What Lies Beneath

For years, people whispered about the thousands of disappeared young men in Kashmir. But only now are the bones finally speaking.

BY BASHARAT PEER | SEPTEMBER 29, 2011

SRINAGAR, Kashmir — On a pleasant September morning, Mohammad Sidiq, a sand-digger in his early 30s, pushes his long wooden boat out onto the River Jhelum, which cuts through the heart of Srinagar, the biggest city in the disputed, Indian-controlled province of Kashmir. As the sun rises over the blue-gray pines and bleached snows of the Himalayas circling the city, Sidiq paddles out with his partner, using long-handled shovels and corkscrews to draw sand from the riverbed. It's slow, hard work, but a day's labor nets a boat full of sand, which sells for $50. While describing the modest economy of his work, Sidiq speaks of his relationship to the Jhelum, a wide green river that flows quietly through the Kashmir Valley, across the disputed, mountainous border, known as the Line of Control, and into Pakistan-controlled Kashmir. "No man can bear what this river has witnessed," he says, staring across water.

Sidiq has been working on the river for 12 years now. Every week or two, as he hoists a shovel full of sand from the riverbed, he finds himself staring at a skull, a broken skeleton, or a shattered femur. "Most of the dead were young men. You could see their shiny teeth; you could tell from the skull, he was very, very young. One day I found a young man.... He had been badly tortured. Both his hands and feet had been chopped off," says Sidiq as he sits beneath the majestic maple trees lining the riverbank.

A fellow sand-digger in his early 40s, Naseer Ahmed, found a skull in March. "It was a small skull. It would have been a 16- or 17-year-old boy. The other day, it was a thigh with flesh still on it," Ahmed said. "It is a haunted river."

The grim story starts more than two decades ago, in 1989, when a separatist insurgency blossomed in Kashmir. India had gradually eroded any sense of Muslim-majority Kashmir's autonomy, rigging elections and arresting and torturing opposition political activists. Gun battles between the separatist guerrillas and the Indian troops were routine; land mines and hand grenades exploded every other day in crowded markets, on empty roads. Fear dominated the streets and nobody stepped out after dusk. By 1996, according to conservative official estimates, around 15,000 had been killed -- a number that has since risen to 70,000. India's military, paramilitary, and police forces deployed in massive numbers to pacify the rebellious province, and tens of thousands of Kashmiri civilians were taken into custody. Thousands never returned. Human Rights Watch, Amnesty International, and several Indian rights groups have repeatedly urged the Indian government to investigate the disappearances in Kashmir, but the government and the Army consistently argued that the missing weren't dead: They had crossed over to Pakistan to train as militants.

Stories of arrests, torture, killings, and secret burials were rife in Kashmir throughout the 1990s. Akhter Mohiuddin, a much-respected Kashmiri short-story writer, dedicated a collection of stories to "young men who were murdered at unknown places," and celebrated Kashmiri-American poet Agha Shahid Ali, who taught at New York University and the University of Massachusetts, Amherst, wrote in his 1997 collection, The Country Without a Post Office, "And the night's sun there in Srinagar? Guns shoot stars into the sky, the storm of constellations night after night, the infinite that rages on.... Srinagar was under curfew. The identity pass may or may not have helped in the crackdown. Son after son -- never to return from the night of torture -- was taken away."

Paula Bronstein/Getty Images

 

Basharat Peer is the author of Curfewed Night, an account of the Kashmir conflict. He writes about South Asian politics.

S KUMAR

12:14 AM ET

September 30, 2011

Partly true, but highly biased

Blaming everything on what has been discovered on India is only a part of the story. The major part of the blame does indeed lie with Pakistan.
The author has just ignored the systematic genocide of thousands of Kashmiri pandits. Who was responsible for that ? Where were all these people who claim to be fighting for justice ?
And, it is also incorrect to say that there is military pressure on the Indian political leadership. India is not Pakistan. The military doesn't run the country. Military might give important advice, since it is tasked with defending the borders of the country, but it does not really have a final say in anything.
This story does not deal with all aspects of what went wrong in Kashmir. Though it's ok to point out India's failures in some aspects, the partisan nature just makes this article look like a propaganda.

 

TRACK23

4:40 AM ET

October 6, 2011

because a day follows after a

because a day follows after a dark night.....
there is always a silver lining behind dark cloud.....

A bright day of FREEDOM will rise from these attrocities..........
siki?
türk siki?

 

PHILBEST

10:04 PM ET

October 7, 2011

India are the "good guys" in this

I'm pleased to see these first comments. From my grasp of modern history, I do not believe that India is capable of one-one hundredth of the level of atrocities that their opponents are capable of. It would not surprise me in the least if these mass graves were the graves of people killed by Islamic radicals for any one of the numerous "reasons" they kill people, including their "own". Infidels, apostates, Shia/Sunni sectarian conflicts, "honour", etc etc etc.

 

S KUMAR

12:29 AM ET

September 30, 2011

Partly true, but highly biased

Also, it should be noted that there was a few killings by the militant organisations in some villages of Kashmir recently.
Ref :
http://www.kashmirlive.com/story/Moral-brigade-LeT-militants-abduct-kill-sisters/744404.html
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/moral-brigade-let-militants-abduct-kill-si/744404/
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-14675582

et al.

There are quite a few stories like that. One can easily find on searching the net.
Now, what is remarkable is that there is hardly a condemnation (maybe some perfunctory statements) on these killings by the separatists and people who claim to be championing the cause of human rights in Kashmir.
Why ? Might I ask ?
Anyone who has been following Kashmir can easily discern that, apart from a handful few, everyone of these concerned people are just involved in a selfish charade. It is indeed a height of hypocrisy, which includes people like Basharat Peer.
Moreover, Mr Peer has contributed his own share in stonewalling govt. efforts to bring normalcy in the region recently, by having successfully led a campaign to cancel a literary festival in Kashmir, for all sorts of pretentious reasons.

 

MADIHA.

12:42 AM ET

September 30, 2011

Lovely article Basharat. Been

Lovely article Basharat. Been surprised how under reported this issue has been in the Western press.

 

DESIBEL

12:46 PM ET

October 6, 2011

Surprise?

It's a Yindoo, Joo and Croosader conspiracy.

