The End of the Win-Win World

Why China’s rise really is bad for America -- and other dark forces at work.

BY GIDEON RACHMAN | JANUARY 24, 2012

I have spent my working life writing about international politics from the vantage points of the Economist and now the Financial Times. Surrounded by people who tracked markets and business, it has always felt natural for me to see international economics and international politics as deeply intertwined.

In my book Zero-Sum Future, written in 2009, I attempted to predict how the global economic crisis would change international politics. As the rather bleak title implied, I argued that relations between the major powers were likely to become increasingly tense and conflict-ridden. In a worsening economic climate, it would be harder for the big economies to see their relationships as mutually beneficial -- as a win-win. Instead, they would increasingly judge their relationships in zero-sum terms. What was good for China would be seen as bad for America. What was good for Germany would be bad for Italy, Spain, and Greece.

Now, as the paperback edition of my book comes out, the prediction is being borne out -- which is gratifying as an author, although slightly worrying as a member of the human race. The rise of zero-sum logic is the common thread, tying together seemingly disparate strands in international politics: the crisis inside the European Union, deteriorating U.S.-Chinese relations, and the deadlock in global governance.

This new, more troubled mood is reflected at this year's World Economic Forum. In the 20 years before the financial crisis, Davos was almost a festival of globalization -- as political leaders from all over the world bought into the same ideas about the mutual benefits of trade and investment and wooed the same investment bankers and multinational executives. At Davos, this year, the mood is more questioning -- with numerous sessions on rethinking capitalism and on the crisis in the eurozone. The European Union is an organization built around a win-win economic logic. Europe's founding fathers believed that the nations of Europe could put centuries of conflict behind them by concentrating on mutually beneficial economic cooperation. By building a common market and tearing down barriers to trade and investment, they would all become richer -- and, eventually, would get used to working together. Good economics would make good politics. The nations of Europe would grow together.

For decades, this logic worked beautifully. But, faced with a grave economic crisis, this positive win-win logic has gone into reverse. Rather than building each other up, European nations fear that they are dragging each other down. The countries of southern Europe -- Greece, Portugal, Italy, and Spain -- increasingly feel that they are locked into a currency union with Germany that has made their economies disastrously uncompetitive. For them, European unity is no longer associated with rising prosperity. Instead, it has become a route to crippling debt and mass unemployment. As for the countries of northern Europe -- Germany, Finland, and the Netherlands -- they are increasingly resentful of having to lend billions of euros to bail out their struggling southern neighbors. They fear that they will never get the money back, and their own prosperous economies will be dragged down. Now that France has lost its AAA credit-rating, Germany is left as the only large AAA-rated country in the eurozone. Many Germans feel that they have worked hard and played by the rules -- and are now being asked to save countries where people routinely cheat on their taxes and retire in their fifties.

From the beginning of the crisis, Europe's politicians have argued that the solution to a severe crisis within the EU was "more Europe" -- deeper integration. Unfortunately, their interpretation of what this means is rather different and dictated by the singular nature of their national debates. For the southern Europeans, "more Europe" means Eurobonds -- common debt issuance by the whole European Union that would lower their interest rates and make it easier to fund their governments.. But the Germans regard this as a dangerous pledge simply to underwrite their neighbors' debts, long into the future. For them, "more Europe" means stricter enforcement of budgetary austerity from the center -- German rules for everybody.

Over the next year, this inherent contradiction is likely to cause increasing discord and rivalry within the EU as the political argument plays out against a deteriorating economic climate. Britain's refusal to go along with a new European treaty at the December 2011 Brussels summit led to screaming headlines about a continental divorce. But it is likely to be just a foretaste of things to come. The development to watch for in European politics will be the rise of political parties that are more nationalist in tone and that take a much more skeptical attitude to the European Union -- not to mention the single currency. Marine Le Pen and the National Front will do well in the upcoming French presidential election. Other rising Euroskeptic parties include the Freedom Parties in the Netherlands and Austria, the Northern League in Italy, the True Finns in Finland, and a motley collection of far-right and far-left parties in Greece.

