Blinded by the Right

The GOP's blatantly partisan love for Bibi obscures a dangerous reality: that unwavering support for Israel actually hurts wider U.S. interests in the Middle East.

BY MICHAEL A. COHEN | MAY 24, 2011

In 2003, Democrats upset about President George W. Bush's plans to invade Iraq invited French President Jacques Chirac, an opponent of the war, to address a joint meeting of Congress. It was blatant political play, an attempt by the opposition to work with a foreign leader in offering a counterargument to the president's invasion plans and limit his ability to carry though with his decision to go to war in the Middle East. Chirac was feted across Washington by liberal think tanks and pro-French lobbying groups as American politicians and Democratic activists fell over themselves to be identified with a strong anti-war leader.

This, of course, did not happen. The idea that Congress would openly side with a foreign leader against the president of the United States seems too far-fetched to believe. Remarkably, however, something not dissimilar happened in Washington Tuesday, May 24, as Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu spoke to a joint meeting of Congress (a speech interrupted more than 25 times by a rapturous standing ovation). While these types of congressional addresses are rare, this particular event is even a bit more unusual: The speech's intention -- with the full assistance and backing of the Republican leadership in Congress and implicit support of Democrats -- was to give Netanyahu a public forum to offer a rebuttal to President Barack Obama's recent proposals for moving forward with the Arab-Israeli peace process.

As the New York Times reported last week, the invitation was initially requested by Netanyahu of the GOP leadership before the president's Middle East speech plans had even been formalized: It was "widely interpreted as an attempt to get out in front of Mr. Obama, by presenting an Israeli peace proposal that, while short of what the Palestinians want, would box in the president." In turn, Obama's May 19 speech was scheduled purposely so that the president could get out ahead of Bibi's remarks.

It's one thing for Republicans to oppose the president's position on Arab-Israeli peace. In the hours after Obama's Middle East speech, Republican presidential contenders like Tim Pawlenty and Mitt Romney did just that, arguing that the president had proverbially thrown Israel "under the bus." (Never mind that Obama simply reiterated long-standing U.S. policy toward the Arab-Israeli peace process.) They were joined -- in a bipartisan manner -- by prominent Democrats, including Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, in offering pushback on the president's words.

It is certainly appropriate for members of Congress to disagree with the president's foreign-policy agenda. But it's something else altogether to be appearing to work in concert with the leader of another country in trying to put the president on the defensive -- and seeking to score a partisan political advantage in the process. By openly siding with Netanyahu against Obama and making Arab-Israeli peace a partisan issue, Republicans in Congress are at serious risk of crossing a dangerous line and in the process undermining U.S. interests in the Middle East.

This behavior follows a concerning pattern. Last November, House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, after a meeting with Netanyahu, suggested that a Republican Congress would serve as a check on the Obama administration when it came to Israel policy (a position he later sought to walk back). In the fall of 2009, Cantor criticized the Obama administration for its rebuke of the Israeli government over the eviction of Palestinian families in East Jerusalem's Sheikh Jarrah neighborhood. Most surprising of all, the attack was lodged from Jerusalem, where Cantor was heading a 25-person GOP delegation -- an unusual violation of the unspoken rule that members of Congress should refrain from criticizing the U.S. government while on foreign soil. Former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee took a similar position this February while traveling in Israel. He called the Obama administration's opposition to Israeli settlements (a position long held by Democratic and Republican presidents) equivalent to "racism" and "apartheid."

Last week, as Netanyahu lectured Obama at a frosty White House news conference and issued statements on what he "expected to hear" from the president about his commitment to Israeli security, Republican lawmakers barely batted an eye at behavior that by any other foreign leader would spark outrage from their caucus -- and instead aimed their attacks at Obama.

This seems at pace with the GOP's default position on Israel. This February, writing in the pages of National Review, Romney stated that "Israel must now contend with the fact that its principal backer in the world, the United States, is seeking to ingratiate itself with Arab opinion at its expense." It's a view that no doubt would have been met with astonishment in Arab capitals, where America's image remains largely negative. One can't help but wonder whether the tail isn't wagging the dog -- after all, is there a reason that the United States shouldn't seek to ingratiate itself with Arab public opinion? There is an implicit assumption here that no matter what Israel says or does the United States must continue to be blindly supportive -- an odd stance for an American politician to take, particularly when Israel's actions occasionally run counter to larger U.S. interests.

Although one cannot ignore the fact that strongly held empathy for Israel is, in part, motivating this position, there is of course a healthy dose of domestic politicking at work. Democrats have long relied on Jewish support -- both electorally and financially. Republicans, though less reliant on Jewish voters, have successfully made support for Israel a litmus test for Democrats to prove their national security mettle. Moreover, with strong backing for Israel among the party's conservative base, defending Israeli behavior has become a surefire way for Republicans to politically cater to social conservatives and evangelical voters. In fact, Israel probably enjoys more clear-cut support for its policies among social conservatives than it does among American Jews! (And Netanyahu, in particular, didn't just fall into this love fest: He has long supported and helped spearhead the alliance between the Israeli right wing and American religious conservatives.)

All this is a very far cry from George H.W. Bush's open conflict with Israel and the American Jewish community in 1991 over loan guarantees for Israeli settlements. That the perception continues to exist that Bush's aggressive stance cost him severely in the 1992 presidential election no doubt haunts the Republican Party -- and any American politician inclined to put public pressure on Israeli leaders.

But ultimately there is more than politics at stake here. At a critical moment in the political transformation of the Middle East, America's steadfast and unyielding support for Israel -- underwritten by both parties in Congress -- risks undermining America's long-term interests in the region. Last year, Gen. David Petraeus commented in congressional testimony that "Arab anger over the Palestinian question limits the strength and depth of U.S. partnerships with governments and peoples [in the region]." His statement provoked controversy in Washington, but ask any seasoned Middle East observer and you'd be hard-pressed to find one who disagrees with the general's assessment. It is not Iraq, Afghanistan, or Libya which is the greatest source of anti-American attitudes in the Arab world -- it is the continued lack of resolution of the Arab-Israeli conflict and the view of many in the region that the United States has its thumb on the scale in favor of Israel.

None of this is to suggest that Washington should turn its back on the Jewish state. But this is also a time when a more evenhanded position on the conflict is desperately needed -- particularly as the United States will need to deal with a new government in Cairo that will likely be less supportive of Israel, a wave of unsteady democratic reforms spreading across the Mideast, and a U.N. General Assembly that appears ready to endorse Palestinian statehood this fall. These events will have serious repercussions not just for Israel but for U.S. policy in the region. Obama at least seems to realize this fact and has -- albeit tepidly -- challenged a recalcitrant Israel to get serious about peace. Yet Congress seems intent on restraining his leverage, effectively holding U.S. actions hostage to the whims of partisan politics -- and in the process working in concert with a foreign leader to do it. At some point, it raises the legitimate question of who is looking out not for Israel's interests, but America's.

MANDEL NGAN/AFP/Getty Images

 

FIFTH HORSEMAN

6:38 PM ET

May 24, 2011

Watching the most powerful

Watching the most powerful man in America being fawned over by his captive audience is a potent example of why separation of church and state is so important for the survival of America and its democracy.

 

JOSHKLEMONS

11:52 PM ET

May 24, 2011

Congress stood up for "military presence along Jordan River?!?"

What was going on at that speech? It did not even make sense at times. Check out my full analysis at
http://israel.foreignpolicyblogs.com/2011/05/24/bibi-gets-a-standing-ovation/

 

RKERG

2:54 AM ET

May 25, 2011

Its the Wars stupid

The Repubs, who have strong constituencies among the so called defense industry and Christian evangelicals, have found in the support of the Israeli Likud party a win win situation, they can profess to the evangelicals that they are carrying out "Gods plan" and bringing the end of the world nearer while finding more conflicts and wars in the region to enrich their benefactors in the arms industry. Pretty slick.

 

ROMAN GIL

3:01 AM ET

May 25, 2011

America's Fatal Love Affair With Israel

America’s Fatal Love Affair With Israel Gained Us a Permanent War.

If we had followed George Washington’s advice in his “Farewell Address”, we would not have become involved in the “War on Terror”. I loaded his complete address in my blog and highlighted the parts that are of special interest to Americans that believe in the American limited constitutional republic type of government.

By intervening in the Israel-Muslim conflict, we created the conditions that started the American war with Muslim terrorists. Intervening in other countries always leads to war and enemies. Terrorism is the strategy of the powerless when they fight the powerful. The next step in this permanent war is that terrorists will detonate dirty or conventional nuclear bombs on the NATO countries and America. We have to stop the steps that are leading us to this end and change the strategy to win and end the war before it escalates.

Why are we providing Israel annually with $3.5 billion American taxpayer debt dollars? They are rich and can afford to defend themselves. Israel has nuclear weapons and a strong military; they don’t need our money or participation in this Israeli-Muslim conflict that has been going on even before the founding of Israel in 1948. Why are we paying Egypt annually over $1.5 billion in foreign aid? The American taxpayer is paying foreign aid to many nations, but Communist China has no foreign aid. China buys oil fields, mines and finances the government debts of the American and now European governments. China is obtaining real power and influence by following the policy that George Washington explained in his “Farewell Address” advice to the American people.

The global interventionist policy gained us Israel’s enemies. The terrorist attack on 9/11 is a result of intervening in a conflict that concerns Israelis and Muslims. Osama Bin Laden’s strategy was to draw America into conflict in the Muslim world to bankrupt us like what happened to the former interventionist, expansionist Soviet Union. The Afghanistan war and the many Soviet global interventions bankrupted the Soviet Union and caused its ignoble collapse in 1991. We have been playing Osama’s game since 9/11 and we are losing our wealth and power.

We get most of our oil from Canada and other suppliers that are not in the Middle East. The Communist Chinese announced last year that they now have a controlling interest in Iraqi oil and proudly announced the receipt of the first oil shipments. It is clear that they have a strategy of gaining real power at the expense of the follies of other powers.

We are fighting a war against maybe 2,000 Al Qaeda terrorists without a military strategy to win the war. Instead, the military talks about the nonsense of “nation building” and “democracy building” in Iraq and Afghanistan. We just added thousands of new enemies by intervening in Libya. The Libyans that Obama killed have families. Every bomb that falls in the American Muslim war is financed by debt and represents a nail in our coffin. We really know how to win friends and influence people.

An economist estimated that the total cost of the war on terror is $5 trillion. 57% of Americans that are fighting this war are contractors, not military personnel. The war contractors are now a powerful special interest group. They are not likely to voluntarily abandon this lucrative business and join the underpaid and overtaxed American civilian population.

The terrorists have more time and supporters than we have money. To survive we have to stop all interventions and occupations in the world. We must defend our borders and attack only targeted actual terrorists. This total divorce from the world's problems will eventually cause the terrorists to focus on their own internal affairs because they will see that America is out of their area and that it's in their best interest to end terrorism against America to keep us out. This is the only way to end this permanent war before we enter the terminal stage of our economic and social cancer.

The $1.65 Trillion dollars out of a budget of $3.7 Trillion, that the Federal government has to beg and borrow this year and every year, should not be spent on war contractor profits and foreign affairs. Confront reality; The USA is the largest debtor in world history. The annual national current account balance losses are over $700 billion (this is wealth that is lost according to the formula national assets-liabilities). Industry is only 9% of the economy.

According to the official government statistics, 36% of males 16 to 64 years old are permanently out of the labor force and don't count. The Federal, State and local governments must reduce their size by 37% to fit actual taxes.

There are not enough taxpayers to support this huge government of over 20 million people and an equal number of people that are employed by dependent government contractors. Taxes are too high already. Most taxpayers are struggling with increasing local property tax increases and the rising cost of living.

We need to re-industrialize to become financially and politically independent from the global corporations and special interests. America has to nation build to restore its prosperity. 47% of American households are too poor to be legally obligated to pay income taxes. American owned companies cannot compete with imported global corporate products made with cheap labor. We cannot survive competing with Chinese that earn $200 a month.

Focus on our own problems, end globalization, mass immigration and re-industrialize with free enterprise competitive American owned companies before we become another failed state. Stop voting for the two political parties that ruined America. Choose independent politicians and change them when they sell out to the special interest groups. Constitutional government must represent national interests that include corporations, the rich, the middle class and the poor.

Roman Gil
http://roman-gil1.blogspot.com

 

COURTNEYME109

3:51 PM ET

May 25, 2011

@Roman Gil

Please understand - for whatever reasons - Americans are always totally hot to support sister democrazies - you know - tolerant egalitarian societies with a penchant for periodic, transparent elections, civie control of the military, an independent judiciary under elected gov oversight, a nat'l treasury under public accountability and a free, open press.

Not unlike Great Satan's support for Little Satan.

As for Mr Cohen's inappropriate handwringing - most Americans simply do not particularly care what unfun, unfree, intolerant and somewhat unhinged nation/states that fear facebook, girls or a real election (all fully crunk with secret police, secret trials, secret prisons and secret executions) think, feel or with hold support from America.