 

LALIT AMBARDAR

4:05 AM ET

September 30, 2011

fiction or propaganda

Opinions emanating from Kashmir Valley , of those who refuse to see Pak's anti India jihad launched two decades ago responsible for plunging Kashmir in to a cycle of death & destruction since, seem to be so motivated that it is becoming increasingly difficult to discern even fiction from propaganda. Certainly, Kashmiri Islamists who self admittedly got trained & armed in Pakistan & ferried weapons from there along with the Afghan war remnant mujaheedin did not expect a simple walk over. India lawfully regards Kashmir as an integral part of the Indian Union & it is the right of every state to protect its sovereignty & national interests. US does it thousands of miles away from its shores in Af-Pak along with the Britain & other countries who feel threatened by the growing menace of the same pan Islamism inspired terrorism. Terror conflicts cause collateral damages & it is invariably the innocents who bear the brunt & innocents having got caught in the jihad that seeks secession of Kashmir from secular India on the ground that Kashmir is a Muslim majority province can not be ruled out & they must get justice. India has been very cautious in combating the Muslim insurgency taking heavy losses in terms of its men. There have been no air strikes unlike in Af-Pak where these are a routine. A four day long fierce gun fight with the Islamists ended only yesterday in north Kashmir-three Indian security men martyred. What do you do with the terrorists taken out in the encounter? You don’t raise mausoleums in their memory? How was Bin Laden disposed off? Terrorists killed in 26/11 Mumbai carnage were refused even graveyards for burial by the local Muslim community. Pakistan’s Northern Light Infantry men who were killed in Kargil war & then disowned by Pakistan must be lying buried in unmarked graves in those icy mountains. By the way conservative Islamic tradition discourages marking of graves. And finally what about the thousands of Kashmiris who were inveigled to join terror training camps in Pakistan & are still there while being regarded missing by their families back home? DNA test has been offered by the Govt. & truth must come out.
It well suits the propagandists to ignore India’s only ethnic cleansing that is of Kashmiri Hindu Pandits at the hands of Islamists. Aboriginal Hindu Pandits reduced to a miniscule minority over centuries of persecution since the advent of militant Islam in Kashmir were targeted as they were seen symbolising Indian presence in the valley & because they professed a different faith. Every Kashmiri Pandit killing was carried out in such a gruesome manner so as to scare away a whole community of say a couple of families living in overwhelmingly Muslim neighbourhoods. Brutalities inflicted on hapless Kashmiri Pandits described by India’s National Human Rights Commission as akin to genocide, would beat any horror fiction. Not a single case of individual killing of mass massacre of Kashmiri Pandits till date is pursued & it dents no ones conscience.

 

GLOBALFORCES

8:40 PM ET

October 1, 2011

Are you saying Pakistan is blame free?

In August, Indian officials claimed a soldier and a policeman had been arrested for the killing of a civilian in Kashmir.

Security forces had claimed that they killed a senior commander of the militant group Lashkar-e-Taiba during a gunbattle. But an autopsy determined the victim was a civilian with no ties to the militants.

Earlier, officials in Kashmir announced the arrest of two other police officers in connection with the death of a 28-year-old shopkeeper last month.

Parts of Indian-controlled Kashmir were shut down after separatists called a general strike to protest the death of the shopkeeper while in police custody.

The wives of the elite read a kindle 3g wifi, they take a paseo melbourne. Ordinary citizens don't have these luxuries in their own country

Kashmir is divided between India and Pakistan and claimed in full by both yet this report seems to sheet nothing home to Pakistan. Muslim separatists have been fighting for Kashmir's independence from Hindu-majority India or a merger with Muslim-majority Pakistan. Thousands have been killed in the insurgency.

 

CINGOZ439

4:45 AM ET

September 30, 2011

Terrorism

Now looking to get rid of the curse of terrorism turkey bulunu?u in states all over the world thought otherwise, all states should fight against terrorism is a terrorism problem will continue. Terrorism be fought on one front
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SYED ARBAB AHMED

5:23 AM ET

September 30, 2011

Can India really hold 'Indian Occupied Kashmir' any longer?

Can India really hold 'Indian Occupied Kashmir' any longer, as protest is on the increase day by day & Indian soldiers keep killing innocents on daily basis. Now specially Indian intellectuals and the rest of the world also comes to know that Kashmiri freedom movement is indigenous, as Pakistani youth is not protesting on the streets of Kashmir, they are Kashmiris and the Indian army brutally killing them, even on Eid days (Islamic festivals) Indian army imposed Curfew in Kashmir. And for the very 1st time I am watching BBC & CNN also highlighting to some extent the persecution and atrocities committed by Indian army on Kashmir, so the question arises that, do u think that India can hold 'Indian Occupied Kashmir' or they have to give them "FREEDOM"?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-11280132
&
http://edition.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/asiapcf/09/13/india.kashmir.curfew/index.html
"The world after way over half a century waking up"??????

If India is democracy then give Kashmiris the right of REFERUNDUM
http://bit.ly/gSyzGc
To eradicate Terrorism, we must........
http://bit.ly/dKiBUe

 

ABHIJIT

11:25 AM ET

September 30, 2011

No Indian supports atrocities in any form

..... except the state itself maybe.

Given this, there are fallacies in your perspective, even though the overall proposition is something I support "

1. Kashmir's accession to India has "well known" unresolved issues and to the extent that neither Pakistan nor India is willing to accept the "independent existence" of Kashmir as a sovereign state, I say that the current situation is the only feasible one.

2. The Indian state conducts atrocities wherever it can. This is not a policy of state though, but a failure of state.

The Indian government is subject to its own laws against the perpetrators.

It is a failure of the Indian state to grant Kashmir a referendum. However, independence is not an option for Kashmir. It would be - either India or Pakistan.

I support the need for a referendum. But independence is not on the table.

 

DESIBEL

12:51 PM ET

October 6, 2011

No cigar.

Now that the fantasies of Islamic Conquests have begun to die, you want to win by peddling victimhood?

 

MAZO

4:55 AM ET

October 14, 2011

Can Pakistan do anything more about it ?