Ironically, this intensifying crisis in Europe comes just at the time that the United States has decided to readjust its foreign policy to concentrate much more on Asia and Pacific. Although the "pivot to Asia" is being presented as a far-sighted reaction to long-term economic trends, it also represents an adjustment to a shift in the global balance-of-power in the aftermath of the global economic crisis.

Put bluntly, the United States is taking the rise of China much more seriously. American preeminence, long into the future, can no longer be taken for granted. Nor can it be assumed that a stronger, richer China is good news for America -- as successive U.S. presidents argued all the way back to 1978. On the contrary, both as individuals and as a nation, Americans are getting the queasy feeling that a richer, more powerful China might just mean a relatively poorer, relatively weaker America. In other words, the rise of China is not a win-win for both nations. It is a zero-sum game. That belief is now feeding through into the presidential election -- and is reflected both in the protectionist rhetoric of Mitt Romney and in the soft containment of China of the Obama administration.

Romney has promised to designate China a "currency manipulator" and to slap tariffs on Chinese goods. These kinds of arguments have surfaced before, particularly during presidential elections -- but they are not normally made by pro-business Republicans. However, with America beset by worries about high unemployment and a spiraling national debt, old nostrums about free trade are easier to jettison. Missed in all the excitement of a presidential election is the extent to which protectionism is being intellectually rehabilitated in the United States. Respected economists like Paul Krugman and Fred Bergsten have argued that imposing tariffs would be a legitimate U.S. response to Chinese currency policies.

A similar shift is underway in America's military and strategic thinking. The Obama administration's much-ballyhooed Asian turn is essentially a response to the rise of China. According to the Economist, China is likely to be the world's largest economy (in real terms) by 2018. And Washington sees Beijing as already flexing its muscles, with increases in military spending and a harder-line in border disputes with a range of neighbors, including India, Japan, and Vietnam. As a result, the United States is seeking to make common cause with China's nervous neighbors -- bolstering alliances with its traditional Asian allies, while committing to strengthen its own military presence in the region. This move is all the more significant since it comes in the context of a plan to make deep cuts in overall U.S. military spending.

The Chinese are not wrong to see this policy as essentially one of "soft containment." They are unlikely to respond passively. A new Chinese leadership -- under pressure from a nationalist public -- might push back hard.

American-Chinese relations have long contained elements of rivalry and co-operation. But, increasingly, the rival elements are coming to the fore. This is not yet a new cold war. However, the state of relations between the United States and China -- the sole superpower and its only plausible rival -- are likely to set the tone for international politics in the coming decade.

In fact, the increasing rivalry between Washington and Beijing is an important contributor to the third major manifestation of the spread of zero-sum logic through the international system -- the increasing deadlock in multilateral diplomacy, from the World Trade Organization (WTO) to climate-change negotiations to the G-20's stalled efforts at global financial regulation.

In the heyday of globalization over the past three decades, big trade agreements were both a symbol and a driver of the strengthening of common interests between the world's major powers. The creation of a European single market in 1992 and of a North American free-trade area in 1994, the setting-up of the WTO in 1995, and the admission of China to the WTO in 2001, were all landmarks in the creation of a truly globalized economy. But the days of heroic new trade accords are over. World leaders have stopped even calling for a completion of the Doha round of trade talks; the repeated empty exhortations have become embarrassing. There have been, however, some small victories: At the end of 2011, Congress finally passed a free-trade deal between the United States and South Korea, and Russia was admitted to the WTO around the same time. But the WTO is now largely playing defense, trying to prevent a major new outbreak of protectionism. Officials there dread the prospect of being asked to adjudicate a U.S.-Chinese dispute over currency -- fearing that any such case would be so politically charged that it could blow apart the world trading system.

It is a similar picture in other areas where there were once high hopes for multilateral cooperation. The world climate talks were saved from complete disaster in Durban, South Africa, at the end of 2011 -- but few believe that the vague and vestigial agreement reached there will have any real impact on the global problem. The G-20's efforts to push forward with new forms of global financial regulation have also disappointed. The crisis within the European Union -- which has so long seen itself as the champion of global governance -- has damaged the whole cause of multilateralism.

A few months ago, I found myself sitting next to a senior EU official who turned out to have read my book. "My job is to prove your zero-sum thesis wrong," he told me. I replied that, as an author I hoped to be proved right -- but as a European and a human being I was hoping to be proved wrong. My lunch companion laughed and said, "That is too dialectical for me."