Most Americans consider it totally cool to be feared, hated, despised and dissed by state or non state rocket rich rejects, haters, jerks, gendercidal creeps. Autocrats all - they lose every war they fight and only seem adept at collecting foreign aid, tormenting their own ppl, their neighbors and any democrazy in weapons range.

Who cares what they think?

We revel in their dismay

 

AARON11

8:16 AM ET

May 25, 2011

AIPAC

is the Likud Lobby, not the Israel Lobby.

America needs to cut-off Mini-me Israel: no more chocolate Mini-me!

Israel will learn to compromise when it is cut off.

Oh! And our weapons and aid to Israel are in contravention of our own Arms Export Control Act. They are illegal since Israel has committed war crimes with them.

Go home Bibi

 

MARKRAB

10:19 AM ET

May 25, 2011

AIPAC

AIPAC is an American lobby organization. Its made up of Americans, funded by Americans so hence supports American interests. Please see any poll on Americans' support for Israel...you'll see the overwhelming majority of Americans strongly support Israel! The percentage of support has not changed for decades and Israel is one of the most favorably viewed countries by American citizens.

Why do you have such a problem with AIPAC and not any of the other thousands of lobby groups?

Specifically, the Arab Lobby which encompasses many of the most powerful players in Washington and paid directly by Arab governments, according to the New York Times which described the Arab lobby as an "elite band of former members of Congress, former diplomats and power brokers who have helped Middle Eastern nations navigate diplomatic waters here on delicate issues like arms deals, terrorism, oil and trade restrictions."

Powerful lobbyists working on behalf of the Arab lobby include Bob Livingston, Tony Podesta, and Toby Moffett. Arab governments have paid "tens of millions of dollars" to "top" lobbying firms that work to influence the American government. This includes the Saudi Arabia lobby, Egypt lobby and even the Libya lobby to name a few.

Just one example was in the wake of 9/11, when Saudi Arabia hired the lobbying firms Patton Boggs and Qorvis, paying $14 million dollars a year to lobby for Saudi interest. This is just a drop in the bucket because other Arab gov't have done the same for decades. In fact, the Arab lobby spends way more than AIPAC annually.

 

MARKRAB

1:51 PM ET

May 26, 2011

PTR

I read all the articles you posted...nothing in those articles but news about the accusations which proved to be false. Rosen's statements following his arrest are nothing more than a disgruntled employee's ramblings. There is no proof and there has never been any proof that AIPAC as an organization spies for Israel!

I find it extremely disturbing how you ignore foreign funding and influence of The Arab Lobby. It has influenced American policy for decades yet you continue to obsess about Israel.

You are the epitome of the Anti Israeli, Anti Semitic conspiracy theorist...you troll around the web finding articles that you can use to spread your hateful propaganda.

Why don't you post on Al Minar or Iran Khabar TV about how the Jews control the world and manipulate the media. You'll find like minded brainwashed fools who will be more than eager to read your mid-evil libel accusations.

 

AARON11

8:18 AM ET

May 25, 2011

No one in Congress

is looking out for America -- they are sucking Israel's you know what.

And taxpayers are supposed to swallow all that Likud funk, that sweet that nast that gushy stuff? Ich dont think so.

 

AARON11

8:40 AM ET

May 25, 2011

Democrats suck also

Also will sign any check that Israel wants -- it is bi-partisan Israel c*ck-sucking.

You know it is.

If there is anything congress is good at it is at sucking c*cks of lobbyists: esp. AIPAC.

 

GROZNIC

1:33 AM ET

May 26, 2011

Agreed

Exactly right. AIPAC and friends have bought off our congressional Judases for only a little more than the proverbial 30 pieces of silver.

 

AHMEDWALID

1:29 AM ET

May 27, 2011

AIPAC is not a political action committee

so it doesn't "buy off" anyone. It can't and does not donate a single cent to any political candidates. Nor does it fund political ads on radio or tv. It is a "public action committee."

Remember children: pacs can donate money. AIPAC is not a political action committee it is a public action committee." There is a difference.

At least know the difference before you make stupid comments.

 

AN OUTSIDER

1:54 AM ET

May 27, 2011

Nice try, Troll

Puhleeze. As if the weight of any of the arguments presented here is dependent on the particulars of how AIPAC (and the myriad groups and individuals that work with it) exerts it's influence.

Here's what AIPAC showed everyone: Israel tells Congress "clap" and Congress answers "how hard, how long, and how many standing ovations?".

Besides, as if it isn't obvious that 'bought off' was meant as an appropriately approximate expression.

What at lame example of niggling at semantics. Hilariously, I guess that Forest Gump's "stupid is as stupid says" actually would be appropriate in your case. It must suck to be you.

 

MARKRAB

10:03 AM ET

May 25, 2011

Disgraceful writing by Mr. Cohen

It is a blatant lie that Mr. Netanyahu did not offer anything new during his speech. In fact, he is the first Israeli PM to suggest major settlement cities in the middle of the Westbank would be turned over to the Palestinians. He goes farther than any Israeli PM publically...even Yitzhak Rabin.

Also, Benjamin Netanyahu received bipartisan support from Congress and the speech was planned well before Obama's speech on the middle east. This is not some kind of attack on President Obama's FP but an affirmation of it.

During his speech Mr. Netanyahu thanked President Obama no less than 5 times for which he received standing ovations. Mr. Cohen forgets to mention that. Left wing activists like Cohen are trying to politicize basic American values which lead to support of Israel in oder to create division where there need not be any. Prime Minister Netanyahu and President Obama agree on 90% of the issues affecting the Middle East. and 99% of the issues overall.

-Both support democracy in the Arab world.
-However, both realistically fear it could be hijacked
-Both support sanctions against Iran and fear it acquiring WMDs
-Both support the creation of a Palestinian State
-Both agree Hamas can not be negotiated with
-Both support the Palestinian economy
-Both support Israel's right to defend itself
-Both understand a final peace deal will be based on 67 borders with land swaps to adjust for population shifts

The only disagreements are regarding Jerusalem, which is not even a full disagreement because the Prime Minister has said he would be willing to discuss a relative sharing agreement (see interview with CNNs Pierce Morgan). Its reasonable to expect Israel to hold onto some bargaining chips for future negotiations!

Finally, another mild disagreement is the stationing of Israeli security forces in the Jordan valley...which by Netanyahu's own admission would be temporary. If the Palestinians prove they are peaceful neighbors, which they have yet to do, Israel would be more than happy to withdraw its troop from the Jordan Valley. It is not land they plan to keep for settlement and will only be a burden and expense for the Israeli defense dept.

 

MODERATEWINGER

10:26 AM ET

May 25, 2011

Did Mr. Cohen actually watch the speech??

Because if he did, he saw just as many left wingers and Democrats stand up and give Mr. Netanyahu a standing ovation on more than one occasion.

Putting that aside for the moment, Netanyahu is absolutely right. They will not negotiate with terrorist leaders and organizations like Hamas, who's stated purpose is to wipe Israel off the map. Also Jerusalem is non-negotiable. That is the sacred home of the Jewish people, and must remain so.

Israel has bent over backwards to accommodate Palestinian wishes and still they want more. Israel is prepared to make the tough decisions, like Mr. Netanyahu said, but this has to be a two way street. The Palestinians leader Mr. Abbas must state unequivocally reign in Hamas, publicly state that Israel has a right to exist, and then, and only then, will serious talks begin.

 

ADDERBLACK

10:36 AM ET

May 25, 2011

odd

After the 2nd World War, no one told Japan to give China just 95% of Manchuria back. The Chinese just took the whole of it back.

I suspect that's the Palestinian viewpoint. You took our land. We want it back. All of it.

I'm not going to weigh in on the merits of that viewpoint. The point is, it could explain why the Palestinians come off as "demanding more".

The Israelis and Palestinians were really unfortunate enough to both be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

MARTY24

2:50 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Giving back territory

The analogy between Manchuria, Japan, and China on the one hand and the territories, Israel, (and Jordan) on the other doesn't work. Manchuria had been detached from China by Japan at the beginning of WWII and set up as a satellite state that collapsed with Japan's defeat in that war. There was no claim by Manchurians for the establishment of an independent Manchurian state. The analogy would actually lead to a demand for the return of the territories to Jordan.

Israel seized the territories after the Arabs chose to go to war with the objective of destroying Israel and massacring its civilians. That Israel struck first is basically irrelevant because waiting for the Arabs to strike first would have led to massive civilian casualties. Immediately after the 1967 war, Israel offered to exchage the territories for a full peace but the Arabs responded with the three "Nos" of Khartoum. That has remained the basic structure of the conflict ever since, except that now there are voices, including many on this blog, who demand that the Arabs get another chance to destroy Israel and massacre its civilians.

Normalizing the situation of the "refugees" should have been a priority since 1949 if not 1947; they should have been resettled and rehabilitated like every other refugee group. If the world allows the tactic of purposely keeping refugees in misery to succeed, it will have set a precedent that will result in large numbers of refugees being consigned to living in misery in perpetuity.

The solution is thus simple in concept though difficult in achievement: Resettle the refugees, presumably wherever they are living, and the Arabs agree that Jews will have the same rights they demand for themselves. Address these issues, and the rest could be done in short order.

 

AN OUTSIDER

8:48 PM ET

May 28, 2011

Don't worry, we know you won't ever give

So lame to watch these Trolls try their best. Here we see another Israeli pattern: all historical precedent that is troublesome "doesn't work", and evidently, all historical precedent that serves the Israeli cause is irrefutable somehow.

Niggling at the Manchuria example doesn't take away from the greater truth: much of the Palestinian perspective is reasonable, at the very least, as the previous post ably demonstrated. Nitpicking does you no credit.

Any your conclusion! WOW. How much gall do you need to be able to suggest this: "Resettle the refugees, presumably wherever they are living, and the Arabs agree that Jews will have the same rights they demand for themselves. Address these issues, and the rest could be done in short order."

Seems to me like your conclusion fits in perfectly with more settlements: just keep taking over land and pushing out the undesirables: it works out because the 'natural' conclusion is for them all to become someone else's problem. Clearly, it's never Israel's problem or responsibility. EVER.

I'll also mention one small problem with your 'conclusion': it is sickeningly inaccurate, because you will never give Arabs equal rights to Jews, so you can't suggest that the conclusion will be "Arabs agree that Jews will have the same rights they demand for themselves". Not in the theocracy that is Israel, certainly, unless your conclusion implies that Israel actually become a real democracy?

Wait a second! I forgot to put my xenophobic Israeli thinking cap on... The implicit bit in your 'conclusion' must be that all non-Jews will get cleansed from Israel, so there won't be any more problems of there being a sub-class or sub-citizens in your wonderful 'democracy'. It is so beautiful a vision, I almost have tears in my eyes - no doubt at the pride I feel that Americans are fighting and dying for this grand Dream that excludes them just as much.

Thanks for giving us more of the same type of selfish and self-centered thinking, just one more reason why people world-wide are running out of patience and turning against Israel. The world does not revolve around you, a$$holes. Will you ever learn to think of others?

 

ERCILLOR

11:51 AM ET

May 25, 2011

AND STILL ANOTHER POEM

RIGHT

"For the lands of our fathers
We will rise up and fight!"
All the peoples cry out
As they struggle and fall.

In the world roundabout
There's no shortage of right.
There just seems not to be
Enough room for it all!

ER
[SENSIBLE BEINGS: Please Read.]

 

ANDERBILT

12:04 PM ET

May 25, 2011

I take issue with some notions

First and foremost: that you can adopt a more isolationist stance with regard to some allies, in order to curry favor with some avowed enemies. Netanyahu was totally correct: Israel is where Arab-culture Israeli citizens live in freedom, and where a democratic government under the rule of law is fighting to flourish. They have every philosophical argument that underpins OUR nation on their side as well, while those who would abandon Israel for a more "smart" or "pragmatic" or "inclusive" bargaining position are willing to sell out every true friend we have in order to be left alive and unharmed by a tough enemy. For shame. Netanyahu is far from a crybaby, he's a tough voice of reason and clarity. I stand with him.

 

GHOSTCOMMANDER

12:48 PM ET

May 25, 2011

Adolescent American Politicians

Why have we sunk so low to being sycophants for the demagogues in American politics and even foreign so-called leaders like Netanyahu?

Where are our values, our principles, and our honor? Let us worship them, not demagogues.

 

MONGO46538

2:39 PM ET

May 25, 2011

Give AND Take

The only way to start a succsessful negotiation if your the intermediator is to get both parties back on their heels. We had to poke Isreal in the eye just to make them think we might be getting tired of kissing their rump. We will have no credibility if we do not acknowledge that blind alliance at any cost to either cause, is counterproductive.
The GOP cant seem to pass up any opportunity to cast Obama in a bad light no matter how wrong headed they are about it. Even if it means throwing a wrench in a possible solution to the Isreali / Palestinian quandry. They won't pass up an opportunity to get some good anti Obama talking points for the next election, no mater how many more poeple die as a result

Notice how often Son of Satan Sen. Eric Cantor has to get his puss in the Camera angle for all the recent GOP podium shots. ugh!