The only portions of Kashmir occupied are those under the Pakistani and Chinese rule. The Indians were actually invited and “asked” to defend and protect Kashmir against the Pashtun barbarian hordes that Pakistan set upon the Kashmiris. Today, after decades of terrorist and insurgent activity and outright military attempts to invade and occupy Kashmir, we have the ridiculously clueless and naïve make such silly comments about “Indian occupation” of Kashmir.
Who invited Pakistan to annex Kashmir in the first place? Is there even one shred of paper for Pakistan’s rule over what is ironically called “Azad Kashmir” by the Pakistanis!
The Kashmiri “freedom” struggle as perpetuated by the locals in the Kashmir region of Jammu and Kashmir is basically a struggle by Muslims in the state to get out of the secular framework of the Indian state and that which is espoused by the Indian constitution and become an Islamic state. This pretext for calling for “independence” is considered as insufficient and a hollow by India as the concept of an Islamic state is considered as retrograde, regressive, and fundamentally contrary to democratic framework. Further, without a vote or support by the Kashmiri Pundit population, any such call for “independence” by the Islamists and fundamentalists in Kashmir is meaningless and irrelevant. Pakistan’s continued patronage of this further undermines and invalidates the entire idea.

India is a democracy but it's not crazy into allowing some Islamist hell hole to spring up by giving the Kashmiris the freedom to "fail". It is a risk India cannot afford to take.

 

RAMAN_SARKAR

10:14 AM ET

September 30, 2011

One-sided and well written

Dear Sir,

I agree with your contention that what the Indian security forces did, and are still doing to some extent, is reprehensible.

That said, I find your almost complete lack of acknowledgement about the ethnic cleansing of Kashmiri Pandits baffling (I have followed quite a few of your articles).

Please be fair; there were atrocities committed by both sides. And even if it is true that there are 70,000 graves, you have not mentioned how many of them were militants- surely an act of clever omission.

This is similar to the stuff that Arundhati Roy spins out, with little credibility.

To end, I would like to add that I am no rabid, khaki-shorts wearing RSS fanatic; many of my friends are Muslim and I cherish the diversity in India.

Regards,

 

DESIBEL

1:20 PM ET

October 6, 2011

Please go away

"I agree with your contention that what the Indian security forces did, and are still doing to some extent, is reprehensible."

It's not the Paki jokers that are a threat to India. It is Indians like you with your incredible naivtey that pose a clear and present danger to everyone around you. While the likes of you exist, even a 2-bit adversary like Pakistan will continue believing that it stands a chance.

 

MAZO

5:12 AM ET

October 14, 2011

Oh Please!

"To end, I would like to add that I am no rabid, khaki-shorts wearing RSS fanatic; many of my friends are Muslim and I cherish the diversity in India."

ROFL!! Yeah, because if you have Muslim friends then that automatically makes you immune to any criticism of bias or prejudice right? What shallow intellectual sophistry!
Please have the stones to state your position and defend its position on its own merits than using your personal associations as a cover! It is because of people like you that Muslim fundamentalists have run rampant without being put in their place. You don’t need to have Muslim friends to tell Muslims that what happened to Kashmir’s Pundits was nothing short of full-scale genocide just like what happened in Yugoslavia! You don’t need to have Muslim friends to say that Kashmir’s so called “freedom” struggle is nothing more than a Islamic fundamentalist attempt to set up a Sharia state and legitimize their genocide of Kashmir’s Hindus! Not having Muslims friends doesn’t make the truth “biased” or “prejudiced” or not PC enough!

 

ETOILE

11:07 AM ET

September 30, 2011

Excellent work! A crushing slap on the janus-faced indian gov.

This is a superb article and brings to light the atrocities committed by india.
Why doesnot the international community take collective punitive action against india. perhaps , the author should have called upon the international community to bomb the light out of these indian rascals.

If the indian army keeps on perpetrating horrendous cruelties against kashmiris, isi would keep on taking out indians in mumbai and delhi. you chauvinistic indians dont understand that your army is undoing india by killing muslims in kashmir and maoists in the north western periphery.

Theday when india will break into a thousand and one pieces is not far off if the indian army keeps up the dirty work.

 

ABHIJIT

2:52 PM ET

September 30, 2011

Yeah right

Etoile : Your French sounding name either belies your loyalties or demonstrates your utter naivete.

No Indian will ever stand up for the fairness of their government. We are constantly exploited as a polity by those who represent us.

If you think Indians are humiliated by your figurative slap, you belong in your dreamland.

We are all shocked by the graves. We just hope there was some method to the madness in the actions.

In terms of having drawn first blood, no one needs any more convincing that it was Pakistan who fed militancy in Kashmir necessitating these dangerous follow up actions by the Indian state.

This will happen again. No pseudo French moniker's figurative slap will prevent the instruments of state from going over the edge when pushed over the edge by proxy warriors.

 

ABHIJIT

2:52 PM ET

September 30, 2011

Yeah right

Etoile : Your French sounding name either belies your loyalties or demonstrates your utter naivete.

No Indian will ever stand up for the fairness of their government. We are constantly exploited as a polity by those who represent us.

If you think Indians are humiliated by your figurative slap, you belong in your dreamland.

We are all shocked by the graves. We just hope there was some method to the madness in the actions.

In terms of having drawn first blood, no one needs any more convincing that it was Pakistan who fed militancy in Kashmir necessitating these dangerous follow up actions by the Indian state.

This will happen again. No pseudo French moniker's figurative slap will prevent the instruments of state from going over the edge when pushed over the edge by proxy warriors.

 

DESIBEL

12:54 PM ET

October 6, 2011

Cruelty

There's more cruelty to come. Watch as India crushes every Paki self-delusion.

 

SAIF UR REHMAN

12:51 PM ET

September 30, 2011

what lies beneath..........

what lies beneath the broken skulls?
what lies beneath a river of blood?
what lies beneath the bones and jawas found in river jehlum?
what lies beneath the mass graves of young freedom fighters?

ITS NOT DEFINETLY A SAGE OF FLOWERS..............

Its something which INDIANs cant see because they are in delusions of increadable india...........

 

SAIF UR REHMAN

12:59 PM ET

September 30, 2011

what lies beneath..........

because a day follows after a dark night.....
there is always a silver lining behind dark cloud.....

A bright day of FREEDOM will rise from these attrocities..........

 

KMC2K9

1:50 PM ET

September 30, 2011

The main issue we have in

The main issue we have in Kashmir is that Pakistan interferes in the state, the people want independence which is there right but if Pakistan want to control the state no chance! How is that independence? In the UK and the rest of India with the development of new jobs and in the UK you have massive supermarkets in my area alone we have five hundred new Tesco jobs if an area has high employment rates and low unemployment rates for the young everyone will be happy create an economy and the main problem resolves itself!