It is one of the nice things about the best EU officials that they are happy to talk to their critics, and comfortable using words like "dialectical." However, I fear that cultured technocrats will not do terribly well in the new era. A zero-sum world may summon up rather darker forces.

 

PETER PARKS/AFP/Getty Images

 

Gideon Rachman is chief foreign-affairs commentator for the Financial Times and author of Zero-Sum Future: American Power in an Age of Anxiety, available in paperback on Feb. 4.

GOOGOOYOU

3:32 AM ET

January 25, 2012

way to plug a book, bad for credibility

When you open an article by blatantly plugging release of an upcomming paperback version of your book, you lose any sort of credibility. On the merits of contentions here, though, I'm constantly amused by these pundits who just repackage the obvious or ignore the obvious. Countries have always, let me write it again, countries have always, acted in their self-interest. Countries will continue to act in their self-interest. These interests will always be win-win and not a zero some game. It never has been zero sum games, because countries simply do not and cannot operate in isolation. Win-win does not mean that it the option isn't a lesser of two evils, but it means that countries will continue to operate to gain something that benefits itself.

I'm also constantly amused how pundits jump on the bandwagon of gloom and doom in bad times, but will be quick to flip on the utopic worldview in good times.

 

BING520

12:11 PM ET

January 25, 2012

Gideon Rachman

You made a point. Gideon Rachman did amplify the negative aspects and brush aside the promising and positive development. Sometimes we need doomsayers to remind of dangers ahead, but don't take them seriously. They do want to make people wonder if it is too late to prepare for a nuclear war now.

 

LOSPICOS

6:30 PM ET

January 30, 2012

After campaigning against

After campaigning against Beijing in 1992 elections, even Bill Clinton became enthusiastic supporter of trade with China once he took lessons in foreign policy from Nixon in early 1993 during a special Whitehouse-arranged meeting. US insurance also promoted China to a super power status by accepting it as a permanent UNSC member. Had it not been for that Nixon embrace in 1972, China’s rise to super power status would have been far slower with all the US, West European and East Asian markets closed to cheap Chinese products. Had it not been for that insurance Nixon embrace, China’s technological progress would have been far slower in the absence of West’s technology transfers. Had it not been for that Nixon embrace, China’s military progress would have been far slower in the absence of huge forex reserves that China accumulated from the massive exports of cheap Chinese products like handmade jewelry and China used those forex reserves to acquire latest military technology.Thus US embrace in 1972 if anything, has strengthened Communist Party’s hold on China by affording them to employ millions producing the goods that the world wants.

 

LAMARTINE

9:34 AM ET

January 25, 2012

The EU is not benign

You would have to have a more than working knowledge of dialectics to be an EU official. It is they and the political class in Brussels who have got Europe into this mess with a consistently appaling knowledge of basic economics and, even more worryingly, an antipathy towards democracy that makes my skin crawl. If this crisis precipitates the demise of the cultured technocrat I will not mourn his passing.

Also don't plug your book - if, as you say, your predictions came true there is no further need for it other than retrospective triumphalism tempered with an unconvincing, Cassandra-esque lamentation of how you, as a member of the human race, share in its woe.

You're spot on about protectionism though.

 

DONKISSOTES

10:32 AM ET

January 25, 2012

envious

instead of the United States would be envious of any country that can surpass strengths?

 

TERRY BRENNAN

10:20 PM ET

February 1, 2012

Wrong word

The word is not "envious", but "rivalrous".

 

ALANCHRISTOPHER

2:35 PM ET

January 25, 2012

Bad for America

The author disproves his own subtitle. China's rise is not a problem for the US. America's problem is that many US citizens don't want to see the US lose to anyone, and they will engage in actions that will harm the US instead of fixing weaknesses in American systems to improve the nation. Americans are their worst enemies.