 

DSANZ

3:32 PM ET

May 25, 2011

Jewish Lobby

Too bad that FP has become a forum for people to vent their Jewish conspiracy theories. It appears that people actually believe that the "Jewish Lobby" is so strong that even the leader of the free world can't stand up to it.

"Jews control Congress." Am I the only one that thinks this is going too far? Am I the only one who thinks this stuff is dangerous?

 

YUDL11

12:55 PM ET

May 26, 2011

khalid

You know that "quote" is fake. It was originated by the Islamic Association for Palestine. Sharon said that he never said such a thing, and Kol Israel has no records of such a statement.

Long live the Radiactive Intifada!

 

YUDL11

1:47 PM ET

May 26, 2011

khalid

don't you have anything more recent? You know Fulbright was a long time Arkansas segregationist and anti-Semite.

 

YUDL11

2:19 PM ET

May 26, 2011

ptr

right! And what about the Brits and Canadians, not to mention Afghan and Paki civilians killed by the US. remember Pat Tillman!

 

AHMEDWALID

1:34 AM ET

May 27, 2011

Quotes from Palestinians

"We will turn the territories of the [Palestinian] Autonomy into [the Israelis'] graveyard. This will be the beginning of the end and a regression to a state of overall explosion, for which Israel will be held responsible, as it is responsible for the failure of the peace process today."

--- Chief Palestinian negotiator Sa'eb Ariqat Al-Manar, 8 June 1998

"War! War! Continue the struggle!"

--- Yasser Arafat, in a speech at the Dehaishe refugee camp near Bethlehem, 22 October 1996 (Arutz-7 Radio, 23 October 1996)

"When we stopped the Intifada we did not stop the Jihad [Islamic holy war] to establish Palestine with Jerusalem as our capital.... We know only one word: Jihad, Jihad, Jihad.... We are in a conflict with the Zionist movement, the Balfour Declaration, and all imperialist activity...."

--- Yasser Arafat, in a speech at the Dehaishe refugee camp near Bethlehem, 22 October 1996 (Yediot Aharonot, 23 October 1996). The Balfour Declaration was Britain's 1917 statement of support for a Jewish national home in the land of Israel.

"We sacrifice our blood and ourselves for Palestine!"

--- Response chanted by the Palestinian crowd to Arafat's above call for war (Arutz-7 Radio, 23 October 1996)

 

AN OUTSIDER

2:26 AM ET

May 27, 2011

Sounds like you have a problem, Israel

And your implicit suggestion, since you are too cowardly to actually write it down: that we should continue to blindly support what caused such terrible hatred to come about.

Besides, keep comparing yourselves with the worst people out there: it still doesn't leave you in a positive light, it still doesn't answer the question: at what point do Americans say enough is enough, I'm not going to help with the beat downs anymore? Can you think for a bit what you force us to do on your behalf?

This is what is so unbelievably stupid about everything that your post represents: hiding from a huge problem like the fact that you are an Apartheid state and an anachronism causing more strife world-wide than anything else on the planet.

Here is what all your friends (Jewish and otherwise) are trying to tell you: being a race-based society was and is a huge mistake.

You have two choices: either continue with the Apartheid approach, in which case your future will only get worse as you become ever more isolated, or decide to forget this idea that the country that is Israel needs to be Jewish, first and foremost, but rather simply 'the best and totally fair/safe for all its citizens'.

This is the 21st century! You will be safe if you learn to trust a bit, if you can give up on your racist world-view.

Conversely, you can deny your lies like the Gaddafis and the Assads, but everyone knows where that is going, just like you know, deep down, where the racist approach will take you.

 

NO2ISLAM

3:51 PM ET

May 25, 2011

Congress supports Israel because...

Support for Israel in U.S. at 63%, Near Record High
Near-record-low 30% optimistic about Arab-Israeli peace
http://www.gallup.com/poll/126155/support-israel-near-record-high.aspx

 

NO2ISLAM

3:52 PM ET

May 25, 2011

The Arabs have one goal...

... and one goal only; the total destruction of Israel. All talk of peace is just taqqiya, deception, a con game to shake down the West for billions of dollars in aid that only benefit the few, the powerful, and leave the many in perpetual misery, and hatred... Only useful idiots believe otherwise.

 

DR. SARDONICUS

7:56 PM ET

May 25, 2011

You'll be sorrrry!

As if the Republicans had not trampled all over that line for the last forty years. I am stunned by the epidemic of institutional memory loss inside the Beltway when it comes to High Crimes & Misdemeanors committed by Republican presidential challengers and their Administrations.

Nixon went behind Johnson’s back to negotiate with the North Vietnamese

Reagan went behind Carter’s back to negotiate with the Iranians

Bush the Lesser went behind Clinton’s back to negotiate with the Taliban (and got good and burned for his pains).

In any other country, this would testing the knife-edge of treason -- all perfectly straightforward and on the record in this one. Along with election tampering, torture, exposing intelligence agents, lying on the record, violating the Constitution and therefore their oath of office, using the Justice Department for political purposes and pretty much any other HC&M you can think up.

In the USA, Republicans can literally get away with murder, with the Democrat’s blessing. That is the only way they can win and keep the White House, since their policies would have been unpalatable in a true democracy and their candidates, honestly unelectable since Dewey.

We will come to regret this slippery slope of permissiveness. Big time. I promise you.

 

GOSGOG

9:01 PM ET

May 25, 2011

Bibi vs Obummer

Seems to me a lot of y'all have forgotten that the 'Pres & wife" started out loving the MUSLIM world and disliking the U.S.., Including his love for Muslims and the Arab world.Think about this:-
Mr President
1/.Boundaries
I am writing today with a somewhat unusual request. First and foremost, I will be asking that you return America to its August 20th, 1959 borders so that Hawaii is no longer a state and you are no longer a citizen.
2/.ISRAEL, THE JEWISH STATE, AFTER RECEIVING STATEHODD from the United Nations, the ARAB world united with the idea of wiping the ISRAEL NATION from the face of the earth. They have long since failed but continue to try. The Middle EASTERN ARABS, HAVE ACCOMPLISHED VIRTUALLY NOTHING OF VALUE in either the 20th and thus far in the 21st Century. ISRAEL AND PALESTINE at the end of W.W.2, was nothing much more than a Sandy scrub area. Since then the ISRAELIS have turned it into a productive country in terms of agriculture, environment and industry. Their Engineering capablilites have provided clean potable water to their surrounding arab nations as well of course to the themselves. WHAT HAVE THE ARABS ACOMPLISHED...NOTHING BUT TROUBLE IN THE FORM OF TERRORISM. As and ardent MUSLIM SUPPORTER what have you accomplished. Other than an ernormous U.S. INDEBTEDNESS, WHILE FLITTING AROUND THE GLOBE ON THE TAXPAYERS MONEY??? Nothing of VALUE.

 

MYAFZAM

9:40 PM ET

May 25, 2011

?!@#$%^&

America = Jews? that's right. Anyone know about Illumination and their propaganda.

afzam
Hemorrhoid Treatment

 

AN OUTSIDER

3:36 AM ET

May 26, 2011

So, uh, we all just going to sit on our couches and blog?

I am so sick of AIPAC, so disgusted by the 25 standing ovations and by that poor protester who got curb-stomped by AIPAC thugs to the cheers of Congress: I don't think that writing a letter to these traitors is going to cut it.

I know of that www.stopaipac.org, but they don't seem to be trying to mobilize large numbers of people, for all that they seem to have been doing some cool things, especially lately. Anyone else free this Saturday? I'm in NYC and I could spare some time pretty easily.

It's as simple as this: a sycophantic and dysfunctional Congress like the one that barks and hops at AIPAC's command is simply 100% clear proof of a need for a wholesale cleanup of that crew. It's not just the Israeli issues - what about the lack of reform in banking and the wide-scale abuses of markets that we basically allow to exist? What about the fact that 99.9% of the news outlets don't cover this properly?

Note the greater truth here: all these creeps figure that we'll just keep taking it sitting down, that, as usual, no matter how crazy the news, things will go on just like before, that they (just like Israel) will be successful in prevaricating until the news bits become stale, with no significant change ever happening.

(I'm at www.betterinfos.com)

P.S.: I'm impressed by the coverage at FP, and while I comment on that, I'll note how revolted I am at the WSJ and how tired I am with the NYTimes' refusal and delays in accepting so many of my reasonable comments.

 

AN OUTSIDER

4:11 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Traitors GO HOME to your little Israel, leave us alone

All the pro-Israeli trolls that pollute the countless boards don't even get how they are hurting their cause, just like Bibi's visit was a PR disaster that did more to hurt AIPAC than anything Obama or the Palestinians could have done.

Most people can easily tell the difference between a Troll and a reasonable / honest poster. All the pro-Israeli arguments are obvious bunk, so you just look like fools repeating them where they can be countered: keep reminding everyone out there that there is also the biased Israeli perspective to take into account, so they can better recognize it when they hear it on TV or from their 'elected' officials!

Case in point, your absurd statement that "AIPAC is allowed to exist because the vast majority of Americans support Israel". First of all, something that the lemmings of America believe as a result of massive coordinated efforts by 99% of media to present pro-Israeli viewpoints in America is obviously what is is. Special interests as a whole have destroyed our democracy, but all the shits who got their entitlements thanks to them obviously will fight as hard as they can to keep 'em - makes me want to puke. I actually work for my money, I don't beg or manipulate.

Secondly, treasonous Israeli that you are, you obviously ignore the greater issue: this is a special interest that represents a FOREIGN COUNTRY!!! How sick is that? By definition, they don't care one bit about the US's concerns, unless those happen to overlap.

Tell me, what overlap is there in today's post-Cold War world? You guys are nothing but a liability to us, you are the reason we got bombed on 9/11 and you are the reason we caused the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people in Iraq and Afghanistan, with significant loss of life from our beleaguered troops and a gynormous deficit to show for it.

Keep on polluting the web with your BS and lies: EVERYONE can tell you are being duplicitous in your comments, that you are just trying to argue for things that benefit yourself to the detriment of the rest of the world.

You make me SICK.

And no, I'm not going to stay on my couch. I may be in the minority, but I am clearly not ignorant, and your days are numbered. YOU LIVE A LIE.

 

BILL2235

12:10 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Let's be real

American Jews could give a rat's ass about Israel.
I grew up on Long Island in a Jewish neighborhood and no one gave a crap about Israel. They were cultural Jews only.
Hell, 80% of American Jews voted for Obummer knowing fully he would never stand up for Israel and would be pro-Muslim.
Again there is no "homeland" and no real religion.
Funny, I identify my heritage as German and Lithuanian and Jews say they are "Jews" but then don't support Israel.
Christians support Israel to a far greater extent. Sad but true
In fact I think the American Jews are more sympathetic to the Palestinians!
It's a culture folks and that's it

 

YUDL11

1:45 PM ET

May 26, 2011

real

I can't comment on your experiences with Long Island Jews. However, you may want to check the info from the Luntz/CAMERA survey on camera.org from 5/24 and 5/26, 2011.

 

GREGORY M

12:14 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Why Do We Keep Supporting Israel?

I just don't get why we (the United States) seems to keep supporting Israel regardless of political views or what's going on - it just does not make any sense to me at all. It's like they have some kind of huge secret against us that they will expose if we don't keep supporting them regardless of their actions and views. Can anyone explain this to me?

I mean the United States is known worldwide brands as a country that basically goes by their own set of rules and basically does what they want, hence us being disliked by a good portion of the world. So why does Israel seem to get our support regardless of the circumstances? It just doesn't make sense to me.

Sure some of the other alliances I can actually understand, whether it be for political alikenesses or for trade reasons or whether it be they are a wealthyaffiliate or an affiliate for non money related issues - there is usually some sort of reason for the affiliation or support.

But in Israels they just get our unlimited support no matter what. So why? I don't get it - can someone please explain this to me?

 

BILL2235

12:19 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Hello?

They are the only democracy in the Middle East and the only non-Muslim country.

 

MARKRAB

3:56 PM ET

May 26, 2011

PTR - More Iranian propaganda and Lies

"Israel is democracy for the Jews, as much as Apartheid South Africa was democracy for the whites"

Absolute nonsense. Couldn't be farther from the truth. You insult the brave South African freedom fighters with your comparison. First of all in Israeli Jews are the majority...not minority as Whites were in S. African. Second of all Arabs in Israel enjoy all the freedoms of a democracy...and more. They have the right to elect their leaders...the current Knesset (Parliment) has 14 members!

Arabs in Israel have the freedom to not do Military service (an go to college after high school)...something Jewish Israelis can only dream of. Arabs in Israel enjoy all the social benefits without the burden of service.

They're politicians enjoy immunity Jewish politicians don't. Many Arab representative in the Knesset have provided moral support to Israel's enemies and yet they still continue to enjoy diplomatic status. Not many countries would put up with their elected leaders traveling to enemy states like Syria but Israel does...all in the name of democracy.

South African blacks had none of these privileges, were arrested for their beliefs alone...didn’t have the right to vote/representation or protest. Its leaders couldn’t leave the country...

"Under the Israeli Land Administration, Non-Jews are barred from owning or leasing properties on 93% of the land of Israel."