 

EKLAVIYA

10:01 PM ET

September 30, 2011

1% of Indias Population cannot be threat

Bible says do not wish up on others what you wish not done to you .The Pundits and 85% of Population of India does not have that believe to have to be loyal to or expected to be answerable to .

With few inconsequential liberal leftists who by there exception are worse enemies of Kashmir Muslims the line between the Kashmir and rest of India is very predictable 85 % Hindu are on one side with excuses of Military Pakistan Sedition Sec124A !21 A Pundits... there is more bias of Hindu towards a disenfranchised Kashmirs .The Kashmir state cant do what any other state like Tamil Nadu can have the rights at par with it only because Kashmir is Muslim predominant And Tamil Nadu is Hindu majority .

If the Article is Biased no injustice is done or can be damaging and dangeous But for majority to forbear on Kashmiri even if they are not good advocate by nature not like Sikh Kirpan or Nepali with Khukri ..they are treated so badl . High caste nonmuslim would not even think of trading place with Kashmiri.If you think Kashmiris are enjoying giving false statements throwing stones every body trying to go abroad dont get treated as Indian in rest of India Or as Acceptable Kashmiris vis a vi with nonmuslims A muslim kashmiris hide there identity as nonmuslim when they go to U P Delhi MP specially the Hindi Hindu Hindustan regions
.In Such a Despicable position rest of Vocal Indians on Forum cant even think of being a Kashmiris its like would a Brahman exchange even a day as Dalit

.No Indian would like to trade place with despicable life for 20 years of curfew and i lac dead ( i exaggerate to show there is no importance to be having EXACT numbers )
-Lastly the Pakistan factor is Excuse by what Pakistan Does or Not Do its not Kashmiris to be blamed or bear consequence of ...specially when they do not have enjoyable existence to feel guilty to deserve the blame heaped upon then like load on a donkey
au revoir

 

ETOILE

1:27 AM ET

October 1, 2011

Indians need to improve their command on the english language!!!

abhijit,

what do you mean by saying " no indian will ever stand up for the fairness of the indian government''?

do you know what does stand up for mean?
it means to defend something or somebody.

perhaps you intended to say that no indian will ever stand up for the duplicity of the indian government.

Bravo!!!
I am of the same view. no indian should defend the duplicitous talk of the indian government.

as far as humiliation of indians is concerned , i say that indians cannot be humiliated for humiliation implies an insult to self dignity. you indians dont have that.

Arabs took it away from from you when they occupied your land in 712 AD. Britishers , upon their turn, took away even the last vestiges of it. so , definitely you lack self dignity.

bravo!!!
i am of the same view. indians cannot be humiliated.

At the time of the partition of india, Kashmir was to join pakistan as kashmir was a muslim majority area but the indians wrested it . When kashmiris launced their struggle to throw off their yoke , you indians began massacring them by saying that pakistan had incited them into violence.

you have always been fed lies. please analyse an issue objectively before sounding off about it.

May your Lord Hanuman(monkey to us americans) grant you some wisdom and dignity too for feeling humiliation.

 

MOHAWAKK

7:02 PM ET

October 1, 2011

Too stupid to insult.

For types like you ignorance is bliss.You sit in your bubble and dream of wild orgasms.When you wake up you realize you puked all over yourself,so you feel good about yourself and then you start your circus again.Nothing else can be expected of a white trailer trash like you anyway.Same moronic antics of hate and venom.Save your "facts" and dumb opinions for someone who is interested,coz its definitely not going to be Indians.

Now,first things first.."INDIA" as a country was "NEVER" conquered by arabs or any muzzies.The muslim rule was barely a blot on the long history of the great nation.That too few and far between.The longest rule was that of akbar and even he couldnt rule the entire country coz of the fierce resistance of the Hindus.

Secondly,yes we support the government and the army in the actions taken in JK,whole heatedly.They get what they deserve.If you pretend amnesia when it comes to kashmiri pandits, then to hell with the thugs marauding as "freedom fighters".

Thirdly,please spare the Indians this psychobabble of bad governance,atrocities and duplicity.An American calling ANYONE by these names is akin to a whore cussing the virgin mary.
Last but not the least quit poking your nose where it doesnt belong.Get a life or whatever is left of it.
Last time i checked you had screwed korea,vietnam,Iraq and now afghanistan and you have the audacity to lecture the Indians,specially after what you have done to the Native Americans??..huh..

Ps:Hope you liked my english??..Not that I care.

 

MOHAWAKK

7:10 PM ET

October 1, 2011

Ps

Jeez,how did i miss the word objectivity in your puke??..Do you even KNOW what it means??.coz what you are doing is ANYTHING but objectivity but as I said no one expects much from you anyway so cheer up,you can enroll back in kindergarten.
Monkey god?..hell yeah...god is in everyone and everywhere...alas..how would you know..the only use you have for a monkey is for foreplay..god is alien to you so I wouldnt even waste my time explaining it to u..
how do you like em apples??..:)

 

SHASH87

3:51 PM ET

October 2, 2011

Read up before you comment

You need to complete your schooling before you start posting. A bunch of belligerent comments from you are of no consequence to us Indians. However we prefer to educate the ignorant morons of this world. So in that spirit:

what do you mean by saying " no indian will ever stand up for the fairness of the indian government''?

From this most people would get that not all Indians approve the actions of the government. Therefore we are at liberty to change the government at time of the next elections which ofcourse does not happen that frequently in the great mess of a country (if you can call it that) next to ours.

Ignoring the moronic insults, and moving onto your next piece of fact:
Arabs took it away from from you when they occupied your land in 712 AD. Britishers , upon their turn, took away even the last vestiges of it. so , definitely you lack self dignity.

The first invasion of India by the Muslims occurred in the year 712 which was defeated and the first successful invasion of India by a Muslim king was in the year 1005. Also FYI Pakistan was considered to be a part of India until 1947, so the 'same invasions' were successful there. :P

Moving on:
At the time of the partition of india, Kashmir was to join pakistan as kashmir was a muslim majority area but the indians wrested it . When kashmiris launced their struggle to throw off their yoke , you indians began massacring them by saying that pakistan had incited them into violence.

I won't bother commenting on this piece of stupidity. You can read up (if you are not as dumb as I think you are) on this on any website not hosted in Pakistan, or you could read up its history on http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/1399992/A-brief-history-of-the-Kashmir-conflict.html.

Well I hope you complete your basic schooling before you post any more facts and best of luck on completing that with this kind of 'knowledge'. I sincerely hope whichever god you pray to grant you a basic measure of decency, knowledge and reading ability.