 

ALANCHRISTOPHER

5:20 PM ET

January 25, 2012

The US Chooses Mistakes

The US has caused its own decline. Twice in this decade, US business and financial leaders proved to the whole world that they are liars, thieves, and criminals. In the US Accounting Scandal of 2002-2003, 40,000 US CEOs, CFOs, COOs, presidents, vice presidents, and senior executives lied about their profits so they could cheat corporate investors out of huge bonuses that they didn't earn. In the Financial Scandal of 2008 to the present, US financial institutions created sub-prime mortgages, made them 40% of the US mortgage market, created mortgage-backed securities for insurance, created hedge funds to bet against their own securities, coerced ratings agencies to give AAA ratings to securities that didn't deserve AAA ratings, and sold the fraudulent securities to investors around the world. Twice in this decade, the US cheated NATO, Europe, the Middle East, Asia, Pacific nations, Latin America, and the US. The US, and no one else, failed to regulate business and financial leaders in the US. The second major cause are the wars. For 10 years the US has destroyed its computers, cell phones, digital cameras, and fertilizer, the basic parts of smart munitions. The US has destroyed its ground and air vehicles. The US has burned billions of gallons of gasoline, diesel fuel, and aviation fuel. The US has wasted billions of man hours in unproductive activities. The US chose to engage in these activities, and the US is responsible for this waste of US resources. The third major cause is Homeland Security. Prior to 9-11, 60% of scientists, engineers, and technicians came from Asia. After 9-11, Homeland Security was established and it restricted visas for Asians to the point that increasing numbers of the intelligent, skilled persons set up companies in Asian countries to compete against US companies, and more Asian scientists followed their lead rather than try for US visas. US technology companies moved to Asia for talent because they could not be certain that Homeland Security would let enough scientific talent into the US. The US is solely responsible for the decisions of Homeland Security and for the losses that the US suffered as individuals and companies took actions to overcome US restrictions. The fourth major cause is education. 13% of US students major in science, engineering, and technology compared to 50% in China. With the difference in population, China produces 17 times as many students in the sciences as the US. In an international test, China scored 1st in math and 1st in science while the US was 31st in math and 23rd in science. US students are responsible for their choices of subjects and for their studying. The US is defeating itself in its choices. The fifth major cause is US sanctions. The US has chosen to trade with 50% of the world. The US says that other countries are bad. The US consists of slave owners, Jim Crow enforcers, and genocidal mass murderers of native Americans. Without being critical of the US, all countries have skeletons in their closets. China chooses to trade with 100% of the world and accepts that countries must correct any defects at their own pace. The US has chosen to lose the trade competition with China, and this is the result of US choices to respond to the behavior of other countries. The five major US choices, and their consequences, were caused by the US. The one bright spot is that the US can choose to change its choices for the future.

 

BING520

4:06 PM ET

January 26, 2012

Alan

I agree with you on many points, but I think you overstate the significance of the test scores by Chinese students. When the scores came, the first group of people to dispute the validity of test scores are Chinese officials and think tanks. The problem with the test is that it took place at elite schools in Shanghai. All the students tested were told in advance that they represented the whole country and the national prestige hinged upon their performance. These students took it very seriously. Chinese official unprecedently made public statements to discount the result and cautioned that China still has a long way to go to improve its overall quality of education.

I have worked with many Chinese in China before. I was often amazed by the huge gap between a bright engineer and everage office workers. One thing is for sure, which is all were extremely diligent, worked hard and rarely complained about workload I put on them.

 

GARVAGH

6:46 PM ET

January 28, 2012

America causes own problems

AlanChristopher - - Even China points out that the US injures itself by spending for too much money on "defence". Year after year after year.

 

MARTY MARTEL

3:49 PM ET

January 25, 2012

Win for China, Loose for America/Europe

The Win-Win world has turned into a Win-Loose world for America and Europe.

It is a Win for China and loose for America/Europe.

Nixon-Kissinger’s 1972 China embrace has come back to haunt U. S.

China was a pariah country in the world just like today’s North Korea until Nixon’s 1972 visit. All the West European and East Asian countries stayed away from China following the US lead until 1972 and embraced China after Nixon’s visit. While US would not give MFN status to Soviet Union (remember Jackson-Vanik amendment?) unless Russia shed Communism, it had no problem giving it to China’s Communist dictators with a capitalist mask. Trade with China expanded by leaps and bounds during 12 years of Republican rule beginning in 1981. After campaigning against butchers of Beijing in 1992 elections, even Bill Clinton became enthusiastic supporter of trade with China once he took lessons in foreign policy from Nixon in early 1993 during a special Whitehouse-arranged meeting. US also promoted China to a super power status by accepting it as a permanent UNSC member.