This is a classic 1/2 truth. 93% of all Israelis (no just jews) are barred from owning or leasing on land allotted for public use.

"On March 22, 2011, the Israeli Knesset passed a segregation bill which prevents Palestinian Israelis from living in Jewish localities"

This is not a segregation bill. Palestinian Land is Palestinian...Jews cant live in areas under PA control the same way foreigners can't move into Israeli localities. Israel is the only Jewish state...there are over 30 Arab states and in most of these countries restrictions are placed on Jewish ownership of land. This started when more than 1 million Jews were thrown out of Arab countries during the 1950s. The "JEWISH NAKBA"!

"Arabs can’t bring their non-Israeli spouses to Israel and they have to leave Israel if they chose to join their spouses".

The same goes for Jewish Israelis...this is not an act of discrimination but intended to keep a jewish majority...like i wrote before...Israel is a Jewish state...there are over 30 Arab states and over 50 Muslim ones that have laws to insure a Muslim majority.

In many muslim countries you can not build churches, temples and other houses of worship.

Israel is different...Churches, Mosques, Temples and many other smaller religions find salvation from persecution in Israel. For example - The Baha’i were persecuted in iran and found refugee in Israel. Their temple was built after Israel's founding and adorns Haifa...It is of great pride to Israelis of all denominations.

 

DSANZ

12:51 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Why the US Supports Israel

What makes countries allies? Start with common values, common enemies, and financial/trade ties. Israel is the only country in the MEast that shares values of democracy, freedom, tolerance, etc. Israel and the US share almost the exact enemies (every nutcase that hates the US also hates Israel and viceversa, from the Mullahs that run Iran all the way down to the dumb kids on college campuses right here in the US). And Israel is the US' largest trading partner in the US if we take out oil. And finally, Israel is the only state that enjoys the broad support of its people, so we can count on it being there tomorrow, which is not the case with every other gov in the region.

Let me ask you this, if you had to pick another country in the MEast to take the place of Israel as the US's #1 ally, which would it be?

 

YUDL11

1:01 PM ET

May 26, 2011

funny

Funny isn't it? the only non-autocratic pro-US country between Morocco and Pakistan, and that's the one posters dump on. I wonder why?

 

CHARLIEM

1:08 PM ET

May 26, 2011

You're kidding, right?

The fact that Mr. Cohen actually believes that weakening our support for Israel will not have disastrous consequences shows his blinding leftist bias and little understanding of how things work in the real world. First, Israel is the only functioning democracy in the Middle East, which we MUST wholeheartedly support. Second, a guy as smart as Mr. Cohen must certainly understand that any sign that the U.S. is not 100% behind Israel will simply encourage Hamas, the Muslim Brotherhood and Iran to further their military and terrorist attacks on Israel. Third, every time a Middle East a "peace agreement" is entered in to between the Israelis and the Palestinians, Israel makes concessions and abides by the agreement while Palestinians basically ignore the whole thing and continue their assault on Israel. To all of you anti-Israel progressives - wishful thinking and the crafting of fictional narratives like this show a complete lack of judgement.

 

FUBAGLADY

8:15 PM ET

May 26, 2011

 

AN OUTSIDER

4:53 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Who cares about your BS Israeli 'democracy'

All the arguments that suggest that we should support Israel 'because it is a democracy' are the biggest bunk out there.

Am I, as an American, supposed to support people who 'democratically' decide on ethnic cleansing and racist laws? Regardless of whether Israel's foreign and domestic policies are decided 'democratically' or not, these policies are counter to US interests!!!

This 'democracy', which supposedly is our 'greatest friend', won't even play along with our president's reasonable engenders, instead using AIPAC to move Congress (one of our checks and balances against the presidential powers) against him!!!

It's so stupid. Why do we ignore 9/11's root cause? Because Israel is a 'democracy'. Why ignore our deficits, why continue these wars on Israel's behalf, why should we be at war with ALL ISLAM? Because Israel is a 'democracy'. Why ignore their constant and shocking espionage in our country? Because Israel is a 'democracy'.

Oho! But don't forget! It isn't just that Israel is a 'democracy', it is 'the only democracy in the Middle East'.

Uhhhh, so remind me what our foreign policy perspective is for ALL OTHER COUNTRIES, regardless of whether they be democraties or not? The main question is always: what/where is our benefit, as Americans.

We make allies of democracies and despots because we see a benefit to it, not because they are democracies. We generally support democracies over despots because they GENERALLY are more inline with our interests, but that doesn't remove the primary question: WHAT'S IN IT FOR US?

Support for Israel is our #1 problem as a nation and we will be at war with Islam and the world until we stop this. There is simply no benefit for us, but a huge benefit to them, hence these tireless Trolls keep trying.

Let Israel fight it's endless war without us. It's not going to happen unless we protest though - our entire Congress is 100% bought and tethered, and so is most of the rest of the establishment (media, elites, etc.).

 

AN OUTSIDER

5:47 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Curious as to why there is so much support for Israel?

Check out the comments on this page:
http://www.scpr.org/programs/madeleine-brand/2011/05/09/kusher-beinert/
(never mind the audio from the pro-Israeli CUNY teacher trying to Troll his way out of the Kushner pickle, the interesting part is in the comments).

Beyond the fact that pro-Israeli interests control 99% of politicians and media, guaranteeing positive 'everything' for Israel, regardless of truth or reason, consider how a school like CUNY has a board and leadership that is so grossly pro-Israeli that they not only would publicly describe Palestinians as inhuman but also strongly stand by this racism IN AMERICA. Don't we have laws to protect people against racism, or are Palestinians immigrants also sub-citizens here?

Clearly, the only reason the pro-Israeli pukes can say that a majority of Americans are pro-Israel is because it is a manufactured opinion. It means absolutely nothing when you can't come up with arguments to explain where the benefit is for Americans, when you can't counter any of the valid points detractors raise.

So, remind me again, dear Israeli Trolls, why we should ignore our obvious problems? Ohhh, that's right, it's because in 'democratic' America, the polls still show support for Israel, even though clearly it is against our interests and makes absolutely no sense.

Well, here's the deal, you pukes: you live a lie and you have been successful in maintaining it for decades, but all trends are against you, especially the internet. Your control of newspapers and TV news only gets more irrelevant, each day that goes by.

I don't think the Internet controls being mused by the G8 are going to save you, either.

 

AND REW

5:53 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Very Well Said!

What a national tragedy. Yet it is more tragic because very few people even seen it as humiliating to the President and the country.

The GOP has no respect left. Lincoln, Roosevelt, and Eisenhower are now thinking about switching parties...

 

AN OUTSIDER

7:51 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Sadly, it isn't just the GOP

All of Congress was behind this 100%, not just Republicans, even if they were the ones to make the formal invitation and are trying to milk the most they can from any fraying of Jewish support for Obama and Democrats.

In no way is this only Republican or Democrat, which is what makes it so scary and shocking. Do you think that you will ever be able to vote for someone who isn't entirely controlled by special interests? I certainly don't see how this will be possible anytime soon.

Every single one of our congresscreeps and senators who was present and humiliated themselves, their office, and our country by proudly exhibiting their subservience to AIPAC is either:
- not smart enough to understand when they are being played by foreign interests
- a traitor to the USA

So, although I agree with your general sentiment, I really don't think you go nearly far enough: neither the GOP and the Dems have any respect left, since both are clearly treasonous and damaging to their country, focusing as they always do on making sure they can get re-elected and keep their gravy-train going.

 

AN OUTSIDER

6:10 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Nothing will change unless we protest

I was thinking some more about that Kushner-CUNY affair, which is now three weeks old and basically dead, with the final result being that NOTHING has changed, with peoples' attention now being on fresher news.

It is simply so shocking to me that a publicly appointed official at a publicly funded university (I am a New Yorker and pay lots in taxes) can be openly racist and incompetent, and yet get away with it.

Our universities teach a risible pro-Israel curriculum, one where Palestinians are inhuman. Our congress barks and claps like trained monkeys at AIPAC's commands. Our newspapers do everything in their power to maintain the status quo.

Nothing will change unless we have our own American Spring. We need to protest this, because clearly things will not change unless we force change.

 

FUBAGLADY

8:11 PM ET

May 26, 2011

This article is a bad joke.

Oh yeah...we need to be "measured" so that we don't peeve-off the Muslim Brotherhood who will no doubt be running the show in Cairo and elsewhere thanks to our meddling. Right! And we should throw our ALLY, the ONLY democracy and civilized nation ISRAEL under the bus to appease those animals and a bunch of self-hating Jews who want to feel morally superior because they are embarrassed by their Jewishness. Please.

And what about this irresponsible and incompetent Clown-in-Chief siding with a foreign nation (Mexico) against it's own citizens in Arizona?? A DISGRACE!

This article is a bad joke. I'm not laughing.

 

AN OUTSIDER

8:29 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Ever try thinking coherently? It might help you

How weak are your mental powers if this is the best you can do?

We aren't dropping the bad habit that is support for Israel "to appease those animals" or because of the significant number of American Jews who feel 'conflicted' about Israel (2% of the US electorate is Jewish, remember? In a real democracy, that's not a significant factor), we are dropping you because you leave us no other choice, you rabid war mongers.

Name a single benefit that the US gets from its support for Israel, and then please balance it in the face of the enormous cost to ourselves: 9/11, wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, huge deficits, thousands of troops dead or grievously wounded.

Israelis are so self-centered that they don't even understand how their arguments are meaningless to a non-Israeli. Unfortunately, it doesn't stop them from posting their drivel and wasting our time.

 

AN OUTSIDER

9:56 PM ET

May 26, 2011

P.S. on Mexico

The differences between your vague Mexico-Arizona example and what just happened in AIPAC-owned Congress are enormous and telling.

Consider how, unlike Congress/AIPAC/yourself/pro-Israelis, Obama and many others can offer a coherent explanation for their objections to the measures being enacted by these Arizona statesmen.

Consider as well how it is actually the president's mandate to take both foreign and domestic policy into account, how Mexico is not only a vastly important neighbor with whom we share vast economic, strategic (common border, hello?) and even societal ties with. Should our president really ignore any and all concerns from Mexico? (Nor is Obama currently being anything but hugely pro-Israeli - it's just that it's still not enough for you)

Are you suggesting that the POTUS (and the US generally) should blindly follow the leads of each independent state that happens to be on or near the border with Mexico? Really??

Do you have even the slightest bit of evidence or indication that Obama was acting at that time because of a special interest group? Even more, can you please name an AIPAC equivalent for Mexico or any other foreign government?

Come to think of it, I vaguely remember the Kuwaitis and Saudis 'donating' quite a bit to our politicians in order to help make sure we went to war for them for Iraq 1. Are you suggesting this is a good thing, kinda like AIPAC is?

In any case, thank you for highlighting for us a basic example of how our foreign policy should be occurring, lest all of you out there forget there can only be a single POTUS at a time, or that you actually need an argument, not just bribes to the right officials at the right times.

 

AN OUTSIDER

6:21 PM ET

May 27, 2011

Are you a troll or just that stupid?

JGARBUZ, I've ignored most of your rambling posts because they were actually so weak that nobody out there would pay them any mind, but since you reply to me directly I'm fine with addressing your pseudo-arguments too.

So, case in point, just above: where are your arguments? "As for the benefits of siding with Israel, just ask any CEO of any major hi tech company, and he or she will tell you." Hello? We are waiting for an argument, not your personal guarantee that CEO's throughout the US can offer us one, at some point - an all-Arab-killing silver bullet no less, I am sure. Quite frankly, how many CEO's do you know? And regardless, no matter who they are or how impressive their office or function, it still boils down to the actual argument itself and whether is is valid. Many of those self-serving CEO's disgust me, so I certainly don't adulate them, unlike you seem to.

You then have the temerity to suggest that our troops, who are losing life and limb fighting Israel's wars, should feel thankful to Israel that at least it 'gave' them better body armor? You know what the practical result of that is? The soldiers saved by this armor generally end up as vegetables or with some major handicap. These are people who are 20 years old, with the vast majority of their lives ahead of them! Yeah. I am sure they'll be thanking Israel for its great body armor and wars for the rest of their miserable lives.

And your gross, racist categorization "list the Arab contributions: oil and terror." does you no credit. Keep trying to demonize them, ignoring the cause of that terror. Are you really that racist that you hate all Arabs? Seriously? If so, you should probably move to Israel, since they seem to be in full agreement. I suggest that because in the US racism is illegal and unacceptable. It's in our constitution.

And by the way, I'm curious. Do you consider all the Irish as inhuman as well? They were terror bombing London and the UK for decades. The Basques did the same in Spain, for that matter. Damn! Well, we better gear up for some more wars and hatred in Europe, I guess. Let's go Armageddon!

And speaking of which: why did the Irish terrorism stop? What did the UK need to do to make that happen? There may be a lesson for you in all that, if you only bothered to look outside your Bible. Wait a second, what am I saying? The answer is actually in your Bible: learn to turn the other cheek, learn to forgive and forget, learn to share, and maybe we will have a chance at peace!

The only tangible argument your post offered was the body armor for the troops, and regardless everything you describe is stuff that we get from each and every trading partner we have on the planet. The major difference: our other trading partners don't require that we make war on Islam for ever, on their behalf.

