the characteristics of authoritarian government, which could exist even if no one had ever had the idea of communism.

 

BETALOVER

11:53 PM ET

January 14, 2011

I see that I am not the only

I see that I am not the only one to make the observation.

The author tries to expound on why China is not communism in name only, but his writing shows just that China is precisely communism in name only.

Communism is an economic concept; so when the concept of collectivism is gone, communism is gone.

I don't think he intends to make this error, but there seems to be the erroneous suggestion that China is less democratic because it is still communist.

No, China is less democratic, a one-party state, mostly because it is still a rather poor country, but also due to its history of both of central authority and also the bitter experience of foreign domination. But it is in transition.

 

BETALOVER

12:14 AM ET

January 15, 2011

China not totalitarian

"No one argues that China is not a totalitarian state."

I do. Totalitarianism is too strong a word to describe China.

Freedom comes from many facets, not all is tied to political structure of a government or political participation of the citizenry.

I believe the fervor at which some Americans approach the promotion of democracy stems from a certain mindset; may I say that of a repentant and now progressive former aggressor who nonetheless is unwilling to be cognizant of the wrong doings of his forefathers.

I think some Americans really have to make a deep reflection. There may be the temptation to view most American success as due to the American political structure, although a large bulk of it is. Natural resources remain a large part of the American economy; and our half-acre single family single story dwellings. Where did we get all these? Earthquake kills only a few because of our low population density. How?

There is already a lot of freedom in China. The Chinese government metes out freedom that people do enjoy; Americans concentrates on the fact that such freedom is meted out seemingly capriciously not as the result of the correct political system.

In this economy, if your skills are not in high demand and you have an unreasonable boss, you can well be less free than one living in China with a reasonable boss. You cannot exercise your imaginary freedom, highfalutin ideals notwithstanding.

 

BETALOVER

12:49 AM ET

January 15, 2011

Fascism

"China is communist in name only. It is actually fascist."

I strongly disagree that China is fascist.

I think you should understand what fascism means so you won't use the term indiscriminately.

On religious freedom, I don't view the US as fascist even though it continues to slight the free-thinking non-believers.

The Christian majority often say that atheists should acquiesce to the American tradition of Christianity. I am very tired of being always in rage when I feel being slighted and abused.

Credit cards are a major relief as the insulting “In God We Trust” is not on it; my kids cannot have a lemonade stand as then I have to take cash and be insulted over and over again, one dollar at a time.

I never want to go the court to bear witness. I will feel an even more profound sense of alienation when I hear “so help me God”. It seems a suggestion desirability of intellectual castration, rather revolting.

Obama’s inauguration would have been a spiritual experience for me as he represents social progress in my country, but I really dreaded the G word. The sense of insult will be so profound. I did not, as I could not, allow myself to be so exposed to such insult.

China has had a long history of secularism, why can it expect believers to live with some restrictions?

I think when the US stops all the insulting practices on the free-thinking non-believers it will be on a higher moral ground to object to China requiring churches to register with the state, for example.

 

WWWWW5AAAAA

7:26 PM ET

January 16, 2011

I'm sure you're successfully

I'm sure you're successfully brainwashed by our party
And till now I know the reason why more and more elites are going abroad, there are a lot of guys like you to protect the party.
Please do not think you're sure about a lot of things.
Please DO LOOK AT THE ORDINARY PEOPLE LIVING IN CHINA!!!

 

ZHADALAX

10:29 PM ET

January 23, 2011

The logical conclusion of Friedman's "golden straitjacket"?

"The party allows citizens great leeway to improve their lives, as long as they keep out of politics. "

And how is this bad exactly?

I would argue that the VAST majority of electorates (possible exception being the US and pro-American Europeans) only care about democracy instrumentally, that is they believe that democracy provides the best material standard of living, rather than just being a good in and of itself.

As such, China's model (when evaluated on it's own merits rather than a priori political values) is distasteful primarily to Western political elites for whom open interest group politics are the natural milieu. I would venture to guess that Western publics on the other hand would willingly trade their right to cast a ballot every few years in exchange for decades of sustained 8-10% GDP growth. The great majority of people are like vegetables in a garden. If they get plenty of water and sunshine in the form of economic entitlements and the right to chill out and screw around, then they could care less about the arcane minutiae that self-governance gives them a voice in. Only elites see the ability to have a say in government as worthwhile for purposes higher than economic considerations: namely the chance to push said government into adopting their own designs for society. Most (all?) elites are ambitious individuals who would like to mold society in their own image. For historical reasons* Western elites, much more so than Eastern (Chinese) ones came to the conclusion that structured rather than all-out competition for political power was mutually beneficial, hence they acceeded and continue to acceed to institutions that limit the power of all involved. In China, and much of the rest of the non-Western world, the competition continued/continues until only one dominant elite person/group remained, and the rest either accepted subservience (dropped/were stripped of elite status) or were exiled or killed. Hence in a country like China the elite seems to speak with almost a unanimous voice when it's meant for the ears of either foreigners or the domestic public. Within the elite any disagreements that might arise are hushed up. (Arise they do, in spite of the existence of an informal pecking order that manages to be more rigid than anything in Western politics).

*I would say the history of Europe versus the history of large eastern empires accounts for this. In Europe centers of power were relatively close-by, and after centuries of killing each other off and trying to gobble up each other's land, the power brokers came to the conclusion that it was necessary to have some form of mutual constraints. Not so in China (or other large empires). There was one power pole for thousands of miles in every direction, and openingly challenging it was suicide. Up-and coming elites were thus much more likely to acquiesce to second place than to try venturing a bid for ultimate greatness. There was thus that much less pressure to create power-balancing institutions right up until and into the modern world.

In conclusion:
As technology races ahead, driving societal complexity ahead of most voters' ability to be meaningful participants in the formulation of public policy, the need for a meritocratic, yet elitist, and thoroughly bureaucratic government will become paramount. In this world, global governance and yes, global government, will NOT work if it's done on the principle of one person one vote in the context of multiple political parties. A state like Singapore-writ large is the likely model for the early-mid 21st century. (With the current rate of technological progress, I won't venture to guess what sort of political system, if any, would make sense beyond ~2050).

 

DANGDANG

3:02 PM ET

January 26, 2011

Fostering Democracy

"But all were effectively U.S. protectorates, and Washington was crucial in forcing through democratic change or institutionalizing it. South Korea's decision to announce elections ahead of the 1988 Seoul Olympics, for example, was made under direct U.S. pressure."

And what about the United States supporting Chun Doo-hwan during the Gwangju uprising? Does that count as being pro-democracy? Or is it more accurate to say that the democracy movement in South Korea eventually succeeded despite the United States, and not because of it.

 

THOMAS A.

11:36 AM ET

January 28, 2011

the party HAS ruled forever

Over the centuries the Chines have developed and kept a social system well suited to their demographics and geography.
Its current Communist hypostasis is not substantially different from the Mandarin/Imperial model

 

BETALOVER

6:32 PM ET

January 28, 2011

China today is far more progressive to its past

"Over the centuries the Chines have developed and kept a social system well suited to their demographics and geography.
Its current Communist hypostasis is not substantially different from the Mandarin/Imperial model"

I am sure that China today is far more progressive politically and socially than its imperial past.

There is much more freedom today. Socially, sexism is much ameliorated. Politically China is far more open than its imperial past and its recent radical past as a republic.

China today is not progressive compared to the West today, domestically.

China today may be more progressive than the West in foreign policy, debatable at least.