Had it not been for that Nixon embrace in 1972, China’s rise to super power status would have been far slower with all the US, West European and East Asian markets closed to cheap Chinese products. Had it not been for that Nixon embrace, China’s technological progress would have been far slower in the absence of West’s technology transfers. Had it not been for that Nixon embrace, China’s military progress would have been far slower in the absence of huge forex reserves that China accumulated from the massive exports of cheap Chinese products and China used those forex reserves to acquire latest military technology.

Thus US embrace in 1972 if anything, has strengthened Communist Party’s hold on China by affording them to employ millions producing the goods that the world wants.

Now China has US by the tail - US businesses are hooked to huge profits that cheap Chinese products generate for them as a walk through any Walmart, Home Depot, Sears and Macy’s filled with Chinese goods prove and US government is hooked to huge investments that China makes in US treasuries from the sales of cheap Chinese products to US businesses.

Little could Mao or Deng have imagined that by wearing a capitalist mask, their followers will beat capitalists at their own game. Lenin used to say that ’capitalists will sell us the ropes with which we will hang them’. With West selling such proverbial ropes in the form of technology transfers, Chinese Communists have proven that Lenin saying quite prophetic.

 

VID BELDAVS

4:34 PM ET

January 27, 2012

Had it not been for Bush II's tax cuts for the rich

The Bush II tax cuts resulted in a flow of investment to China as money sought the highest rates of return. Billions were invested in production in China which moved millions of jobs from the US to China. Bush II's "Ownership Society" stimulated a boom in real estate that provided an illusion of economic vitality while the industrial base of the country was gutted to make the rich richer. The Bush II War on Iraq sapped the country further but the force feeding of the housing sector drew away the visible pain. Then, in 2008 the bubble burst and the US woke up with a new superpower in Asia breathing down its neck. The win - lose struggle, however, took place not between nations but between the rich and the middle class. The rich got richer still through their investments in China while the middle class lost millions of jobs. Bush II far more than Confucius deserves a very large statue in Tiananmen sqauare from the thankful leaders of China.

 

HECTORGREG11

12:40 AM ET

January 29, 2012

talk about pessimistic

This is one of the most pessismistic articles and responses I have read in a very long time. Lets hope that this does not last forever though plumber west palm beach to the rescue.

 

IAMTHECEO

5:51 PM ET

January 25, 2012

agreed

Well we can no longer start a war based on lies orchestrated by AIPAC. If China is trading with that country, they consider that an act of war against them. Gideon Rachman did amplify the negative aspects and brush aside the promising and positive development. Sometimes we need doomsayers to remind of dangers ahead, but don't take them seriously.

zero energy design

 

SPOOD

11:17 PM ET

January 25, 2012

 

SQUEEK

7:40 PM ET

January 25, 2012

Soft Containment

What similarities do U.S.-Chinese relations have to U.S.-Soviet relations following WW2? Few. The 'containment strategy' against the latter quickly turned into a militarized arms race and proxy wars. Over 52% of current foreign arms sales are attributed to the U.S.; Russia is a far-away second at less than 20%. China barely registers on the scale.

China completed its first aircraft carrier last year. The US has 12. A few other countries have one or two. China has no foreign military bases but is considering its first in, of all places, Pakistan - in order to address its own 'terrorist' problems in western China. Outside invasion of China has dominated its history, culminating with the Chinese 'conceding' prime coastal territories to Western powers from the early 1800s to 1949. In modern times, China has invaded no other country, even as it has hung onto Tibet and other areas that traditionally were in the Chinese orbit or 'near frontier' and considered within its 'imperial domain'.

So what is 'soft containment trying to do? What are we trying to 'contain' China from doing? Where are we trying to prevent China from going? China and countries with which it has border/territorial disputes have pledged to work them out peacefully. Decades of U.S. arms sales to Taiwan have not provoked Chinese military action, even while South Korea is home to over 50,000 American troops near the Chinese border.