So, in closing, your posts are just like all the other pro-Israeli BS that's been tried here: nothing but half-truths and agenda-serving rationalizations, nothing that a third-party could possibly identify with or not recognize for what it is: invalid and weak. You don't advance your cause, you just waste peoples' time. Maybe that's your goal? Diluting the concentration of interesting posts is one avenue followed by trolls, certainly, especially when they get desperate.

 

PATRICKLAFORREST

8:32 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Peace in the Promised Land

Peace talks start, stop, fall apart, start again, and fall apart...perhaps the truth is that lasting Peace in Israel and Palestine is not possible. Both people want the same land and are unwaivering in their positions. Israel is surrounded by enemies who are quite fervent in their desire to see its destruction and Israel engages in a quasi-Apartheid division of the people. The Israelies will never grant equal rights to Palestians in Israel for to do so would be an act of suicide for the numerically superior Palestinian numbers would ensure the eventual destruction of the political state of Israel. Therefore, Israel will maintain the status quo, which in all likelihood will lead to another war. The existence of nuclear weapons will not save the State of Israel as they can not be used in the restricted confines of the theatre of operations. Instead, Israel will use chemical and biological weapons which will unleash World animosity. The writing is on the wall and is clear to see. War will happen and people will die in the hundreds of thousands. There will be indescriminate killing of citizens by all parties engaged in the dispute. The land will be laid waist and will require a thousand years to heal. This is not a fear but rather the reality that is in the wings if peace is not given a true chance. The only true chance for peace is people have to give. Taking is never a solution. Both sides to this dispute will have to give- land is the crucial issue, so land will have to be given by both sides...The desire and thirst for land is usually the root of war...

 

WSBOWLES

9:48 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Anti-semetic

The anti-semetic vile in these comments is appalling. If my neighbors were dedicated to my destruction, how do you think I would treat them? Palestinian leaders have been offered their own land numerous times, but they must keep the fight going to get their money from Iran and Iran-sponsored Hamas and Hezbollah.

Cohen compares apples and oranges: Democrats politically seeking to undermine a president (Bush) over a policy (invasion of Iraq) THEY voted for, with a president (Obama) who seeks to undermine one of the country's chief allies in the Middle East. Israel IS

To say that Netanyahu's appearance undermines Obama's ridiculous overtures to Muslims is a joke. If Obama had a remote clue about Islam he would know the Koran teaches that the true Muslim should never trust or give credence to anything said by an infidel.

 

AN OUTSIDER

10:50 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Nice!

Great! Thanks for bringing up the next big deception that pro-Israeli defenders always rally back to: reasonable debate about Israel is antisemitism.

Get over yourselves! Seriously, can't you see, at all, how self-centered and sheltered your thinking is?

You are so self-centered that you would assume that the USA owes you billions in financial and military aid a year, as well as the full exercise of its hard and soft powers abroad and in the UN, all on your exclusive behalf, no matter the repercussions and massive costs to ourselves. Really? You think that is an argument that will convince an American citizen?

Anybody who questions this absurd situation or offers reasonable arguments is an anti-Semite (unless they are Jewish, in which case they are 'self-hating' traitors).

You are so used to entitlement that your PM would tell our president that he 'expects' particular results from him. You guys are the beggars to whom we stupidly keep giving billions a year, and you dare EXPECT things from our president? Clearly, given your PM's lordship over Congress, it seems reasonable that he should be able to EXPECT a whole lot from our government and troops. I'm not so sure it was smart to display it on national TV like that, but I hope you keep doing it, as it was better than their usual show.

It's as if we living as a dysfunctional wealthy family, where Israel is the crack-addicted junkie who still gets their vast allowance no matter what they do and their illegal activities result in violent burglaries and drive-by shootings, all of which the family does its best to cover up and ignore. Just like a junkie needs an intervention from friends and will refuse to face the truth, Israelis are steadfast in holding to their rigid thinking, no matter what. Cutting that allowance is a minimum that we should do, especially concerning how it makes us complicit.

And to this poor Israel that selfishly keeps thinking only of itself and thus is concerned about it's problems? Well, unfortunately we are going to be stuck helping you out to a considerable extent, because we do care, but just about everything in Israeli actions is a huge turn-off to all outsiders, so this gets harder and harder to justify.

The big divide is the following: we don't care about you significantly more than we care about the Palestinians, and there is no possible way for you to argue that we should. Until you can start thinking thoughts that aren't based on a racist ordering of things, it's going to be hard for you to provide effective arguments or thoughts, frankly.

You are not special, or more important than other people on earth.

 

AN OUTSIDER

5:20 PM ET

May 27, 2011

I 100% agree that America is not 'special' either

Without a doubt, nobody on earth is more special than anyone else. Doesn't matter if you are white or black, or if you are Jewish, Christian, Muslim, atheist or whatnot. I didn't explicitly say this in the earlier post because I thought this was a given and widely understood, quite frankly.

And indeed, here is what is so horrifying about the vast majority of the pro-Israeli quips: they boil down to trying to scare Americans of the alien Muslim / Arab. It is xenophobia and racist demagoguery, and as such, is actually not far removed from Hitler and his Mein Campf.

The US will have its most successful foreign policy when it stops trying to game things, when it stops using its influence to unfair advantage over its neighbors. Good business arrangements are those where all parties benefit, not those where you managed to screw your partners - hard to get repeat business otherwise, right? That being said, in the context of Israel, Americans may not get to decide what Israel does, but we clearly should stop giving billions in aid, and you have no argument against that.

Anyhow, JGARBUZ, why bother with the religious arguments? This is the FP site, not your church group. Just like the Israelis, you seem like someone who doesn't hang out with anyone but like-minded people. I say this because you just don't seem to understand that the vast majority of people out there is not going to be swayed by religious claims. In fact, many are majorly turned off by such thinking.

The US is multicultural and thus your arguments must be able to reach all citizens equally, no matter their choice of faith. (Unless you are running for the GOP, I guess, since they seem to have given up on being a national party for the time being)

 

WSBOWLES

9:58 PM ET

May 26, 2011

Anti-semetic

The anti-semetic vile in these comments is appalling. If my neighbors were dedicated to my destruction, how do you think I would treat them? Palestinian leaders have been offered their own land numerous times, but they must keep the fight going to get their money from Iran and Iran-sponsored Hamas and Hezbollah. Palestinian leader's leashes are held by Iran to the absolute detriment of their own people.

Cohen compares apples and oranges: Democrats politically seeking to undermine a president (Bush) over a policy (invasion of Iraq) THEY voted for, with a president (Obama) who actively courts the enemies of one of the US's chief allies in the Middle East. Israel IS an ally and for the president to take the position of its enemies is reprehensible. The US has a cultural and historic link to Israel that should be respected.

To say that Netanyahu's appearance undermines Obama's ridiculous overtures to Muslims is a joke. If Obama had a remote clue about Islam he would know the Koran teaches that the true Muslim should never trust or give credence to anything said by an infidel. They don't respect Obama and view his overtures as a sign of weakness. The radical Muslims fueling the Palestinian fight will forever be enemies of Israel and the US. A fact Obama and the American Left blindly ignore.

 

AR

10:41 PM ET

May 26, 2011

What cultural ties does the

What cultural ties does the US have with either Palestinians or Israelis?
Furthermore, the real Right in the US does not support the one sided, paresitic relationship which the US has with Israel.

 

ROMAN GIL

12:17 AM ET

May 27, 2011

America's Fatal Love Affair With Israel

America’s Fatal Love Affair With Israel Gained Us a Permanent War.

If we had followed George Washington’s advice in his “Farewell Address”, we would not have become involved in the “War on Terror”. I loaded his complete address in my blog and highlighted the parts that are of special interest to Americans that believe in the American limited constitutional republic type of government.

By intervening in the Israel-Muslim conflict, we created the conditions that started the American war with Muslim terrorists. Intervening in other countries always leads to war and enemies. Terrorism is the strategy of the powerless when they fight the powerful. The next step in this permanent war is that terrorists will detonate dirty or conventional nuclear bombs on the NATO countries and America. We have to stop the steps that are leading us to this end and change the strategy to win and end the war before it escalates.

Why are we providing Israel annually with $3.5 billion American taxpayer debt dollars? They are rich and can afford to defend themselves. Israel has nuclear weapons and a strong military; they don’t need our money or participation in this Israeli-Muslim conflict that has been going on even before the founding of Israel in 1948. Why are we paying Egypt annually over $1.5 billion in foreign aid? The American taxpayer is paying foreign aid to many nations, but Communist China has no foreign aid. China buys oil fields, mines and finances the government debts of the American and now European governments. China is obtaining real power and influence by following the policy that George Washington explained in his “Farewell Address” advice to the American people.

The global interventionist policy gained us Israel’s enemies. The terrorist attack on 9/11 is a result of intervening in a conflict that concerns Israelis and Muslims. Osama Bin Laden’s strategy was to draw America into conflict in the Muslim world to bankrupt us like what happened to the former interventionist, expansionist Soviet Union. The Afghanistan war and the many Soviet global interventions bankrupted the Soviet Union and caused its ignoble collapse in 1991. We have been playing Osama’s game since 9/11 and we are losing our wealth and power.

We get most of our oil from Canada and other suppliers that are not in the Middle East. The Communist Chinese announced last year that they now have a controlling interest in Iraqi oil and proudly announced the receipt of the first oil shipments. It is clear that they have a strategy of gaining real power at the expense of the follies of other powers. We are fighting a war against maybe 2,000 Al Qaeda terrorists without a military strategy to win the war. Instead, the military talks about the nonsense of “nation building” and “democracy building” in Iraq and Afghanistan. We just added thousands of new enemies by intervening in Libya. The Libyans that Obama killed have families. Every bomb that falls in the American Muslim war is financed by debt and represents a nail in our coffin. We really know how to win friends and influence people.

An economist estimated that the total cost of the war on terror is $5 trillion. 57% of Americans that are fighting this war are contractors, not military personnel. The war contractors are now a powerful special interest group. They are not likely to voluntarily abandon this lucrative business and join the underpaid and overtaxed American civilian population.

The terrorists have more time and supporters than we have money. To survive we have to stop all interventions and occupations in the world. We must defend our borders and attack only targeted actual terrorists. This total divorce from the world's problems will eventually cause the terrorists to focus on their own internal affairs because they will see that America is out of their area and that it's in their best interest to end terrorism against America to keep us out. This is the only way to end this permanent war before we enter the terminal stage of our economic and social cancer.

The $1.65 Trillion dollars out of a budget of $3.7 Trillion, that the Federal government has to beg and borrow this year and every year, should not be spent on war contractor profits and foreign affairs. Confront reality; The USA is the largest debtor in world history. The annual national current account balance losses are over $700 billion (this is wealth that is lost according to the formula national assets-liabilities). Industry is only 9% of the economy. According to the official government statistics, 36% of males 16 to 64 years old are permanently out of the labor force and don't count. The Federal, State and local governments must reduce their size by 37% to fit actual taxes. There are not enough taxpayers to support this huge government of over 20 million people and an equal number of people that are employed by dependent government contractors. Taxes are too high already. Most taxpayers are struggling with increasing local property tax increases and the rising cost of living.

We need to re-industrialize to become financially and politically independent from the global corporations and special interests. America has to nation build to restore its prosperity. 47% of American households are too poor to be legally obligated to pay income taxes. American owned companies cannot compete with imported global corporate products made with cheap labor. We cannot survive competing with Chinese that earn $200 a month.

Focus on our own problems, end globalization, mass immigration and re-industrialize with free enterprise competitive American owned companies before we become another failed state. Stop voting for the two political parties that ruined America. Choose independent politicians and change them when they sell out to the special interest groups. Constitutional government must represent national interests that include corporations, the rich, the middle class and the poor.

Roman Gil
http://roman-gil1.blogspot.com

 

SAJEPRESS

8:28 AM ET

May 27, 2011

Infatuation

Undoubtedly Netanyahu spoke to a 'soldout' audience. See http://bit.ly/SoldOutCongress

 

MARKRAB

12:25 PM ET

May 27, 2011

Professional Bloggers!!

I find it interesting that most of the vile Anti-Israeli and anti-Semitic posts come from 2 or 3 individuals like PTR, Roman Gil and Anousider...always.

Do they just sit at their computers waiting for any Israel related article so they can spread their hate filled propaganda?

 

AN OUTSIDER

4:15 PM ET

May 27, 2011

At least we aren't paid or motivated by foreign interests

You call rational dialog and solid points propaganda?

Just because all your arguments inevitably get revealed as half-truths and misleading lies, you resort to calling the coherent arguments raised against you as 'propaganda'?

According to Wikipedia: "Propaganda is a form of communication that is aimed at influencing the attitude of a community toward some cause or position so as to benefit oneself."

Are my arguments self-serving or US-serving? I am a regular American citizen objecting to this revolting BS, as is not only my right, but even my duty as a citizen, and you DARE call me a propagandist?