 

SHASH87

3:55 PM ET

October 2, 2011

Read up before you comment

@ETIOLE
You need to complete your schooling before you start posting. A bunch of belligerent comments from you are of no consequence to us Indians. However we prefer to educate the ignorant morons of this world. So in that spirit:

what do you mean by saying " no indian will ever stand up for the fairness of the indian government''?

From this most people would get that not all Indians approve the actions of the government. Therefore we are at liberty to change the government at time of the next elections which ofcourse does not happen that frequently in the great mess of a country (if you can call it that) next to ours.

Ignoring the moronic insults, and moving onto your next piece of fact:
Arabs took it away from from you when they occupied your land in 712 AD. Britishers , upon their turn, took away even the last vestiges of it. so , definitely you lack self dignity.

The first invasion of India by the Muslims occurred in the year 730 which was defeated and the first successful invasion of India by a Muslim king was in the year 1005. Also FYI Pakistan was considered to be a part of India until 1947, so the 'same invasions' were successful there. :P

Moving on:
At the time of the partition of india, Kashmir was to join pakistan as kashmir was a muslim majority area but the indians wrested it . When kashmiris launced their struggle to throw off their yoke , you indians began massacring them by saying that pakistan had incited them into violence.

I won't bother commenting on this piece of stupidity. You can read up (if you are not as dumb as I think you are) on this on any website not hosted in Pakistan, or you could read up its history on http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/1399992/A-brief-history-of-the-Kashmir-conflict.html.

Well I hope you complete your basic schooling before you post any more facts and best of luck on completing that with this kind of 'knowledge'. I sincerely hope whichever god you pray to grant you a basic measure of decency, knowledge and reading ability.

 

ETOILE

11:28 AM ET

October 3, 2011

It seems indians are being taught garbled and fudged history

SHASH AND Mohawk,

IN 712 AD, Muhammad bin Qasim, a seventeen year old scion of the ruling family, led his army into Eastern India. He Conquered Multan and put to death its king, Raja Dahir. Adding insult to injury , he regaled himself on the ravishingly beautiful daughters of RAJA DAHIR, parimal and suraj devi, before despatching them for the pleasure of the Muslim Caliph, WAlLID.

Your argument centering around a denial of muslim victory in 712 AD at multan is simply ludicrous. Muslims not only defeated hindoos of India but enslaved them as well. The daughters of the poor and rich alike were turned into prostitutes. I pity you . how shameful your history is . Now its clear why you have made frantic efforts in making up your silly and face saving arguments.

In 1025 AD, Mahmud Ghaznvi sallied forth from Ghazni in Afganhinstan and destroyed the temple of somnath. It is said that he took along with him loot worth millions of dinar.

The looting of the dignity of hindoo women, hindoo religion and hindoo culture continued and you indians kept on suffering ignominious cruelties at the hands of muslims.

You sanctimonious indians of today have sprung up from such a humiliated nation. shame on you.

How dared you fudge facts of history and deny what happened. you people are victims of rape and bestial rape. you need not deny it . I think you should seriously start thinking about committing suicide or at least keeping your mouths shut in the face of irrefutable evidence that your forefathers and foremothers, let me say it, were brutally dishonored.

As far as my schooling is concerned, i would like to say that i need to finish it as you have suggested but rather i should start thinking about opening up a school for indians for teaching them their own history and for instilling in them a sense of dignity.

you talk about dignity messrs which you dont know. In your religion, it is permissible to sell bodies to godesses and become prostitutes. religious prostitution is going on in many different parts of India. IN fact, an ass-faced actor of your country, anal kapoor, is fooling around india trying to create awareness of dignity and its benefits.

"From this most people would get that not all Indians approve the actions of the government. Therefore we are at liberty to change the government at time of the next elections which ofcourse does not happen that frequently in the great mess of a country (if you can call it that) next to ours."

As to this crap, Pakistan, despite being a poor and military run country bombed the lights out of you many times and you indians could do nothing about that. THe ISI pounces at you at its own sweet will and mauls you apart by the thousands.

It has been proved that Ajmal Kasab, the mastermind of mumbai attacks, is a pakistani, and you eunuchs have not been able to do anything about that. Pakistan runs its sword through you with all the ease it can afford and you hindoos keep on chirping that the international community must make pakistan take to task the perpetrators of the horrible rape that you were subjected to.

WHere is your dignity. Tell me where is it. is it in pakistan getting raped too.
You claim that you are a democracy and can change your government. Your government is presenting India to pakistan time and again for rape and it seems that you are unable to replace it. MAN MOHAN is no man and ample proof of you indignity.

 

DESIBEL

12:35 PM ET

October 6, 2011

Fantasies of sword and sandal conquests.

"Your argument centering around a denial of muslim victory in 712 AD at multan is simply ludicrous. Muslims not only defeated hindoos of India but enslaved them as well. The daughters of the poor and rich alike were turned into prostitutes. "

Indeed. The subjugated Hindus simply started calling themselves Pakistanis to escape their humiliation and abject surrender. They have begun to identify themselves with their conquerors in what must be, a truly humbling existence. It never seems to occur to the Paki jihadis that they are the product of the rapine and cultural subjugation of which they seem so proud of. The region which seems to be going by the name of Pakistan nowadays have been rolled over so many times that they can't remember anymore who they are/were anymore.

 

ETOILE

11:47 AM ET

October 3, 2011

sprinkle the oil of shame and burn your selves into ganges

Shash and Mohawak,

Once upon a time there were two indian women, a rani and a domestic. they were walking along a canal. A few dacoits lurking in fields nearby, waylaid them and subjected them to rape.

When the men were gone , the rani said " jai to lakhsmi, My dignity has remained intact." the domestic replied," i dont know how many dignities you have, i have lost the one i had.":)

perhaps you are acting like the rani.

 

MOHAWAKK

6:09 AM ET

October 4, 2011

Pull the head out of ur butt

@Etoile...my my my..someone seems to be coming all over themselves thinking of the Hindoos..jeez we really are flattered...u really r a piece of work..arent u??..tell me where did your daddy touch u??..there simply isnt any explanation for this rabid hatred and toxicity...since your head seems to be stuck so deep inside your ass that you barely can see your own neck,forget our history,let me educate you a little.I wont even try teaching you any sense of decency,so I will come straight to facts.
1.Yes qasim came and defeated Dahir,took his daughter but the same daughter outsmarted him and he was chopped and bagged into pieces to baghdad.Since you are so obsessed with rape and looking at enormity of child abuse in America,I pity you.Anyway,hindus are too cultured to get down to gutter fight with you,who seem to joy herself into it.