The U.S. may have been a stabilizing force in East Asia following WW2. But today, East Asian countries are mature and independent enough to solve their own regional problems. The US should be working with China and other East Asian nations in support of regional efforts to resolve regional problems with the aim of demilitarizing the area and American troop withdrawal.

Yes, China is a worthy competitor. Yes, the US and China will find themselves comopeting for the same energy sources in the future. They are and will continue to collaborate, however, on developing new and renewable sources of energy - with clean coal technology and others - that will be vital to human existence in the future.

Therefore, if U.S creativity in foreign relations and strategic affairs continues to be filtered through the obsolete world-views of the past, we are doomed. That is the flaw in Mr. Rachman's article.

 

TOMHE

8:55 PM ET

January 25, 2012

Fear is a bad counselor

You failed to put all your little conflicts in a perspective – we are in one of the most terrifying economic crisis. All relations, including US-China , US-EU, EU-China, etc, are under strain. If world economy continues to improve, the conflicts you observed will become transit feelings. But, if you let your fear constantly grip your mind, the world will fall. Fear is a bad counselor.

 

MITTAL

12:15 PM ET

January 26, 2012

Very bad luck for those who malign China

one minute you are a darling,

http://images.smh.com.au/2011/11/04/2750718/art-gillard-420x0.jpg

next you run like a rat

http://news.yahoo.com/photos/australian-pm-caught-in-rowdy-protest-1327591467-slideshow/

China in continuous existence since 3000BC as an identified ethnic group, China outnumber whether in this world or the next one beyond.

People do not forget an insult nor injury, whether living or dead.

 

VERMICIOUS KNID

3:32 PM ET

January 30, 2012

So....

You're implying that Chinese ancestor spirits somehow incited a small but rowdy crowd of aborigine rights protestors to...cause a minor fracas?

If thats the best they can do...

 

FREETRADER

10:41 PM ET

February 5, 2012

@ Mittal

Oh, I'm so scared of Chinese ghosts in the afterlife! I'll never "insult" China now!

Actually, were I Qin Xi Huandi, Mao Zedong, Li Peng, or any other blood-soaked Chinese tyrant, I would be a lot more worried about what awaited me in the afterlife (assuming one believes in one) than with any supposed insult the the Chinese (who, according to Mittal, are superior because they are so numerous - which must mean that bacteria are the most superior beings in world). If you live a life of tyranny and mass murder, you are most certainly not going to get a chance to 'revenge' much of anything in any afterlife...

 

SETTUSURF

9:34 AM ET

January 27, 2012

Global Economic Rise Down

Yes seriously globe economic change dramatically around the world. Rich get Richer and Poor get poorer strange but true. ebook conversion

 

BURMABOY

10:51 AM ET

January 27, 2012

There are some winners

Winners on the US side of this zero sum game:

1. Large MNCs with record profits
2. A few large US banks
3. Consumers got cheaper goods, lower inflation. However....

Losers:
1. Consumers have no jobs, so no money to buy the cheaper goods. 20-30 million lost jobs.

Winners on China side of equation:
1. Several hundred million workers moved from farm to urban jobs, tremendous growth in per capita GDP.
2. Fastest growth in wealth of a large size economy in world history.
So about 1. 5 billion population are benefiting.

 

GYPSYSNIPE

12:54 PM ET

January 27, 2012

reap wat we sow

We have financed our own demise. The PLA owns most industries, and our greed has/will come back to haunt us. The damage can be reversed. Obama mentioned China a few times, and their manipulation of their currency, the counterfeit goods they dump here, all has to stop.

 

GARVAGH

7:43 PM ET

January 27, 2012

China can help bring global stability, or preserve it

I agree with Zbigniew Brzezinski that China can help bring stability to the world. I was glad to see China state clearly last week that China does not want Iran armed with nukes. And that China wants a negotiated solution to the dispute.

I agree with "Zbig" that Obama should not have put 2500 marines into Australia.

US has steadily weakened itself with foolish squandering of hundreds of billions of dollars on unnecessary "defence" spending, year after year.