It is clearly the Israelis who are the propagandists here, and indeed, whether you MARKRAB's and the rest are paid by your government or do it for kicks, you are the trolls who are spreading propaganda IN THE US for the benefit of yourselves IN ISRAEL, a clear case of manipulative propaganda, if I ever saw one.

You treasonous pukes make me sick and you can be damn well sure that I am here to reveal your lies and half-truths for what they are.

Come on! Give me some more why don't you? I will keep destroying all your BS, until finally you start giving us some truth.

 

AN OUTSIDER

7:00 PM ET

May 27, 2011

Professional? No, but why do you feel like an amateur?

I love your post, MARKRAB, so I can't quite leave it alone. It is just so much fun, because it seems like a genuine cry from a poor manipulative a$$hole who suddenly discovers that all his BS doesn't work when faced with people who are honest and truthful, and hence have a major leg-up when it comes to building convincing arguments. From your perspective, does this makes it seem like we are professional to your rank amateurism?

Well, no, I am not at all a professional blogger, I don't bother trying to get paid for my opinion, in part because my opinion is not for hire, because I am won't hire myself out to promote an agenda.

In your world of causes and counter-causes, where people (and you, certainly) only ever communicate to manipulate, everyone has an agenda, and some indeed pursue that agenda professionally, making money from the injustice. Indeed, perhaps I revisit this because you insult me with your false insinuations.

I don't even need to make 'blogging' or political writing a profession or major focus to stomp you like the cockroaches that you are (flatten one and 10 more come out). When confronted with liars and bullshitters, winning an argument is a given, unless you suck.

 

SPECIAL K

1:37 PM ET

May 27, 2011

Differences between Israel and its regional adversaries

A view on the subject that seems conceptually valid to all who have eyes and would see..

Without dwelling long on this or that “ism”
When viewed through a historical prism,
It seems fair to relate
That the Israeli State
Is an Oasis of Freedom in a Desert of Despotism.
Is an Oasis of Light in a Desert of Darkness
Is an Oasis of Democracy in a Desert of Tyranny.
Is an Oasis of Mental Health in a Desert of Psychoses.
Is an Oasis of Success in a Desert of Failure.

Is an Island of Hope in a Sea of Despair.
Is an Island of Modernity in a Medieval Sea.
Is an Island of Enlightenment in a Sea of Ignorance.
Is an Island of Reason in a Sea of Irrationality.
Is an Island of Prosperity in a Sea of Envy.

Is a civilized outpost in a savage region that
could use a return of the French Foreign Legion.

It is, indeed, difficult anything positive to relate
About any Arab-League member-state--
With citizens short-sighted
And “leaders” largely benighted;
From such a combination, TROUBLE is all we can anticipate.

Hyperbole. of course; but nonetheless useful in highlighting very real underlying differences between the State of Israel and those States and indigenous populations blindly opposing its existence.

And the cause of peace and progress in the region would be served most positively if the latter would abandon dysfunctional obsessive behaviors (with no more than some token show of resistance).

 

AN OUTSIDER

2:43 AM ET

May 28, 2011

Wow, pretty lies

You are just repeating the previously failed arguments, but wrapping them in allegory and chant. Or as you said yourself, "Hyperbole, of course".

To quote Wikipedia: "Hyperboles are exaggerations to create emphasis or effect". What do you think happens when you take something false and exaggerate it? Does it become more false? In this particular case, I think we had already nearly reached infinity, so the resulting falsehood is approximately equal.

You get an E for effort. Go back to school.

 

FOODFISH

7:43 PM ET

May 27, 2011

Another self-loathing Jewish

Another self-loathing Jewish journalist. *barf*

Shouldn't you be denying the Holocaust somewhere?

Sad, pathetic, disgusting.

 

YOMAMA

7:54 PM ET

May 27, 2011

Michael Cohen

You are a self hating Jew. FAIL. If you want to support the so called palestinians, I suggest you relocate to Gaza where you may find some people who agree with your blather.

Why in the h*ll shoud American give a rat about what the arabs think. If we had a president who wasn't a wuss, the arabs would worry about we think of them.

And finally, Netanyahu has a brain. You do not.

 

AN OUTSIDER

9:41 PM ET

May 27, 2011

Pro-tip:

OK, so here's another piece of advice for the pro-Israeli posters who keep thinking they are helping their cause: you need to consider the reaction that your audience is likely to have, you need to realize that other people don't have the same values or reference points as you. Much of what you assume to be universal truth is actually highly variable, country to country, person to person.

Consider the following: subject A is a Likud-like and doesn't need to read your post, since they are already super pissed and ready to kill all Arabs worldwide, plus all the rest. No problems here.

OK, now consider everyone else. Consider how they don't feel the same way as you, how most of them don't have a single reason to particularly care about Israelis over Arabs or Muslims, certainly not enough to warrant 9/11 and unending war on a growing number of fronts.

Do you think that your castigating speech reaches out to anyone except Likud? America is 2% Jewish, so what do you think is the likelihood that a reader visiting this page would care about how you damn the author for being 'a self hating Jew'? To most, that label is a badge of honor, considering what you mean by it. I don't think that these others understand that statement in remotely the same way you do and I don't think they care like you do. For them, your adjacent 'FAIL' attempt is self-referential.

It also seems like you and the previous poster are trying to use a tone of voice that you think would work if you were to use it in person, as if people would feel intimidated at your sense of displeasure with things, even though you clearly lack reasons that don't tie to your self-interest and sense of entitlement.

This might work very well in Congress, but not on a web forum, and not for the anons reading.

 

YOMAMA

8:59 PM ET

May 27, 2011

By the way Mr. Cohen

Your Mom must be so proud of you. "my son, the stupid, Liberal anti-Semite."

 

AN OUTSIDER

10:03 PM ET

May 27, 2011

Yo Moma So Israeli!

I thought we had hit just about all points by now, but there's always more.

Thank you for bringing to our attention the other major fallback: use your group-think powers to make sure the whole community gangs up on and really makes life miserable for all the ethical (and smart, for that matter) Jews who object to this tragedy.

I didn't realize Mr. Cohen was Jewish, or rather, it doesn't matter to me whether he is or not, as it is his thoughts and arguments that matter. I'm not racist, so why should I care? Regardless, he has my sympathy and admiration for being amongst those who courageously stand against Wrong, no matter the number of detractors, no matter the vicious and coordinated attacks from self-interested parties.

I hope you won't blame him too strongly though, since a deeper thinker immediately sees that he actually has Israel's deeper interests at heart: Likud is an abomination that will isolate you, if not destroy you, and the sooner you purge yourself of its thoughts, the better off you will be (let alone the rest of the world).

 

JOHNCTHOMAS

7:57 AM ET

May 28, 2011

INCOMPLETE POINT

RE: "Never mind that Obama simply reiterated long-standing U.S. policy toward the Arab-Israeli peace process" - to be accurate, thsi SHOULD have read
"Never mind that Obama simply reiterated long-standing U.S. policy toward the Arab-Israeli peace process that was rebuked by a public declaration and letter to Israel by our previous administration declaring the US would never again ask Israel to "go back" to their pre-1967 borders"

 

AN OUTSIDER

8:49 AM ET

May 28, 2011

What's your point?

I would almost call your post's title self-describing, as you don't explain how your suggested changes affect anything in Mr. Cohen's conclusions, but the 'fix' you offer for the previously valid point is nonsensical.

Reading past possible typos, it seems like you are trying to infer that you were made a promise by a particular paid official (Bush), and that now that a different government has been paid and elected, it seems wrong that things should get updated - you know, 'democracy'-style.

After all, from an Israeli perspective, you never give, you only take, so anything else is very jarring. I feel for you, really.

 

AN OUTSIDER

8:50 AM ET

May 28, 2011

What's your point?

I would almost call your post's title self-describing, as you don't explain how your suggested changes affect anything in Mr. Cohen's conclusions, but the 'fix' you offer for the previously valid point is nonsensical.

Reading past possible typos, it seems like you are trying to infer that you were made a promise by a particular paid official (Bush), and that now that a different government has been paid and elected, it seems wrong that things should get updated - you know, 'democracy'-style.

After all, from an Israeli perspective, you never give, you only take, so anything else is very jarring. I feel for you, really.

 

AN OUTSIDER

1:23 AM ET

May 29, 2011

Commentary and Video Interlude

Rather than class warfare or other antiquated concepts, I think that what is appearing before us is the following dipole: are you a leech or not?

Israel is a leech on the US, clear and simple. They cry foul at this characterization, not because it is untrue, but because it is unfair: what about all the other special interest groups taking advantage of the US?

I agree and this is part of why I am convinced that we need to have Egyptian-style protests in the US until some fairly massive changes occur. And I'm not talking about anything divisive like revisiting abortion or gun control: let's just target the elephants, like saving tens of billions a year thanks to a re-alignment vis-a-vis Israel. Even American Jews widely agree that our support is wrong, and they make up 2% of the electorate. Let's make our government accountable to us, accountable to principles, logic and reason, not to special interests. Never mind thinking your typical newspaper will cover this properly: special interests = advertising, and special interest types own most of these rags, regardless. They offer bias against bias, and protect the status quo.

But I don't think there is anything to be afraid of: these special interest people are all self-serving rats and they are quick to drop each other (eg: AIPAC claims Israel is being 'thrown under the bus' - by other special interests is what I'd say). It is immaterial anyhow: it's either that or they can all stand together and fall together, sooner.

More than anything, everyone can see the writing on the (internet) wall: the times are a changing - in fact, they have already changed dramatically, to such an extent that we see true representation happening in Egypt (those protesters are smart to stay on guard against the remains of their corrupt establishment). My point: Congress and the rest is made up of a bunch of followers. I'm not worried one bit about them, certainly not in the long run.

I certainly don't expect AIPAC will ever be able to convince Congress to repeat their last performance. What an astounding example of wasted political capital, as well as a lesson for all special interest groups as to the new limits to their influence. More importantly: our elected creeps are noticing that they are under ever growing scrutiny, that the old tricks no longer work.

Imagine: now it's not just the newspapers that decide the opinions we read - everyone can actually get opinions like mine, and 'they' can't stop it.

Anyhow, to the lazy American couch potato anon reading this: your lazy-mission this weekend is the following: watch "Daybreakers", the vampire movie with Ethan Hawke, and imagine the following:
- a human being is a person who works for their money, someone who gets paid based on hard work and demonstrable ability
- a blood sucker is someone who gets their money due to entitlement, manipulation, lies and deceit, someone who does not contribute value and hence must 'suck' lifeblood from humans to survive

The movie makes a powerful analogy of modern life and has a number of interesting plot twists and denouements. It's quite fun, and available on netflix.
Come to think of it, I wonder if vampirism in general might not represent an allegory for these leeches' hidden dream: develop the science of immortality and forever after leech life off of others, living the comfortable lie in ageless glamor.

Regardless of movies and movie-thoughts, ask yourself how likely these leeches are to let go on their own. What do you do when you notice a leech on your hand? I get rid of it ASAP, ideally with a bit of salt rather than force (yuck!).

So my question to you is, how many more years, how many decades will this continue? Sorry if this makes life 'tough' for the entitled, but I want it to end NOW, not tomorrow or next month, and certainly not at their leisure. It's not like they can't (or shouldn't) adapt.

My key point: only the greatest idiot sees this AIPAC thing as a Jewish conspiracy: it isn't, as made clear by all the Jews fighting it, and if you think it, let alone say it, you will be serving someone's agenda (as inevitably happens when race is used in politics). Get over your racist thinking, as it harms everyone, yourself included. It is vamp-thinking.

This is protest at all the leeches out there, including in particular the bankers and hedge fund / market pukes. Never mind what Israel is costing us - in financial terms, it's nothing compared to how real estate and markets have been robbed of their value in the past 20 years and more, with no end in sight. Good luck in your retirement, anons.

And more than anything: it's not like protesting is hard work or needs to be 24/7. It's gonna be a party, with hipper people than you ever saw in a Tea Party crowd, that's for sure. In fact, you could do any number of things, like help spread this information, or whatever you think is best, but you need to act.

Either that, or learn to enjoy your subservience and quit your bitching, 'cos talk is cheap and it gets really tiresome as it repeats itself. I'm certainly going to be amongst those who give up on you if you don't buck up a bit.

 

MERCURIAL

5:08 PM ET

May 29, 2011

AIPAC is right

It's always amusing to see one of these articles. Liberal writers generally find the concept of working for U.S. interests distasteful, preferring to think of matters in global or human terms. So you can count on appeals to our national interest as cynical attempts to bash whatever they don't like at the moment.

Longstanding bipartisan support of Israel reflects the knowledge that Israel's fate is tied to ours. If we allow the only country in the Middle East that guarantees full rights to women, homosexuals and minorities to succumb to incessant pressure by its hostile neighbors, we signal our unwillingness defend our own ideals, and our untrustworthyness to other allies in dangerous regions.