2.Muslims did win battles but never the war but since I know now who your sources are,I can safely say that westerners telling us our history is same as laden reciting american history.You simply CAN NOT live with the fact that there was a civilization way more advanced,sophisticated and cultured than the west can ever dream of,so you can rant and babble and puke all you want but we know better.The whole world knows the level and bigotry a christian is capable of,specially a missionary so please get a life.

3.We are not in the business of denial,infact we want muslims to accept what they did to the Indians.The way you find joy in condemning the hindus to shame for something that they didnt do doesnt come as a surprise to me considering what you did to the native americans.As far as whoring is concerned,well,you would know the bettr,wouldnt u??..hahahaha
Since you are so in love with pakistan,then please humor me and ask a pakistani about an american or a white women and you will be cured of your mental sickness and the lust for a Muslim phalllus.

Ps: Finally I have come to realize that you are in need of serious medical help and so am wasting my time with you but I wrote my piece nonetheless,in case someone else needs an education.
cheers...

 

DUKEOFLANCASTERVI

6:19 AM ET

October 4, 2011

Dear Etoile

First of all, please stop pretending to be American - you are quite clearly Pakistani. Not just because you present Pakistan as a proud, successful country (I nearly fell off my chair when I read "Pakistan, despite being a poor and military run country bombed the lights out of you many times and you indians could do nothing about that. THe ISI pounces at you at its own sweet will and mauls you apart by the thousands." - quite clearly meant to provoke...you win), which NO non-Pakistani would ever do. You used the term "Britisher", which only people from South Asia do.

So now we've established you're a Pakistani, it's easier to respond: it's not your fault, because your "education" (I use the term VERY loosely) teaches you that Pakistan and Islam are great, while India and Hindus (or "Hindoos" in your pseudo-colonial-speak) are rapacious, aggressive and violent. Furthermore, your obsession with raping women speaks volumes about the society you come from. The only metaphor you could think of was this, was it? I'm not surprised at all. It’s true that India has historically found it hard to repel invasions. So what? Well done, you guys win 1st place in the Violence Awards. But remind me, how many wars between India and Pak have been won by Pak? Zero. India whupped Pak’s arse on EVERY OCCASION.

While I’m at it, let's get 2 other things clear: (1) Kashmir was independent when Pakistan invaded it (because it realised the leaders of Kashmir, a Hindu and a Muslim, were tilting towards India) and continues to illegally occupy it. (2) Pakistan, given its persecution of its minorities, terrorism on its neighbours (India, Afghanistan, Tajik and, amazingly, the western bit of China!!) and all round incompetence in selling nuclear secrets willy nilly, is more likely to break up than India. Just wait till Baluchistan truly breaks off…it’ll be open season on the rest of Pak.

 

SHAELS

12:32 PM ET

October 3, 2011

motivated, funded effort to somehow get Kashmir to boil again!

Even after Fai, propaganda against India continues, through others Pakistani proxies like Basharat Peer, and several other such ISI plug manufacturers in the Kashmiri media, and even Kashmir correspondents for all mainline television and print publications. Indian copy cat liberals hardly realize as they are led down the garden (ISI) path in their misdirected fervour.

Majority of allegations of rape, murder and even this mass grave chimera remain platforms to incite rebellion and uprising among the emotional youth already hardwired to accept this bullshit as the gospel truth.

Strangely, the MEA and the MoD, as well as the rather chirpy press release intense MHA have all remained inexplicably quiet, as this lie is repeated often enough, so it starts feeling true.

There is a motivated, funded effort to somehow get Kashmir on the boil again, unfortunately the people who are supposed to watch and take care of things such, are again asleep on the watch.

 

ETOILE

12:21 AM ET

October 5, 2011

Britisher( NAmE, old-fashioned) ; you read all my posts, wow.

Dear DukeofLancatervi,

Three cheers for your ' impeccable' logic. I am more than impressed.

First off, 'Britisher' is more north american than indian.If you open up the oxford advanced learner's dictionary (new 8th edition) to page no 184, you will undoubtedly come across the entry ' britisher'. For your kind information, the dictionary states that the word britisher is North american, old fashioned and informal. Therefore, your argument predicated on the word britisher being solely in use of indians , stands debunked. By extension your corollary that i am a pakistani stands confuted.

You indians are so hawkish on pakistan that any body supporting pakistan is a pakistani in your eyes. This shows how bigoted and narrow-minded you indians are.

secondly your moniker , duke of lancaster, suggests that although britishers left your country more than 60 years ago, you indians are still slavish in your attitude towards them.

perhaps people like you have not read about the atrocities at jallianwala garden. Thousands of indians were massacred there.

This again supports my view that you indians have no dignity and act like the dishonored rani who insisted after her rape that she was not molested.Perhaps you are a step ahead of the rani in the realm of indignity . you still love the rapists.

While dilating upon the kashmir issue, you forget the states of hyderabad, junagarh and Manavadar which are bound up with the kashmir issue.

1. The ruler of junagarh was a muslim. He acceded to Pakistan. When pakistan apprised india of this accession, India replied that the action of the Nwab was illegal on the grounds that junagarh was a hindu majority area and the nawab could not decide its fate.

2. The ruler of Manavadar acceded to pakistan. India , invoking the same principle, annexed manavadar.

3. The Nizam of Hyderabad wanted to declare confederacy with pakistan but Hyderabad was annexed too by the shameless indians.

4. Kashmir, a pre-dominantly muslim majority area, was under the wicked Paw of Maha raja Hari Singh. AS KASHMIR WAS A muslim majority area and shared a border with Kashmir, Kasmir was supposed to join Pakistan. Now, if india annexed junagarh and manavadar because they were hindu majority areas, india should have borne with dignity the confederacy of kashmir with pakistan because it was a muslim majority area.

BUT ALAS!!

INdians have no dignity. and they are being taught a pack of lies under the guise of history.

Pakistan cannot be disintegrated. Keeping in view the rise of China as the super power of the world, it would not be amiss to say that pakistan's woes are just a matter of few years.