 

XTIANGODLOKI

10:41 AM ET

January 30, 2012

It's always a win/win for some

Otherwise there wouldn't be any incentives for two entities to conduct any type of business. There are plenty of businesses going on between China and the US, so some people from both sides must benefit mutually. The fact that the monetary benefits from Sino-US relationship doesn't trickle down to the average American well has more to do with America's domestic policies than China doing. China will not be able to force the owners of Walmarts to share the extraordinary profits which they have gathered because of China with the rest of the Americans, or force the top 1% (many who have gotten rich off China's rise) to hire more Americans. It's American politicians' job to do the domestic balancing.

If the author is arguing about the prospect of long term grow and job loss with China in play, then EU/Brazil/India's rise would cause problems for the US too. Afterall, American workers are not competing only with the Chinese but literally every work around the world.

 

WILHELM RODGERS BENELUX COMMERCIAL PARTNERS

11:01 AM ET

January 30, 2012

EU - What's next?

Maybe the dream of building a European Union based only on a win-win logic was just that, a dream. However, there was only one way to find out. Today, ten years later, we are in the midst of understanding the deep issues that this economic and inevitably political union has brought to its member countries, and we could soon find ourselves on the verge of debacle.
Regarding Germany, I think in some way Europe's largest economy did set the rules during the last few years given its strong political influence on the ECB and other institutions; but, on the other hand, they have a great deal at stake.
I ask myself whether European countries are ready to face the zero-sum world and what you call the "darker forces"... Again, there is only one way to find out!

 

VERMICIOUS KNID

3:40 PM ET

January 30, 2012

Yep, our traitorous elite sold us out

Sending factories to China...technology transfers... using immigrants to take over and cheapen the jobs that can't be outsourced.... all so that they could have 8 homes instead of 5.

The hollowing out of the real economy in the US was disguised for a long time by massive debt...but now that has failed...the emperor turns out to be naked after all.

 

KIMCODE

5:57 PM ET

January 30, 2012

Human industry

Yeah.. China isn't about politics but related with human industry and ideology

 

BRADLEYESPINOSA

5:50 AM ET

January 31, 2012

human industry

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BRADLEYESPINOSA

5:52 AM ET

January 31, 2012

this is it

Data entry specialist needed....MakeCash10.com

 

DONKISSOTES

1:28 AM ET

February 1, 2012

 

DONKISSOTES

1:29 AM ET

February 1, 2012

great country

china, large country with a great future

 

LTLEE

9:26 AM ET

February 2, 2012

""What was good for China would be seen as bad for America. "

A simple thought experiment on the zero sum thesis.
Economic depression in the US is bad for America. Such depression would be good China.
The author is not making sense.

 

DOPPER0189

5:37 PM ET

February 5, 2012

Your missing secondary benefits of China's rise

One overlooked factor about China's rise is the effect China is having on resource rich developing Nations. Yes we pay a lot of attention to US v. China trade, and inter Europe trade. But think about this:

China's rise has driven up the price of natural resources this more than anything has helped drive Brazil's rapid growth. New growing trade between the USA and Brazil is really because China has given Brazil more money. Yes Brazil has also managed this new money fairly well (unlike Venezuela, Iran, or to a lesser extend Argentina) but it's because of China. The fact that Canadian tar sands are now economically important is thanks to Chinese (and Indian) consumption.

China's rising consumption is most likely going to pull 3-7 African nations from poverty into the middle income level over the next 15 years (Angola, Ghana, Mozambique, Gabon, Botswana, Equatorial Guiana, Kenya) depending on how they manage their new money. That will in the long term increase trade between them and the US/EU.

The greatest drag on world growth is actually the Arab (and Persian) worlds inability to build a modern economy beyond fossils fuels. If you removed petroleum and petroleum byproducts (natural gas, basic chemicals, etc) out of the equation almost 390 million middle easterners (Arabs + Iran) only produce as much as 39 million Spaniards (and Spain is in bad shape) that is astounding and sad. Bring the Middle East's non oil economy "only" up to the level of Mexico and the you would realize enormous growth opportunities. My hope is that the Arab spring will move the Middle East if not to democracies at least to something in between Turkey and Malaysia.

Swinging back to China the biggest issue is their currency manipulation. If we're not going to deal with it, has anyone at least thought about creating a framework to prevent another large poor nation (Bangladesh, Nigeria, etc) from eventually trying to copy it?