Lurking beneath many of the demands for concessions from Israel is of course, Anti-Semitism. The so-called "right of return" is only the most obvious part, a bald attempt to turn the only Jewish nation in the world into the 23rd Muslim one. The evidence goes on and on, from Holocaust denial to the popularity of the fradulent Protocols of the Elders of Zion, a continuous bestseller in Muslim countries. (Right alongside Mein Kampf)

If people are wondering why we are no closer to peace even after several land concessions from Israel, (the Gaza Strip, parts of the West Bank, both sizable losses for the tiny country) its the fact that appeasement is never the answer in the face of naked aggression. Until Palestinian leaders, as well as their numerous backers, completely give up their violent campaign of terror and intimidation, American defense of Israel will never yield.

 

AN OUTSIDER

9:13 PM ET

May 29, 2011

Before repeating, could you try rinsing a little more?

STOP LYING.

How is "Israel's fate is tied to ours"? Do you actually believe in fate? Who is the Oracle who told you this was our fate?

Clearly, your position is just the slightly more affected version of JGARBUZ's: your Bible tells you that this is your fate, and you think your argument will convince readers on FP or in the US nationally? You think that the USA should be basing its entire reason for existence on this fate you try to impose on us? I'm sorry, but my fate is not to be Israel's lackey, strongman and (essentially) slave. Furthermore, I don't think your 'fate' narrative matches anything in our history or spirit.

Slaves get nothing for their hard work, just like America gets nothing from this alignment with Israel. Slaves don't get to talk back, just like Americans can't talk back without being 'anti-Semitic'. My American Dream is not being someone's fool and patsy. Nor is it the ethnic cleansing of Arabs world-wide, which clearly is being encouraged by you vile pro-Israelis. Can't you hear yourselves talk?

And stop trying to confuse issues: Israel's problems are its own, not America's. Your sick ethnic cleansing is coming back to haunt you, and I certainly don't feel like it is my responsibility to encourage you to continue with MORE. Nope, I want LESS, far less.

And don't try to imply that our lack of support for you will make you disappear in a sea of ethnic reverse-cleansing: you have hundreds of nuclear weapons and by far the most powerful army in the region. You guys are safe, but obviously here we see the greater truth: you know that without America you won't be able to steal quite as much land or be quite as ruthless, so you try your best to keep us. You can't continue being so aggressive without our support, and may actually have to be reasonable without us. Oh noes!

 

MERCURIAL

11:01 PM ET

May 29, 2011

Calm down please

I'm guessing English may not be your first language, because not every word has to be taken literally. "Fate" here simply means that which is in store for Israel in the future.

Your bizarre fear and hatred of a tiny country 7000 miles away is puzzling, to say the least. Israel threatens only the vicious terrorists who are fully commited to killing innocent people. Terrorists whose modus operandi include using children as human shields, firing out of the back of ambulances, stockpiling weapons in schools, and blowing up soccer fields.

Apparently Israel is not "reasonable" enough for your taste. It's a shame they're not as reasonable as Hamas, whose leadership is conflicted on the question of whether Jews are human, and are explicitly committed to the complete and total destruction of the Jewish state and have been since their founding.

The only ethnic cleansing going on in the world that involves Muslims is in the Sudan, where they are the perpetrators, raping and murdering defenseless farmers and tribesmen, the death toll being 450,000 people. (The amount of people displaced and made destitute is far, far higher)

 

AN OUTSIDER

12:18 AM ET

May 30, 2011

Please calm down? Really?

Here's why I'm not calm about this: lives are affected, world-wide. It's not just about money/taxes or abstract concepts like power and territory, it's about misery on the ground. It's about 3000+ people dying on 9/11, it's about thousands of troops lost or crippled, it's about the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people in Iraq and Afghanistan, and it's also about the general unfairness for the Palestinians, be they displaced or not. It is about people suffering world-wide, as this virulence exacerbates all the other tensions. I only see more of the same happening unless we correct ourselves and change course. This is some fate you wish for us!

I could go on for many more pages about how wrong Likud/AIPAC is, how similar to the Nazi approach and thoughts, and you tell me I should calm down? Should we have 'calmed down' and helped Hitler finish his job? It's not even that you argue for us to leave you alone with your business: you want our vast, active support to continue? Screw you and your 'calm down'.

Indeed, English is not my mother tongue, but regardless that doesn't mean I don't know how to argue using it. Every single word has a clear meaning, be it literal or not, except when you are bullshitting. I love how you correct yourself: it went from "Israel's fate is tied to ours" to ""Fate" here simply means that which is in store for Israel in the future". REALLY???

You are so freaking hilarious. Talk about some wishful thinking on the pages of Foreign Policy magazine. LOL. You still fail to present arguments to explain WHY you think that future should come about, let alone concerning yourself with what is likely to happen as things continue to develop.

I have no fear of Israel, clearly, otherwise I would have shut up long before now. I don't even hate you guys, not one bit. I pity you, because you are being led by monsters and you are all blindly following, just like what we saw in Germany's not-so-distant past. Keep denying, keep trying to put off that terrible realization: you aren't convincing anyone, 'cos no one else has a reason for denying that truth.

So here's my 'please' to you: get real, and please stop with the anti-Arab/Muslim slurs. They really reflect badly on you. Please stop comparing yourselves to Hamas: I know they suck, just like you. In fact, Hamas is a tool of the Assads, not even a true representation of Palestinian opinion or desires, so leave that one well enough alone already, would ya?

Your ethnic cleansing is going on today in the form of the settlers taking over land all over the occupied territories and in the 1-10+ guaranteed ratio of deaths between Jews and Palestinians, so don't even try that last bit. You talk about terrorism? Innocent Palestinians who do not support Hamas are a significant number of the deaths in each of your murderous reprisals. Here's what I see: Likud and Hamas are both evil. Children are being murdered by both, and both are working against peace.

Just keep repeating your failed attempts so that the readers can be convinced all the more as to the pressing need for change. Come to think of it, should I perhaps be thanking you? What a sucker.

 

MERCURIAL

1:13 AM ET

May 30, 2011

Are you sure you aren't off any medication?

You're right, it is indeed about 9/11, and countless people suffering in the Middle East. However, the fault lies almost entirely on the various Arab governments there. They've been cynically exploiting the Palestinian issue to their benefit for half a century. By keeping refugees in permanent slums and arming and financing the Jihad, they distract attention away from their own despotism and indulge their ancestral hatred of Jews.

Yes *really*. Fate was only a turn of phrase, feel free to look up what that means if you need to.

The cognitive dissonance of accusing the victims of Hitler to be engaging in something similar to Nazism is astounding. (Hitler enjoyed wide popularity with Arab countries at the time) It doesn't take alot of creativity to imagine what would happen to Israel without US support. The previous wars of 1948 and 1967 (Both launched by multiple Arab armies, without provocation) and the enduring Jihad shows that Arab aggression is unending, at least when it comes to the issue of exterminating Jews.

Hamas doesn't truly represent Palestinian opinion? If that were true, then they wouldn't have voted Hamas into the majority of the seats in their parliament. And if Fatah was meaningfully different, they wouldn't have announced a reconciliation agreement with Hamas last month.

The truth is peace can never be made with people that engage in such bloodthirsty and depraved tactics. The degree of difference between Hamas, Hezbollah, Al-Qaeda, the Taliban, and countless other groups is not nearly as wide as people believe. Supporters of Israel can see that these groups all part of the global Jihad, and while Israel may be their first target, it won't be their last. They see that terror networks cannot be negotiated with, only dismantled and defeated.

 

AN OUTSIDER

2:40 AM ET

May 30, 2011

You are very insulting

I leave it up to the readers to decide who is sane here, but I will explain one thing. I am insulting you pukes because you deserve it, because you won't change your reprehensible ways until you are forced to change. You deserve censure, in fact you need it to improve. Insult me if you will, but please give me a reason for it, otherwise you've got another thing coming for you.

Regardless... Keep going with your self-centered perspective: "the fault lies almost entirely on the various Arab governments there". Really? How come others (including 3rd parties) don't see it that way? How can foreign governments be chiefly responsible for the problems happening in your own country? I agree that the despots have been gaming this to their advantage, but how can you try to argue that you are only responsible for a part of the tiny part left after "almost entirely"? It must be nice to be so immaculate. Absurd is more like it.

As for the meaning of fate, as per dictionary.com: "The development of events outside a person's control, regarded as determined by a supernatural power". That sounds like a nightmare to me, frankly. Haven't you read any ancient Greek plays? Have kids with your mother, then kill them and pluck your eyes out! That's where you are trying to go.

I know what fate means literally, figuratively and as "only a turn of phrase". Anytime you pukes try to fall back on that type of speech, try to use that narrative, you deserve to be bitch-slapped. It is clear why you use it, just like it is clear why it should be objected to: America is a modern democracy, not something that should be subject to a supernatural power (especially not a foreign country claiming to be one!). No matter what, the separation of church and state is also in the constitution, yo.

As for any support Hitler found amongst Arabs, it is no different from the support the French gave him (what a disgrace that was/is), or any number of others. In today's world, who are the ones who stand for Israel? Let them be shamed in the same fashion, for the same reason.

I am not here to revisit the past from 1948 or 1967. If anything I have to draw a line because you are trying to hijack this thread: the topic is 2011, not 1967, not 500 B.C. The details of your past still don't explain what benefit or reason the US has for supporting Israel as you suggest, other than the fact that Israel wants us to.

As far as Hamas is concerned, it is a propaganda tool for/from Assad's Syria, with headquarters in Syria ('till a few weeks ago...). Clearly, the tool has been effective since it has managed to win over quite a bit of mind-share / votes / victims. I'd say that success plays in with Likud's greater strategy, but that's just my opinion. In any case, just like Likud is all lies, Hamas is all lies, and the followers of each are fools being manipulated by people who are far more cunning than smart, and hence headed for disaster. Regardless, I don't see why you are bring up Hamas's lies when we are discussing yours. Isn't that a form of trickery?

Your closing argument implies that terrorism is globally united, when in fact the opposite is clearly the case. Part of the motivation for it is Israel, and part of it is other stuff (despotic countries, suffering, unfairness, propaganda, etc.), but you are trying to hijack this thread by bringing all that up: right now, we're just talking about the terrorism we are subjected to because we support you.

That being said, you are especially wrong and deceitful to bring up the other sources of terrorism because the truth is that they aggravate and build off of each other and that clearly the rest should diminish as a result of there being more fairness in the world, as a result of us not giving Israel our blind support.

Once more, you lie and mislead from beginning to end.

 

MERCURIAL

3:26 PM ET

May 30, 2011

~

It's easy to see why 3rd parties wouldn't see it that way; its because they're incorrect. They persist in falling for the age old Arab dissembling known as Taqiyya, which is saying one thing to Western audiences in English, and another to their own people in their own language. Yasser Arafat was a master at this; (He'd been poisoning the peace process for decades beforehand) condemning the 9/11 attacks in public while praising the suicide bombers in private. Liberal persons and organizations who are predisposed to believe in the wickedness of the West and the goodness of indigenous people are only too happy to swallow it all.

Ironically, the seperation of church and state is one of the myriad points of agreement the US has with Israel, something that Sharia following Arab governments do not share. Israel itself is a powerful outpost of democracy in a region of backwardness and ignorance, and for almost a century it has been the policy of the US to promote democracy wherever it can.

People, like the writer of this article, believe that abandoning Israel will win us friends in the Middle East. They're mistaken. Whatever ephemeral goodwill it buys us among the Arab populace will be offset by the realization among terror networks that with enough pressure, dedication, and time, the US will fold. Conversely, our allies such as Japan, Columbia, and Taiwan will conclude that they cannot depend on the US in difficult situations and will ingratiate themselves with nations that are opposed to our interests. Leaving Israel to the wolves will make us more isolated, not less.

The reason I'm bringing up the past is simple. As many people realize, the past has much to say about the future. And repeated past attacks by Arab governments suggest that they will continue into the future.

While the individual motives of Islamic terror groups differ, their overarching philosophy is much the same. A creation of a global Caliphate, while ridiculous and far-fetched to us, is indeed what they are trying to build. Sharia (the religious law of Islam) is frankly incompatible with democracy. Anyone that promotes democracy is at odds with them, whether its Israel, the US, European countries, of even their own moderates. (All victims of Islamic terror, as it happens)

The fact is Israel has never had a true partner for peace. The groups and organizations the Palestinian people have let fight for them have never truly accepted Israel's right to exist. With such enemies at the gate, it's a wonder that Israel is as restrained and accomodating as it has been. I hope you can see how ruinous groups like Hamas and the PLO have been to their own cause. People who might of been sympathetic to Palestinians instead recoil at the actions of their agents and their sympathy level drops to somewhere near zero.

The final reason why the US should support Israel (And the reason I do personally) doesn't have to do with interest. It's the fact that a people that have been victimized throughout human history finally have a home, a home that has belonged to them before there was a Palestine. And predictably they were attacked immediately on their return. Jewish people are still subjected to a bizarre and unremitting hatred that dehumanizes them. It's simply morally right to push back against it.

 

AN OUTSIDER

12:13 AM ET

May 31, 2011

Impressive - absolutely no sense of shame huh, Merc?

Hey piggy, how can you flat-out lie like saying that "Ironically, the seperation of church and state is one of the myriad points of agreement the US has with Israel, something that Sharia following Arab governments do not share.". I don't think you are so dumb that you don't understand how your country is a theocracy itself, a country whose main purpose it is to be Jewish 'till the ends of time. Where is your separation between church and state, where is the similarity with the US and where is the dissimilarity with Muslim theocracies? You think you advance your position with your bald-faced lies?