China, ensconced in her role as the superpower will , first of all, take on the indians and Pakistan will be used in this game as her cat's paw and agent. We will leave afghanistan in 2014 to afghans and pakistanis. INdia's dreams of making an alliance with afghanistan to hedge in pakistan will be shattered with the arrival of the taliban in Kabul.

India , that is confronted with Moaist uprising in nine out of 28 states, will be blown to smithereens with pakistan and China on two sides, and Chinese controlled Burma from the third . With China's growing naval power in the south china sea, the chinese warships will mount a naval assault through the strait of malacca on to the Indian Shore. If America will try to resist the four pronged attack on india, the chinese naval presence, courtesy the Gwadar port, will be sufficient to head off american ships. Taking into account Pakistan's cordial relations with arab states, the oil supply to INdia will be severed. Finally, India will buckle and paksitani and chinese boots will dishonour indians in their own country.

AS to the question of nukes , India does not have the courage to launch them. Moreover, the chinese missile defence systems can keep the missiles off pakistani and chinese soils.

If you dont believe me , try to believe the words of the chinese ambassador who declared,"" Pakistan is to us what Israel is to the US.""

I am not a pakistani . This is why i view south asian and asian affairs with rigorous objectivity unlike you indians who are hell bent upon proving like the rani that you have dignity and India is the 'best'

 

DUKEOFLANCASTERVI

3:52 PM ET

October 5, 2011

A strangely Pakistani type of American

If you must know, I'm from Lancashire, England. I am also Indian, however. ANyway, never mind that.

I was fully aware of of the definition of "Britisher"...the point is, it's OLD FASHIONED in the US/UK. The only people using this word TODAY are in South Asia, and this is what betrayed you. But ok...let's say you're [exclusively] American...why the venom for India? You are aware that almost every American considers India to be a force for good and Pakistan a force for bad?

I also find it astounding that you have nothing good to say about India and nothing bad to say about Pakistan. This indicates to me a completely brainwashed fury against India that is surely the opposite of the impartiality you claim. Any logical person would admit Pakistan has some severe problems rather than being in denial and blaming everything on India. SOme would say this is precisely Pakistan's problem...focusing too much on India when the real threat is from elsewhere. I find it strange in particular because no Indian is waiting at the border for Pakistan's soldiers to go, so that they can invade. Does Islamabad/Rawalpindi really think India is waiting for a landgrab? Absolutely not. India wants to be left alone so it can develop. Pakistan could develop too, if it focused on that rather than blasphemy laws, persecution of minorities (Ahmadis as well), etc.

Basically, India has problems, but Indians are dealing with it. The Army is much better at handling Kashmir (apparently there's been a lot of tourism this year), the Supreme Court is rolling back silly old laws (decriminalising homosexuality...gonna happen in Pakistan soon, or is it haraam?). The thing that bothers us about Pakistan is the complete and utter denial about the problems. Basically, Pakistan's advocates say all its problems come from India/US/Israel. I find the Israel angle the most unbelievable. Anyway, until you admit some of Pakistan’s failings (like I can admit India’s failings in Kashmir, the caste system and elsewhere), I won’t believe you’re impartial.

As for the Chinese quote...read the first 2 lines of this page:

http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/features/2010/10/20101028135728235512.html

It's Al-Jazeera, so you don't have to worry about that famous anti-Pakistan bias that 99.99% of the world is suffering from.

The rest of your post is a fantasy of staggering proportions.

“Pakistan cannot be disintegrated”
“China, ensconced in her role as the superpower will , first of all, take on the Indians”
“India , that is confronted with Moaist uprising in nine out of 28 states, will be blown to smithereens with pakistan and China on two sides”

You think China is going to “take on India”?! For the sake of Pakistan?! And with this “blown to smithereens”, you are showing your desire that everybody in India be killed, which is basically psychopathic. In fact, it sort of shows where the insane Talibani mentality comes from...

“AS to the question of nukes , India does not have the courage to launch them.” Yes, because India has committed to a no-first-use policy, because it is a civilised country. Unlike Pakistan, which maintains its first-use-policy.
“I am not a pakistani . This is why i view south asian and asian affairs with rigorous objectivity unlike you indians who are hell bent upon proving like the rani that you have dignity and India is the 'best'”
HAHAHAHAHA. Contradicting yourself in the same sentence! Good laugh, old chap.

 

ETOILE

12:30 AM ET

October 5, 2011

Baluchistan will never secede from pakistan

dear lancaster or whatever,

the baloch insurgency is the rebellion of nawabs writ large. The ordinary baluchis, in the firm grasp of poverty, are in no position to fight and they donot want to fight. Why should they fight. The baloch issue is centered around pakistan's refusal to pay gas royalty to baluch nawabs. what would the baloch man in the street get from fighting the nawabs war who have been suppressing and repressing them for centuries.

The indians are trying their level best to turn pockets of insurgency into a conflagration which will not happen.

 

DESIBEL

1:03 PM ET

October 6, 2011

Never say never

You seem awfully sure about the unity of a country(ugh!) which was split into two halves by the very same adversary.

 

ETOILE

12:31 AM ET

October 5, 2011

Baluchistan will never secede from pakistan

dear lancaster or whatever,

the baloch insurgency is the rebellion of nawabs writ large. The ordinary baluchis, in the firm grasp of poverty, are in no position to fight and they donot want to fight. Why should they fight. The baloch issue is centered around pakistan's refusal to pay gas royalty to baluch nawabs. what would the baloch man in the street get from fighting the nawabs war who have been suppressing and repressing them for centuries.

The indians are trying their level best to turn pockets of insurgency into a conflagration which will not happen.

 

DUKEOFLANCASTERVI

5:45 PM ET

October 5, 2011

Baluch + Chinese

For an American, you sure have tremendous knowledge of what's going on in the streets in Pakistan...and no, the Baluch insurgency is not just about gas. They want to be separate and Pakistan won't let them. The MQM is being besieged by Punjabi Pakistani groups.

As for your professed love of the Chinese and belief that they will help Pakistan, how long before China gets tired of the usual Pakistani terrorist crap taking place in their own backyard? China isn't like India, which is always looking for dialogue and discussion. If China feels truly threatened by Pakistan, Pakistan will just be wiped off the map. They won't take any of Pakistan's crap like the Indians do. They're truly merciless.

http://www.dawn.com/2011/08/02/china-blames-terrorists-trained-in-pakistan-for-violence.html

I would rather Pakistan be prosperous, but maybe if China disowned Pakistan, it would forced Pak to act like a proper country instead of being a breeding ground for terrorism and leaked nuclear secrets. Like I say, a prosperous Pak is a good thing. India might feel jealous if Pak becomes more developed than India, but that's better than feeling threatened by the latest Pakistani psychopath in Bombay.