You bring up the past to mislead, and you embarrass yourself by persevering with your previous points, like trying to argue that Islamic terrorists exist primarily because they seek the "creation of a global Caliphate". You are so deceitful. Injustice is what causes terrorism, and injustice is WRONG regardless of the resulting terrorism's wrongness. Don't dissemble: it is clear which comes first, just like it is clear who needs to change.

Your 'final reason' is simply fabulous: the world 'owes' its support to Likud because Jews have been persecuted throughout history. You know who else has been persecuted? Black people (and countless others). You know who is still being widely persecuted and pogrom'd? Africans (and countless others). You know who is so self-centered that they figure the world turns around them and that only their suffering matters? Likud-Jews, and they make me sick. And it's never your fault or responsibility. You are a tired joke.

Anyhow, before you bother replying with more dissembling based on all the enemies that surround you and on the dire need for us to help you with them, I'll bring up a little lesson learned from George Orwell's "1984": the system depends on external enemies.

Syria and all the other despots of the region cannot survive without an evil Israel: they need a powerful external target for the hatred that their own injustice creates in their subjects, otherwise it turns inwards. Similarly, Israel cannot act as it wishes without its evil enemies: anytime criticism is leveled at Israel for its actions, attention is redirected towards the despots or Hamas: 'look at what THEY do!' cries Israel. Similarly, in the US, the dumb red-necks are made to hate 'Liberals' rather than the credit card companies and others that prey on them, and the population as a whole is made to hate Muslims/Arabs (even though many are citizens - and why shouldn't they be!!!), all so that the douche bags can channel anger towards safe 'external' targets and keep their status quo.

I don't bring this up to convince you, Merc, but to explain something: the internet has broken all controls on opinion and information, and all the despots are falling as a result. Soon you won't have any Assads/Hamas or Gaddafis as neighbors, so what will you do then? You are screwed. You live a lie and forces larger than us all are wrecking your whole game plan - in fact, we are playing on a new board now and your old tricks and cheats all FAIL. Your problem? You are too dumb to notice or to think of anything new. Like a broken record, you keep playing it by your tired ol' playbook.

So, remind me again, how that saying goes? "Those who refuse the error of their ways are fated to..."

 

AN OUTSIDER

12:16 AM ET

May 31, 2011

(oops)

Evidently, the previous was a reply to the Mercurial Troll...

 

AN OUTSIDER

4:19 AM ET

May 31, 2011

Whereas I am fated to making typos and mistakes...

It seems like these Merc-types believe they are fated to trying to manipulate others for their own ends and to thus getting inevitably pwned in open forums. They truly have yanked their proverbial eyes out, all for a chosen fate.

Regardless, while I am on the topic of mistakes, I will try to correct my earlier monster-mistake: in a previous post, I paraphrased a Likud-type saying that 'AIPAC is funded by American Jews' and followed it up by strong statements on how AIPAC and its supporters are treasonous, hence almost/somewhat implying that Jews are treasonous. This was an honest mistake, as clearly it should have been 'by Americans.', but regardless I apologize for the effect it has/had, none of which was intentional on my part. I think I was clear in other posts to explain how and why AIPAC is barely (if at all) Jewish and how this this is not at all a Jewish issue, but regardless I should have corrected this sooner. I regret this mistake in all its aspects and apologize for it. That being said, I do not believe it is indication of underlying anti-Semitism on my part, as to my mind AIPAC membership/funding is probably 51+% Jewish - something that is true but that I still need to be careful about when speaking, because my point, like my thinking, is not about race.

Regardless, while I mention this treason: should Russians be able to have their own PAC in the US? How on earth is it acceptable to us that foreign interests (Israeli, Saudi, etc.) are funneling vast sums of money to our politicians and encrusting themselves into our government? Let's be frank: geopolitics is all about me-me-me, so each and every country needs to be on guard towards its peers. Israel is not special: it's just another country. And yet, these pukes continue to argue that we should continue with 'business as usual': the unchanging business of injustice and war, as usual.

White collar criminals are typically the weakest-minded of all criminals: they live a lie ('I'm not hurting anyone, in the balance'), following their chosen path without ever thinking outside of their preferred thoughts, loving the ego boost from all their 'success', ignoring the precarious nature of their enterprise (all cons get revealed, sooner or later, in no small part because of their inherent harm onto others), hiding from thoughts of where their most likely future lies - it is unthinkable, to them. At least an 'honest' criminal doesn't lie to himself when he punches you in the face and steals your cash - he knows what he's doing and where he's gonna end up unless he reforms.

Frankly, I don't even care that much about them going to jail or whatever, even though they deserve it: before anything else, I'd just like our government to free itself of FOREIGN special interests, if not even the rest. Because the greater problem is that this situation is self-perpetuating, so unless we force our politicians to change, nothing is going to get any better.

Oh, and as another typo correction: in that latest rebuttal to Merc, "You bring up the past to mislead" should have been continued with "because your historical examples are only self-serving", but I could certainly elaborate on any of the things I have said.

Here is the greater problem that a bullshitter like Merc doesn't get: the counterpoint to their lies is a truth with no inconsistencies, not another stream of half-truths co-opted into false conclusions. Anytime he tries to dig deeper into what I say, he discovers more of the valid reasons I have for saying what I say - it's easy since I'm not lying. Conversely, anytime he tries to argue towards his sham, he can obviously at best only use half-truths - things that are true by themselves but do not matter or imply that his sham is truth.

Lamely, he can't even make a challenging game of it, but then again being a manipulator dumbs you down a lot, as it complicates your thoughts tremendously. Just like that "Daybreak" movie indicates though: he could change and become vastly smarter (something I bet he values), if only he would drop his false pretenses and his tendency to finding his way through manipulation, something which is a waste of his thought processes, more so today than ever before.

 

ISRAELDEFENDER

3:53 AM ET

May 31, 2011

Jewish conspiracy theories make me laugh

Obama and the U.S. are so beholden to Arab oil interests that Obama literally couldn't bring himself to even say the words "Saudi Arabia" in his latest speech. I guess the U.S. of A. is OK with women being stoned to death (and publicly lashed) and has forgotten where the 9/11 hijackers came from. Obama also neglected to call for regime change in Syria. Whoops.

Meanwhile, the U.S. won't free Jonathan Pollard; won't move its embassy to Jerusalem; won't help Israel free Gilad Shalit; and won't cut aid to the terror supporting Palestinian authority; but we are supposed to believe that AIPAC/Jews/the Likud/(fill-in-your-favorite Jewish target) control the U.S. Yeah, makes perfect sense.

The writer's bias drips off the page. Calling Netanyahu "recalcitrant"? The Palestinians just officially brought Hamas, a U.S. terror organization, into the government! Netanyahu is STILL saying he is willing to make a deal for a two-state solution, but how do you make a deal with a group that has sworn to wipe you off the map?

It is well known that Arab dictators have used a closed press and Islamic extremism to demonize the Jews of Israel, in order to provide an external target to distract their own subjects from the squalor they live in (since the dictators have stolen most of the wealth). Cohen's morality dictates that the U.S. should sell-out Israel and go along with this demonization to allegedly ingratiate the U.S. with Arab dictators. I guess he would have been one of the people in the 30s saying "who cares what happens to the Jews? Let's just worry about our state's interests."

 

AN OUTSIDER

6:47 AM ET

May 31, 2011

Nice propaganda attempt, Troll

I mentioned the general definition earlier, but here's why 'lying propaganda' applies in your case: nothing that is being discussed here is a 'Jewish conspiracy'. The article's author is Jewish, the protester who got curb-stomped is Jewish, a huge number of your detractors are Jewish (I could almost argue that there is a Jewish conspiracy against AIPAC!). Nothing in the topic is Jewish except for the fact that AIPAC/Likud happens to be somewhat Jewish.

You are just another puke Likud propagandist spewing your lies in America for your agenda in Israel. All thoughtful Americans (Jewish and otherwise) object and are trying to stand in your way, so your playbook calls for the usual: caricaturize things and try to play on peoples' fears, misleading and lying all the way. This is FP, not your typical rag: I don't think the readers are fooled for one second, but it is tiresome nonetheless.

Let me explain to you who you are dealing with in my particular case, before your delusional mind tries to turn me into some sick person like yourself: I am an ethical person, someone who has worked hard to get himself the following freedom: the ability to spend time on what I want, from time to time. What you see right now is me doing my civic duty, for free, as an American citizen: explaining to my fellow citizens why and how we are making a mistake. I don't have a cause or agenda, so stop creating one out of thin air to suit your purposes.

In general, your post is mostly a repeat of the previously debunked arguments, although I do notice a bit of new. It still fails because by mentioning how we won't free Jonathan Pollard and the like, you only show the obvious truth: AIPAC only has that much influence. They do still end up having to 'give in' on some levels and in some ways, or conversely are only able to negotiate for that much from our politicians-for-hire. Only a delusional fool thinks that AIPAC/Likud is all-powerful, or that we are spending more than a fairly small part of our vast resources directly for you - you can only leech so much, after all. Nowadays it seems like the best AIPAC can do is think up absurd standing ovations from Congress, with nothing but embarrassment to show for it. Wow - Bibi is such a master of foreign policy! What a brilliant thinker - it's just so deep, revealing so much of yourselves like that!

More than anything, AIPAC is just one more special interest group. They have a peculiar type of influence, and they are particularly harmful, being a foreign country's Apartheid party's special interest 'n all, but that's about it.

I know you guys desperately want the last word, but I have weeks to spend on this, if I want to, and I do have my stake in this after all, as both an ethical person and as an American tax payer:

Ain't no BS gettin' past this here wrangler. Free speech for all, including buckets full of shame for those who get revealed as liars and cheats.

 

VISITOR

9:49 PM ET

May 31, 2011

Congress' Uncritical Support for Israel

If you have not the nerve or the good sense to tell a friend what he/she does not what to hear but which is true, then you do your friend no favor.

Israel needs to adapt to the changes in the Middle East. The countries that are it's neighbors are changing and the changes may not be for the best so far as Israel is concerned. Until recently it found a way to live with the authoritarian regimes of it's neighbors. Now, as democracy rears it's head, it needs to win the hearts and minds of the people in those countries. It can only do this by settling things with the Palestinians.

 

STRAUSDD

7:16 PM ET

June 1, 2011

Engagement With Who?

What evidence suggests that absent US support for Israel Obama would be able to achieve his foreign policy objectives in the region?

 

ORLOJO89

12:17 AM ET

June 16, 2011

I also think, they have to

I also think, they have to support Israel otherwise it wont work, I dont know about you guys but what do you think. Well I wonder if there is any book that will document all the relationship of USA and Israel.

 

TSTUCKER

8:10 PM ET

June 1, 2011

Israel

Let me see if I have this right. You democrats want to help Hamas and Hezbollah destroy Israel and kill every jew in ti because you hate the thought of democracy in the middle east as much as you do here in the US. Is that about it?

 

JOSSEFPERL

2:28 PM ET

June 12, 2011

Obama is not trusted by Israel

Michael Cohen pretend that their is no context to the Republican invitation for Netanyahu. The fact is that Obama in his attempt to reverse Bush's policies in the middle east bought into the Arab arguments that the Bush poicies were unfairly pro-Israel, as indicated by his speech in Cairo upon taking office (as well as other speechs attemting to elicit support in the Arab world) and his tacit agreement with Abbas position on setting conditions for renewing peace. In his attempt to portray Bush's middle east policy in the most negative way possible, Obama never reminded the Palestinians that during the Bush administration they got Gaza back and the first opportunity to hold election, while Israel got back rockets landing on its southern cities. Therefore, when Obama says that Israel should agree to land for peace based on the pre - 1967 border with some land swaps, Israelis do not trust that the "land swaps" Obama has in mind are reasonable and they are perfectly right in feeling that way.

Since Obama is basing so much of his policies in the middle east on repudiating Bush's policies, the owe him no loyalty when it comes to the middle east. Obama will do better stopping to try to be the "anything but Bush" and have a straight talk with the Palestinians that as long as they insist on the right of return and Jerusalem as their capital, they are not really interested in a state of their own.

 

PERSON_GUYZ

2:04 AM ET

June 23, 2011

And America is stuck on a

And America is stuck on a path of unending conflict with Islam as a direct result of this. Great! But if you are of the Zionist mentality this is a good thing howtoearnmoneyonline. I know you guys desperately want the last word, but I have weeks to spend on this, if I want to, and I do have my stake in this after all, as both an ethical person and as an American tax payer:

 

DROOGE

8:57 AM ET

June 23, 2011

Netanyahu & Congress v Obama

I have never felt so ashamed as watching the sycophantic congress behave like a group of adolescents at a rock concert with the pimpled faced lead singer have his audience react as if it was the second coming.

Doesn't congress realize their childish behavior and their belittling of their President is the equivalent of spitting into the wind it just comes back and hits you in the face.

You are a disgrace to your country and to its freely elected leader