 

ETOILE

12:43 AM ET

October 5, 2011

Mohawk--- you like this red indian hair style

dear mohawk,

| think its not me who is suffering from a mental illness. Its you indians, all of you. somebody calls himself duke of lancaster, somebody mohawk. You schizophrenic indians dont like indian names perhaps. wow, i love your 'honourable' practise of borrowing such foreign sounding , dignity purveeying monikers.

if you have dignity , dont reply to this post as you stated in your previous one that you just wasted your time in replying to me.

Thank you :)

 

QASIM57

8:55 AM ET

October 5, 2011

Wow - hit a nerve

Etoile - you seem to have hit a raw nerve here. It's fun to see our Indian friends rattled so badly by your comments.

Even on an article about terrible, inhumane atrocities that their government has inflicted on a poor people, these web warrior indos can't stop their constant diahrrea of hateful propaganda.

 

DESIBEL

11:53 AM ET

October 6, 2011

Somebody sponsor Basharat Peer.

Post -Fai, the Kashmiri grievance factory has little going for it. Basharat Peer can keep trying but I wouldn't be too hopeful if I were him, given the state of the world economy. He seems to rue the fact that Indian economy is the only one doing well.

Except for a few ambulance chasers like Amnesty International and frothing at the mouth Pakistanis, the world is quite comfortable with how India has managed a very difficult situation.

Ultimately, there is no point in trying to analyze an article that peddles the same grievances as jihadis. Jihadi hallmark themes of Islamic victimhood, muslim innocence, kufr vilification pervade the article. Basharat Peer tries to disguise himself, but the Ghulam Nabi Fai affair remains etched on our minds.

 

VISIONTUNNEL

4:10 AM ET

October 9, 2011

Pakistani Game: Roadblocks to Peace in Afghanistan and Kashmir

The article reeks of biases along with professional and personal dishonesty.

Basharat Peer gleefully dramatizes and repeats the well entrenched cast iron narrative about Kashmir with out acknowledging the lunatic Pakistani role in the region and beyond.

The belated acceptance and revelations from frustrated Americans and a bleeding Afghanistan points to only one source; an imploding Pakistan pursuing its long term self destructive agenda.

Statements from harassed Afghan officials and leaders further confirm the long term corrosive Pakistani Game plan of forever putting Roadblocks to Peace in Afghanistan and Kashmir.

I don't want to join issue with the acutely troubled Pakistani hotheads, apologists and supporters of Islamic terrorism, revisiting history to justify their myopic ideals and dangerous fixations.

It would be better they learn to accept the hard facts and realities by dumping the age old habit of shameless denials and blatant obfuscations.

And they must do for their own benefits and peace, some thing have lost for so long in their megalomaniac quest.

BTW how come they are so worried and deeply concerned about deaths in India, when they never investigated and punished no one for genocide of 300,000 to 3 million Bangladeshis during 1970-1971?

I know some troubled souls would retort by dumping voodoo research based on dubious methodologies by so called scholar, Shamila.

 

LOE

11:31 PM ET

October 9, 2011

I hope this won’t ever happen again

I don’t like hearing violence, but unfortunately, it happens every now and then. Passing the blame to others won’t really help it. Regardless of who could have done this unearthly manner, and whoever was supposed to be responsible on this unmerciful act, people should understand that many lives are already taken in Kashmir, and majority of them are the young people who seem not to know anything about the action of vitalzym. No matter what your reason may be, I think, aside from giving comments that are not related to the issue, everyone might just want to share their thoughts on how to prevent this massacre to ever happen again.

 

KINGFISHER

4:02 PM ET

October 13, 2011

WHAT LIES BENEATH

This is the first time that India has been made to stand naked in front the community of nations as an accused of committal of genocide. The first genocide was committed by this unscrupulous criminal racist in India almost 36 years back.

That genocide case was rotting in Indian Supreme court with the hope to exclude the sponsor-er of the genocide and prime accused of the case the leader of the political Party BJP Mr. Advani a Hindu racist.

For the people of west to imagine the condition of the people of other religions living in this God forsaken Country where there is no safety of life will be very difficult.

It is because when a national big Political Party head organizes and sponsors committal of genocide then one can imagine how happily the people of other religious beliefs pass their days in this tyrant Hindus land.

The Genocidal case was investigated by Indian investigator and was also charge sheeted by the Indian. But on second thought it became prestige issue.and every government tried to get Advani excluded from the charge sheet but failed as a result it is hanging in supreme court.

Aggrieved people wants to transfer the case to ICC but is afraid to their mouth for fear of government's retaliation .

I had to run this introduction because what is beneath that everyone knows and understand but the Indian wants to pass it with some other pleas and excuses.

Aggrieved people of the area wants that authorities start Genocide case and the trial to be held under ICC, but they can't open their mouth because of their life threat. These people are looking up to US to help get the justice done.

 

DUKEOFLANCASTERVI

5:29 AM ET

October 14, 2011

Proportions

There's no doubt that India has made mistakes with minorities, but why put the spotlight on India? Pakistan massacred atleast 1m people in 1971...how about that? Or do Bangladeshis not count?! How many people have died from police brutality in Kashmir over 60 years? Maybe 5,000?

I would say the world has a lot of respect for India somehow managing to survive in a dangerous region, surrounded by hostile and completely messed up countriescold, ruthless countries hellbent on destroying India somehow or by simply flexing their muscles (China). I'm sorry to shoehorn Pakistan in here, but the fact remains...Pakistan has committed heinous crimes for which it has not paid or even apologised. Unfortunately, the Bangladeshis have been inept as well, beginning the inquiry into the 1971 atrocities only this year...

 

YARINSIZ

3:15 PM ET

October 25, 2011

The wives of the elite read a

The wives of the elite read a kindle 3g wifi, they take a paseo melbourne. Ordinary citizens don't have these luxuries in their own country Kashmir is divided between India and Pakistan and claimed in full by both yet this report seems to sheet nothing home seslichat to Pakistan. Muslim separatists have been fighting for Kashmir's independence from Hindu-majority India or a merger with Muslim-majority Pakistan. Thousands have been killed in the insurgency.